Forum - View topicFunimation Addresses Prison School Dub Comments Over Gamergate Line
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Johan Eriksson 9003
Posts: 281 |
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It's not about what anyone "should" do, it's about what makes sense or not. It makes sense to change a line that is tied to cultural idioms. They didn't HAVE to change that but it makes sense that they did, and blowing up about it for ridiculously childish.
The ENTIRE situation is a joke. Do you really not see that? The whole point of the scene is that the girl is scolding the boy while he is too distracted by her cleavage to listen. The only change is that they took a jab at GG instead of using a Japanese idiom. And restricting translators to when they can or can't throw in an extra joke is just dumb. It was no oversight, and the fact that they got so much hate over kind of proves their point.
Then why the hell are you so damn protective over this in the first place? Why did you but in with an argument about how this supposedly opens up the door for them to change EVERY minor line into jokes or pop-culture references. That shows some seriously paranoid thinking.[/quote] |
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Just-another-face
Posts: 324 |
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And I'm saying it won't happen, because we still speak English here. So unless the whole of the United States wants to forego caring about the primary language they speak, read and write in, there will continue to be English dubs, whether you like it or not (and as you've stated, you don't like it). By the way, I wasn't referring to ANN when I said "folks here", I was referring to North America.
Uh, yes it is. It's your opinion. |
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Lili-Hime
 Posts: 569 |
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I prefer dubs, so here goes. 1. I prefer to hear anime adapted to my native language, and spoken in my native language. As long as the acting is average, hearing words spoken in my native language has more emotional impact for me. I know what 'anata o daikirai' mean without looking at subs, but hearing someone say 'I hate you' is going to be instinctively more emotional for me. 2. I usually can watch anime on a 2nd screen while working. Dubs allow me to keep up with what's going on without having to look at the screen every second. This is also useful when I'm doing housework, dishes, cooking, etc... 3. There are no words at the bottom of the screen cluttering up the beautiful artwork, so I can focus more on the visuals. 4. Dubs are more universal, and allow me to introduce shows to friends that aren't huge anime fans. They are more likely to watch the show if there's a dub, and less likely to dismiss it based on it being 'too Japanese'. 5. I don't find Japanese humor very funny- like, at all. I'd much rather hear cultural references, Japanese language puns, and the like removed and replaced with jokes I'd actually laugh at. Panty and Stocking is much, much better in the dub than the sub for this reason. 6. Some shows have a very western setting, and it's distracting as a native English speaker to hear Japanese spoken in shows like Cowboy Bebop, Trigun, or Record of Lodoss War. (I also prefer subs for distinctly Japanese settings like Rurouni Kenshin & Evangelion, however.) 7. Nostalgia. Shows like Ranma, Tenchi Muyo, and Sailor Moon may have had flawed dubs; but that's how I remember them and that's (usually) how I like to watch them. 8. Really bad dubs can make a show funnier to me. I love corny stuff, and old ADV dubs usually make me laugh just by virtue of how badly overacted they are. 9. Voice differentiation. Being a native English speaker, it's far easier for me to distinguish between character voices if I look away from the screen for a second (or if a character is speaking off camera). You may disagree, but a subjective taste is just that; subjective. Please don't argue that I'm wrong, I'm only answering your question. If dub acting or writing is really, really bad I'll turn to the sub but otherwise I usually watch things dubbed. Also people remember that anime is still just Japanese cartoons and often times is not the best written material, regardless of language. Prison School isn't Shakespeare we're talking about here. It isn't even something like Psycho Pass, Ghost in the Shell, FMA or Cowboy Bebop. Also dub vs sub has been a moot argument since DVD came around; you can have both, you don't have to choose. The only time you'd be forced to watch sub is when there's no simuldub and you just HAVE to watch it week to week (and I don't care for watching shows week to week unless it's something I really can't wait for like an Ikuhara show). |
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anii23
Posts: 8 |
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Japanese idioms are not jokes. It was not originally a jab at some 2ch internet fiasco. It was not some jab at some japanese tea party like politics thing or whatever, she didn't even call him a bunch of names. It was just a normal line. It's pretty clear many people are usually not happy with that kind of localization, other than in special case shows.
