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Zalis116
Moderator


Joined: 31 Mar 2005
Posts: 5596
Location: Arcana City

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 4:10 am Reply with quote
Conan-san wrote:
Oh god, that's not Hikaru's (Nadesico) va doing Ayu is it?
No, it's Brittney Karbowski (Himeko in Paniponi Dash, Mone in Yumeria, Aoba in Jinki Extend), not Cynthia Martinez.

@tempest: Thanks for the clarification. I was under the (mistaken) impression that there wasn't a significant number of oldschool fans in Japan anymore, since we're always hearing about the transience of series' popularity with the Japanese fanbase (i.e. they don't care about shows like Cowboy Bebop, Love Hina, Fruits Basket, etc. that still retain popularity over here), and because I figured the social stigma would've driven older fans out of the fandom. But my impression has been that moe is commercially successful to some degree in Japan and is liked by a sufficient number of fans. Otherwise, why would studios keep churning out series that nobody likes and nobody buys?

@Zac: I get that its intent was to be funny/sarcastic, and I'm trying not to take the review/stand-up routine too seriously. I've read animejump reviews in the past, and hey, I laughed at a number of things in the segment, just as some other posters did.

But we're not on animejump.com, we're on ANN, "the Internet's most trusted anime news service." Of course, that doesn't mean that everything on the site has to be "Serious Business" (see Anime News Nina). But it feels incongruous to see a video that starts out with serious, professional news, and then launches into a comedy/rant segment that gets placed on the same level as that serious news by virtue of its inclusion on ANNTV. If this model were applied to something like Shelf Life, we'd see Bamboo writing normal, critical reviews of three or four discs, and then launching into a profanity-filled tirade about one volume wherein she makes exaggerated claims, generalizes the whole series based on that volume, belittles the show's fanbase, and then passes it all off as "oh hay guys that part was a joke don't take it seriously ahahaha."

And as a sidenote...
Why is it that negative reviews of series from the "dating-sim" genre (to use Toole's description) feel the need to degrade the genre's viewers, anyway? Same way with their thematic cousins, the traditional "harem" comedies like Love Hina, Ah my Goddess, Tenchi Muyo, Ai yori aoshi, etc. I've never seen a negative review of Wallflower, Fugshigi Yuugi, Fruits Basket, or Ouran HS Host Club that said "This crappy show is obviously wish fulfillment for plain-looking girls with irritating personalities who never got asked to the prom, so that they can imagine themselves surrounded by beautiful boys."

As a self-admitted fanboy of Kanon and its genre, I don't expect everyone to like it or uncritical praise from reviewers. All I hope for is that it get a fair shake in the market of public opinion just like any other series, not "Lol this show is based on a porno game anyone who likes it must be some loser who can't get with women in real life."
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ConanSan



Joined: 13 Jun 2007
Posts: 1818

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 4:11 am Reply with quote
Good god, if you guys got angry at Mike lambasting Kannon on the one disk, you (should but probably not, you Voltronian Robeasts) would go beserk when Dave and Joel reviewed GaoGaiGar on it's first disk.

If Moe is the dark specter of japan, the Voltron is the dark specter of the US.

I mean god, guys, ROBOTECH or TRANSFORMERS?!
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor


Joined: 05 Jan 2002
Posts: 6823
Location: Snake Mountain Cocktail Lounge

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 4:37 am Reply with quote
Zalis116 wrote:

As a self-admitted fanboy of Kanon and its genre
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championferret



Joined: 15 Jan 2004
Posts: 549

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 4:49 am Reply with quote
Ugh...that Mike Toole guy just rubbed me the wrong way. I realize he was supposed to be kinda funny in a witty/sarcastic way, but I find the fake 'wiki' pages on Encyclopedia Drammatica funnier, which is saying something.
I agree with Zalis116, it gets on my nerves when people review a single moe title and blanket the whole genre whilst simultaneously bashing anyone who likes it. As a girl who loves moe, I can't help but feel offended by this. That, and I really liked Kanon from what I saw, I thought the girls were adorable. Dunno what he means by 'ugly'. Of course, what struck me as delightfully ironic was how he said Galaxy Angel was a 'favourite' of his, despite the fact that GA has far more stereotypical characters and fan-pandering than Kanon ever did in my opinion. (I don't dislike GA, but I couldnt help snigger at that. Although it may have also been a joke)
...and I flinched every time he said 'mow-ay'. [/nitpick]

