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The Mike Toole Show - The Poll Vault


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angelmcazares
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Joined: 23 Sep 2010
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2016 2:08 pm Reply with quote
That was a very informative read Mike; thank you. I have never heard of rec.arts.anime, but it is cool that fans were forming online communities 25 years ago. I imagine that the movie category was the first one revealed because in those days fans considered anime movies more important than anime series. I assume that in modern times the latter are more important to fans.

And speaking of anime movies, I am surprised to not see Akira winning top movie in the RAA poll/awards. I have assumed that Akira has always been beloved by many anime fans.
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Swissman



Joined: 11 May 2006
Posts: 491
Location: Switzerland
PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2016 2:50 pm Reply with quote
Ahh, usenet... I miss it. I haven't been part of rec.arts.anime's heyday in the early to mid-nineties, as I only discovered the newsgroup in the late nineties, but I took great pleasure reading some of the members' fun messages and analysis of new anime afterwards. If I had been a member during the popularity poll's run, I'd probably also have chosen Wings of Honneamise as my number 1 pick for movies back then and Ayukawa as my favorite female character (though, Nadia was a close second). That's how old-school I am.

Another great place on usenet for me was the french newsgroup fr.rec.anime, which had sometimes hilarious drama between well-knowledgeable fans (some of them wrote for fanzines and commercial magazines, others were even involved in manga publishing) and some newbies who had the nerve to copy & paste complete articles onto their crappy homepages without the authors' consent.

Usenet was a fascinating place. Without it, we wouldn't have Mike Reed's description of flame warriors (a must read) today. Too bad usenet newsgroups began to decline after 2002/3.
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0nsen



Joined: 01 Nov 2014
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2016 3:38 pm Reply with quote
Polls are kinda silly if you cannot make sure that everyone voting has seen every anime that can be voted on.
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Sahmbahdeh



Joined: 05 May 2015
Posts: 532
PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2016 4:55 pm Reply with quote
0nsen wrote:
Polls are kinda silly if you cannot make sure that everyone voting has seen every anime that can be voted on.

Hardly; not only is that unrealistic, it misses the point of polls. A poll's most useful ability in these regards is actually to gauge popularity, not quality. And if people don't vote for a show because they haven't seen it, well, that's an indicator of popularity in and of itself.
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DerekL1963
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Joined: 14 Jan 2015
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 30, 2016 11:31 pm Reply with quote
o.0 Mike, were even on Usenet back then?

There was indeed a centralized list of groups (other than the alt.* groups), and there were moderated groups as well. In the same way, though r.a.a might have died off in the late 90's, that's certainly not true of Usenet in general. (Though not universally true, some groups are quite lively even today, that wouldn't happen until after the turn of the century.)
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the green death
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 10:57 am Reply with quote
I was never on rec.arts.anime but spent way too much time on rec.arts.drwho. Fun times.
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0nsen



Joined: 01 Nov 2014
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 12:13 pm Reply with quote
Sahmbahdeh wrote:
0nsen wrote:
Polls are kinda silly if you cannot make sure that everyone voting has seen every anime that can be voted on.

Hardly; not only is that unrealistic, it misses the point of polls. A poll's most useful ability in these regards is actually to gauge popularity, not quality. And if people don't vote for a show because they haven't seen it, well, that's an indicator of popularity in and of itself.

You don't need polls to figure out popularity. Without having seen any polls I can go as far back as the early 80s and tell you on the top of my head which anime were popular and which weren't. In Japan. Other regions don't matter to me.

But popularity is useless if you've seen everything popular already and are searching for overlooked good stuff. That's why polls are silly.
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Stampeed Valkyrie



Joined: 10 Aug 2014
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Location: PA
PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 12:35 pm Reply with quote
lol damn I'm old.. between this and the 20 year anniversary of Nadesico article.. way to make me feel my age.


Good times.. I never really got into Usenet, and other newsgroups until I got into College in 1997. However I did frequent alot of the old bbs setups that were pre internet.. And Yes there was a world before the internet!

Seeing titles like Macross Plus, DYRL, Patlabor, Slayers... good times!
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Touma



Joined: 29 Aug 2007
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Location: Colorado, USA
PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 7:03 pm Reply with quote
From the article:
Quote:
KOR's Madoka Ayukawa; like I'm fond of saying, Ayukawa was the original Dokes.

Who, or what, is "Dokes"?
I do not remember ever hearing the name, or word, and nothing that I found with Google seems to fit. I doubt that he was referring to the boxer.

I was talking about anime on Usenet, but I did not get started until the early '00s.
And I spent most of my time on rec.arts.anime-misc, rather than RAA. I probably used RAAM for only a few years before I switched to web forums.
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silentjay



Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Posts: 298
PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 9:00 pm Reply with quote
Touma wrote:
From the article:
Quote:
KOR's Madoka Ayukawa; like I'm fond of saying, Ayukawa was the original Dokes.

Who, or what, is "Dokes"?


Dokes, short for Madoka.

Mike's statement is that when you say Madoka now, it brings to mind a different character than it did then.
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Touma



Joined: 29 Aug 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 9:07 pm Reply with quote
Thank you, silentjay.
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Joe Mello



Joined: 31 May 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2016 9:29 pm Reply with quote
0nsen wrote:
But popularity is useless if you've seen everything popular already and are searching for overlooked good stuff. That's why polls are silly.

Are you really that opposed to fun?

Yes, polls are good at gauging popularity, and it does measure quality to some extent as well, but it's mostly about starting a conversation. There's a little bit of tastemaking, but it's about supporting your guys (or girls or what have you) and if you can't share your anime fandom with other anime fans, then what the hell are we all doing here?
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grouwl



Joined: 12 Jun 2013
Posts: 66
PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2016 4:18 am Reply with quote
Wow Mike, that show really brought me back...I've seen all that stuff...ON TAPE!! BACK IN THE 90'S!! now that's all translated and officially released, I wonder if half the current anime fandom barely remembers it, or know it at all...

Those were the times...Madoka didn't need all that silly overexposure of KEIJO!!! to steal your heart away Smile

Those were the times, young'uns'
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Alan45
Village ElderVillage Elder


Joined: 25 Aug 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2016 7:10 am Reply with quote
Yes, but Madoka could show some skin on occasion:

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/f0/f0/75/f0f075be25bbbf5464ed2dbc6658ce2a.jpg

She also smoked at the beginning of the show and drank a fair amount during the run. Interesting behavior for a 15 year old girl. Cool
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Ouran High School Dropout



Joined: 28 Jun 2015
Posts: 160
Location: Somewhere in MA
PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2016 12:45 pm Reply with quote
Stampeed Valkyrie wrote:
lol damn I'm old.. between this and the 20 year anniversary of Nadesico article.. way to make me feel my age.

You and me both! Laughing

Stampeed Valkyrie wrote:
Good times.. I never really got into Usenet, and other newsgroups until I got into College in 1997.

I just missed this phase in anime fandom, not getting the bug until the late 90s and missing the era of fansubs entirely. For me, the big industry push at the time was the transition from licensed VHS to bilingual DVDs (yay!) Still, I do have fond memories of Usenet, but on rec.games.frp.dnd.
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