These donuts sure are delicious.
Why are you protective over the scriptwriter's bad decision? It's not paranoia really, I'm just stating a fact that this was damaging to Funi's reputation and people will be less trustworthy of their localization work in the future (even if not that much), and as others have said, it's another one in a line of dubbing decisions that fanbases have had problems with. It's not like dubs have such a great reputation to begin with, even if they have gotten better since the older days. Every mistake counts. And you yourself just said "restricting translators to when they can or can't throw in an extra joke is just dumb", so you seem pretty alright with opening that door. |
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anii23
Posts: 8 |
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We're not talking about the whole Unites States here. We're talking about the niche who watches anime. And that niche is getting overwhelmingly comfortable with watching subtitled shows, due to their immediacy, both in time, distribution, and cost. Most of them don't know or care that simuldubs exists, because why would they watch dubs at all? they haven't become accustomed to them like people who grew up with them on Toonami as kids have. It's like a videogame not being on Steam to them. I'll bring up Shingeki and Jojo again, they didn't need dubs to take over the western anime sphere. It's not like the DBZ days. And I never said I don't like dubs. |
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DuchessBianca
 Posts: 562 |
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You make some good points but sadly NA playing catch-up has always been the case. This massive streaming boom even though it's always been there hasn't really kicked off to the extent it has until recently, while I agree that to an extent that NA companies should have started it a bit sooner I wouldn't call it them going above an beyond, the main reasons why is as I've stated. Physical media while far from close to being niche can't be the sole funding/source of dubs going forward as more people are viewing online or are younger and can't afford to buy dvd sets to watch a dub. As to your paragraph on streaming while there are some merits it's only looking at one side of it. When you talk about years ago NA anime consumers for the most part had no real mainstream way of watching anime until it was released on dvd. Sure fansubs, and stuff like that existed but the vast majority just waited, if you go back even before the 2000's the situation is even more so. Now almost every anime is available for viewing online almost instantly after it airs in japan. I forgot to address it in one of your previous replies but you mentioned that popular shows like KLK and such didn't need a dub to become popular or known in NA, while I wont dispute that, the part that your overlooking is that the only way to watch those animes originally was to watch it subbed, even the many people who prefer dubs if they wanted to watch it it was subs or nothing same as most anime out there so it's not really a good way to measure popularity of dubs. Its not a perfect example but if you take youtube video views when comparing official sub videos to the dub video's counterparts the dub video usually has more views despite the fact that it was released much later. The only real and fair way to be able to judge which would be more popular is if the sub and dubbed version of an anime were released at around the same time which is why we come back to why simuldubs are a good thing. Going forward how funimation and other companies start simuldubbing will play a large factor in how things work because like we've both said people want anime now not later so until more shows are dubbed around when the sub version airs people will be forced to watch it subbed even if they prefer dubs because the only alternative is waiting. The part on the revenue and tight schedules is very true though but simuldubbing is a VERY new concept and something that will need to be worked on going forward.
The user Lili-Hime did a pretty good write up of many reasons why one might prefer dubs, while it's not 100% my exact feelings it general explains them and their line " Also people remember that anime is still just Japanese cartoons" is very true. I'd go a step further and just say that the whole point of anime is entertainment, there is no wrong way to watch something if your are enjoying it, it's why I still can't understand that in 2015 people are still arguing and attacking each other because they enjoy watching originally voiceless, fictional drawings in a different language then others. 
