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The List - 7 Brother-Sister Romances That Went Too Far


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Mad_Scientist
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 7:10 pm Reply with quote
Morry wrote:
Uhhh, that Yosuga no Sora summary is pretty inaccurate since the story does the multi-verse route approach, so the "incest" arc doesn't involve him screwing every other girl beforehand.


Oh thanks goodness I was scared for a moment I was the only person who noticed this, which I'm not sure what it would have said about me.

Still slightly scared that I know this.
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wastrel





PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 8:02 pm Reply with quote
Mad_Scientist wrote:
Morry wrote:
Uhhh, that Yosuga no Sora summary is pretty inaccurate since the story does the multi-verse route approach, so the "incest" arc doesn't involve him screwing every other girl beforehand.


Oh thanks goodness I was scared for a moment I was the only person who noticed this, which I'm not sure what it would have said about me.

What it says about you is that you watch anime for enjoyment rather than as part of your job, so that you actually pay attention to what's going on.

I almost feel sorry for ANN reviewers sometimes, when it's clear they're having to review shows that they obviously abhor.
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nargun



Joined: 29 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:09 am Reply with quote
Or: talking about "what about the healthy relationships" is like talking about "but some people *want* to be killed: we should have a more nuanced view on 'murder' rather than this blanket condemnation".
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Catsplay



Joined: 24 Sep 2015
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 3:34 am Reply with quote
nargun wrote:
Or: talking about "what about the healthy relationships" is like talking about "but some people *want* to be killed: we should have a more nuanced view on 'murder' rather than this blanket condemnation".


Comparing this topic to murder is ridiculous. You just destroyed any reasonable argument you could have possibly presented.
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Slashman



Joined: 26 Dec 2015
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 9:04 am Reply with quote
HeeroTX wrote:

They make it VERY clear that BOTH Manami & Kirino feel that the other one has been "in their way" for a very long time.


That's not a confession. And she's had years to say how she feels. She's supposedly the mature one.

Quote:
I would argue that Manami does EVERYTHING possible, including spoiler[trying to help ANY other option] to prevent the incest route simply because she knows how difficult that will be for Kyosuke and cares for him enough that she doesn't want him to go through that. (even if he's not with her)


Again that is NOT a confession of your true feelings. Did you ever form relationships based on who your grandparents thought it would be cute for you to marry? WTF?

Again...the almost exact same situation from Monogatari. "I'll help you fight off dangerous aberrations, use my superior knowledge to get you through being turned into a vampire and play the best friend while NEVER actually confronting you with how I feel. I'll just quietly brood about it and let you lead me around by the nose."

During the years when Kirino and Kyosuke had minimal contact she had more than her fair share of chances to confess her feelings. So I'm sorry...I still have no sympathy for Manami.
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ANN_Lynzee
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 10:27 am Reply with quote
wastrel wrote:
Mad_Scientist wrote:
Morry wrote:
Uhhh, that Yosuga no Sora summary is pretty inaccurate since the story does the multi-verse route approach, so the "incest" arc doesn't involve him screwing every other girl beforehand.


Oh thanks goodness I was scared for a moment I was the only person who noticed this, which I'm not sure what it would have said about me.

What it says about you is that you watch anime for enjoyment rather than as part of your job, so that you actually pay attention to what's going on.

I almost feel sorry for ANN reviewers sometimes, when it's clear they're having to review shows that they obviously abhor.


Whoa, what? Listen, I wasn't jumping in on this tidbit but I guess I'll go ahead.

I'm aware that Yotsuga no Sora treats each route as if they happen separately so the fact that the main male protagonist sleeps with each girl in her route doesn't affect the preceding/future partners. It kinda doesn't change that, as a viewer, you've watched him go through each "route" prior to the sister route.

The List also isn't a review column and it's not very often that I have to sit down and force myself to watch something to write it. The vast majority are things I've watched entirely on my own time. I come up with my own topics and entries so no one is actually assigning me anything outside of having a column written up each week.