Last edited by DuchessBianca on Sun Oct 04, 2015 5:08 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Just-another-face
Posts: 324 |
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Well I was speaking about the United States because Funimation is a North American distributor. We're not just talking about groups on websites like ANN, we're talking about everyone who lives on this continent that speaks English and purchases localized anime from them. A majority of people will tell you they prefer hearing anime and games in their native language. Most will admit that they don't really like hearing it in a language they can't/don't understand or follow at all (and Japanese has more nuances than English, so subtitles can't explain everything no matter how "flawless" the translation comes across).
But you stated earlier that, "Most people don't buy BDs, I sure as hell am not going to be watching most dubs, so this doesn't affect me at all." So what did you mean by "most dubs" then? Which dubs have you actually seen, for example, that you're okay with or prefer to the Japanese audio? |
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JuanTheBone
Posts: 3 |
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Your seniors in school(be one year or more) demanding more respect out of the younger students is not solely Japanese. In fact its pretty damn American, it has been a staple cliche in western tv shows and movies for decades. Whether we are talking about The Wonder Years, Freaks and Geeks or the countless college and high school movies since the 80s.
If Family Guy can parody it, we are not talking about a foreign concept. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8GDh1FDXME Arguing the line couldn't be translated is silly. |
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Galap
Moderator
 Posts: 2354 |
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This is the main one for me. Why would I want to engage in experiencing a work of visual art but have to look at text instead? It's not that bad most of the time, and I can read pretty fast and have trained myself through experience to have reading subs not be an issue for the most part, but why not avoid the problem if I could? |
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Actar
 Posts: 1074 Location: Singapore |
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Yup. Thanks for the information! Really appreciate the nuanced response. While I don't agree with some of the points that you raised, I can certainly respect them. The main one being:
...where I'd prefer accuracy over a better quality product. In fact, just like I had argued in a previous post, if the changes are too numerous, they shouldn't be billed as the same show.
Well, I think it's just a simple matter of people seeing different value in different things. Honestly, just because anime might not be the best written material out there, doesn't mean that it's not worthy of our time and attention. In fact, I'd argue that the term "best written" itself is subjective in its own right. (^.^;) |
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DuchessBianca
Posts: 562 |
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Sorry that was a misquote on my part, my intention was to say that Lili-hime was correct in saying that at the end of the day the anime we all love is still just cartoons and are for entertainment and there's no wrong way to watch it regardless of what language one is viewing it in I've one of the least critical people out there and have enjoyed the story to basically every anime I've watched and there's no other story telling medium I love more
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enurtsol
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This one comes down to business. What's the point of business to put out something that they know isn't going to sell? If it's an individual acquisition, then they shouldn't have acquired it in the first place. But if it's a package deal for something they like to acquire that they cannot refuse to also take in something they don't want, then what's the point of taking a financial loss and not do something permitted to make it sell. It's business.
But ya can't separate American companies prioritizing American consumers. Most of their sales are still in America. |
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Set1229
 Posts: 146 Location: Pittsburgh |
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Lili-hime is right. Sometimes, cheesy can make comedies even funnier. Anyone else here listen to cheesy bad dubs for laughter? I do. If it entertains us, that is good, because some anime are meant to well... entertain. Realistic acting does not equal better. That makes it hard to entertain as much, for some comedies to be realistic during, the whole time.
BTW, lovely pic, Lili-hime. Very artsy. 
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Rivailloli
 Posts: 562 Location: Virginia |
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And this is why I don't waste my time with dubs.
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blimble
Posts: 3 |
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Looking at Tyson Rhinehart's twitter the guy really seems like a piece of work
Right? Who would've guessed that guys who couldn't get a girlfriend would be part of the show's demographic? #PrisonSchool https://twitter.com/AttackonTyson/status/647099364125442049?lang=en Like really? You are going to insult people who like the show and want to support anime coming to the west and thus paying your wage? You are going to insult the work as a whole going it's just for loser virgins (of course guys in relationships never look at porn  )? Never mind it must be all guys who dislike the changes I make! The line change is just stupid and not needed, but I don't want to support a company that insults me.
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