Readers don't always react positively towards my occasional editorial commentary, especially when it sounds like I'm ribbing something at its expense instead of writing a 100% super-nuanced plot synopsis. The same thing often happens when I leave out spoilers I have knowledge of but would require me to write an additional 400+ words for one entry. I leave it out and inevitably someone comes into the forum to tell me how well actually it's this.
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Morry



Joined: 26 Jun 2016
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 10:53 am Reply with quote
In all fairness, your summary implies that Haruka's aware of these previous routes, hence the "loaded" decision he makes to pursue his sister. When the reality is it's one of many independent possibilities. If you wanted to make it clear that the viewer has seen this play out, you could've reworded it as "This becomes troublesome for Haruka, who we've already seen sleep with all the other girls in the series in the previous routes." It's not the biggest deal in the world, but anyone who might be interested in watching any of these series might be expecting a School Days when Haruka's not that kind of character. Thank you for the clarification, all the same.
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Slashman



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:31 am Reply with quote
Morry wrote:
In all fairness, your summary implies that Haruka's aware of these previous routes, hence the "loaded" decision he makes to pursue his sister. When the reality is it's one of many independent possibilities. If you wanted to make it clear that the viewer has seen this play out, you could've reworded it as "This becomes troublesome for Haruka, who we've already seen sleep with all the other girls in the series in the previous routes." It's not the biggest deal in the world, but anyone who might be interested in watching any of these series might be expecting a School Days when Haruka's not that kind of character. Thank you for the clarification, all the same.


Or just use the word "Omnibus".
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Mad_Scientist
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:43 pm Reply with quote
octopodpie wrote:

*snipped for space*

Readers don't always react positively towards my occasional editorial commentary, especially when it sounds like I'm ribbing something at its expense instead of writing a 100% super-nuanced plot synopsis. The same thing often happens when I leave out spoilers I have knowledge of but would require me to write an additional 400+ words for one entry. I leave it out and inevitably someone comes into the forum to tell me how well actually it's this.


To make it clear, I at least wasn't trying to bash you. Mostly I was making a joke at my own expense over the fact that I'd actually watched the series and remembered it well enough to go "wait a sec".
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ANN_Lynzee
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:53 pm Reply with quote
Nah, it's okay. I don't feel "bashed" so to speak. I've been writing this column for five years come August ( Exclamation maybe I should come up with something special for that?) and every once and awhile I'll glaze something over for the sake of a bit of editorial humor. I don't always get a positive response, though.
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Mad_Scientist
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:01 pm Reply with quote
Whoa, I didn't realize it was almost five years. Heck, I didn't even realize the column itself (counting back when Gia wrote it) was almost five years old. Time flies. Congrats!

I don't have any particularly good ideas about something special to do for the anniversary, but if I think of a good suggestion, I'll let you know.
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Tenchi211



Joined: 24 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 6:02 pm Reply with quote
Zin5ki wrote:
Koi Kaze is in great need of a license rescue; it is as measured and delicate as its reputation would suggest. Sadly it may never receive one due to its subject matter—it works so deftly to explore and ultimately justify its objectionable premise, though it still has to overcome people's hesitation to view it on that very basis.


I totally agree. It really was / is an excellent story, handled in a way that was sensitive, and thoughtful (as this particular subject matter goes, I guess). I'm glad I got the 3-DVD box set of this when it was first released. I would love to see it on Blu-Ray, though I seriously doubt it happening.
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leatherhead333



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:55 pm Reply with quote
Hellsoldier wrote:
Cptn_Taylor wrote:
Lord Oink wrote:
Gemnist wrote:
I should also add that incest is known to cause numerous health problems, most notably that children born out of incest will often have brain disorders or birth defects.


Are you implying the only reason two people have, or SHOULD have sex is to procreate...?


I see so as long as procreation doesn't come into play incest is all good and dandy eh ?
Sisters banging brothers, sons banging mothers, daughters banging fathers. What a happy world. Rolling Eyes
People who accept and condone incest wether it's real or fiction are sick.


In a philosophy essay, you would've already failed. The use of strawman arguments, plus insults, plus no proper argument for your case, equals: An emotional mess of no worth whatsoever. If you have a view, voice it. Voice it at will, but keep it articulate, inteligent and civilized, in order to be taken seriously. This would sound like a Trump argument, were it not for his unhealthy obssession over Ivanka

I think some people here would find some CLAMP works, like say X/1999, shocking.


While he didn't word it the best way he did bring up some valid points. Most people are willing to defend brother/sister relationships (it's the most displayed in anime after all) but I hardly see defense of Mother/son or Father/daughter ones. It's certainly the most frighting possibility if incest were legal. Even if the child doesn't marry the parent until they are of consenting age it's entirely possible for them to be manipulated by them while they are young. That sort of thing still happens as it is. I'm not saying the legality of incest would cause this behavior to spread like wildfire. I just feel it would happen slightly more.
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jr240483



Joined: 24 Dec 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:57 pm Reply with quote
Kadmos1 wrote:
Another anime that skirts around the incest taboo is "World Break". Satsuki lusts after the lead guy Moreha but those too were romantic siblings in a past life.



and that is the point. they were siblings in a "past life". not in the current existence. it basically like with the non blood related fanservice that is going on. to appease those that like little sister romances without actually having them being blood related which was why they werent included in the list or even mentioned.

the two series that probably should have been mentioned were tokyo ravens and trinity seven since the main romance relationships involves between two cousins, however its cause of that is probably the reasons why they werent.

Cptn_Taylor wrote:
Lord Oink wrote:
Gemnist wrote:
I should also add that incest is known to cause numerous health problems, most notably that children born out of incest will often have brain disorders or birth defects.


Are you implying the only reason two people have, or SHOULD have sex is to procreate...?


I see so as long as procreation doesn't come into play incest is all good and dandy eh ?
Sisters banging brothers, sons banging mothers, daughters banging fathers. What a happy world. Rolling Eyes
People who accept and condone incest wether it's real or fiction are sick.


to each his own i guess. However, there are a lot of good hearted people who are involved in these relationships and none of them are mentally unstable or "sick in the head". one couple (a mother & son) i know of personally who actually saved my life at one time when i caught pneumonia.

also like in that newest popular light novel (i think its called my sister cant read kanji or something like that. cant really remember the name though) , dont be surprised that in a century from now they might ease down on shunning onthese type of relationships and at least allow relationships between cousins to be legal like in Utah. though siblings like in the LN will never happen unless a very open minded person becomes the new vatican pope. then again in a century from now, the whole world could end up like shimoneta and if its a choice between that world and in a world that tolerate sibling & cousin romances, i'd pick the latter.
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Slashman



Joined: 26 Dec 2015
Posts: 253
PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 8:29 am Reply with quote
I think people are taking this way too far and are becoming irrational.

No one is really pushing for legalizing incest (and in Japan it is a huge taboo). It comes down to the fact that in watching an anime, esp. a romcom people are attracted to a cute girl...period. The fact that the cute girl is involved in, or wants to be involved in, a 'forbidden' relationship is much more likely part of the attraction than literally thinking about having sexual relations with the viewer's own family.

I'm pretty sure that most fans of this kind of anime aren't watching it and then going home to try to start a relationship with their siblings or parents any more than playing the latest Call of Duty is causing people to go out and try to reenact modern war scenarios in real life or watching superhero movies is causing people to try to stop bullets with their bodies.

I wish people would use some actual logic and clear thinking before getting on a moral high horse about something that is simply meant to be entertainment derived from fictional characters and situations. They may make you uncomfortable...so friggin' what? Someone else likes watching them and isn't taking them as seriously as you are. Just get some perspective and breathe slowly and deeply. The world isn't ending because Kyosuke and Kirino go together and then didn't...or whatever.
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