About the 'actual' segment, I thought it was pretty good after all. I did laugh a bit over the news piece about the kid dying because of Naruto since it just had to play some random clip that didn't really have anything to do with a kid strangling himself since the episode number/event is still unknown. I guess there's nothing else you can really do about that, it just amused me in a morbid kind of way. (I almost thought we were going to get to see this mythical clip that compelled a kid to strangle himself, but it looks like it's gonna remain a mystery)

More of a technical nitpick, but how possible is it to use another movie player for this? My computer doesnt like this one much. It's always stopping, starting, stopping, starting. I'd prefer something more like youtube where I can just pause it and wait for the video to load, then play without and hitches.
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Xanas



Joined: 27 Aug 2007
Posts: 2055

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 4:50 am Reply with quote
I liked the first volume of Kanon, and my first exposure to that genre was the fansub of Clannad. I think it's cool personally but I can understand the stereotyping of viewers, they probably aren't too far off the mark on that. I don't particularly like being degraded but in all honesty I find generalizations like that about other people to be oft true, so I can handle being generalized too.

Though, I should point out that my sister has also liked both Kanon & Clannad, so it can't be purely "wish fulfillment."
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Murasakisuishou



Joined: 22 Jun 2006
Posts: 1469
Location: NE Ohio

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 5:14 am Reply with quote
championferret wrote:
Of course, what struck me as delightfully ironic was how he said Galaxy Angel was a 'favourite' of his, despite the fact that GA has far more stereotypical characters and fan-pandering than Kanon ever did in my opinion.


The thing is, though, Galaxy Angel doesn't take itself the least bit seriously at all. That brief clip he showed in the preview? Look close and you can see Forte-san flying by flapping her arms really fast in the background. The blatant stereotypes in GA are there just to be made fun of, along with absolutely everything else in the anime. Shows like Kanon and Air, on the other hand (and I've seen all of Air and one episode of Kanon) are meant to be serious stories, and it's hard to take the stereotypical sad girls with massive eyes and chins that could bust through icebergs seriously if moe isn't your thing. Sure, I cried as much as anyone during Air, but a part of me was going "Oh jeez, are you kidding me?" at how blatantly fetishy some aspects of the story were.
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championferret



Joined: 15 Jan 2004
Posts: 549

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 5:21 am Reply with quote
I guess you have a point there about GA not meant to be taken seriously.
However, you can't deny that GA is, without doubt, one of the biggest cash cows of the 'moe/otaku' industry. They're -still- pumping out new series/manga/games for it.
(not quite sure what you mean by 'busting through icebergs with their chins', though. I'd say something like that more towards old-school shoujo style like Utena or something. Except their noses, rather than their chins, would work better at ice-berg busting)
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TokyoGetter



Joined: 28 Nov 2006
Posts: 412
Location: CA. You can tell by the low moral standards.

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 7:55 am Reply with quote
Mike, don't drink Nyquil before narrating.
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billyarnie



Joined: 03 Dec 2007
Posts: 190
Location: San Antonio, TX

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 8:28 am Reply with quote
Overall, the show was good. The 1st 5 minutes with Ellie & Mario was their usual OK recap of the week's news. I'm impressed that the backgrounds move & that you have the moving "Anime" & "Manga" graphics. I lean toward the graphic being related to the story, however. You have the opening with "Anime", "Manga", "DVD", etc. Use "Anime" behind a host for an anime story, "Manga" for... you see where I'm going.
Gee, it was a slow week if you could only fill 5 minutes with news stories. Poole's "Anime Jump Show" took just under 15 minutes. I think it works as a once-a-month thing & you could give him a stand-alone podcast in order to put more news, interviews & other video features into ANNtv.
This geezer is in the Zac camp; it's supposed to be funny & sarcastic, and I liked it. You don't like it, don't watch it. Yes, he's making generalizations about moe, like Rush Limbaugh & Jim Rome make sarcastic generalizations about certain people in politics & sports. He's still mostly funny. The "Old & Stupid" review was great. I've never seen "Alakazam" before & probably won't get a copy of it, but references to old-school actors, cartoons & even movie studios were fun & brought back childhood memories.
Bottom Line: I'd prefer "The Anime Jump Show" to be a standalone podcast distributed by ANN, so ANNtv can have more interviews & video features, but I'll live with this for now.
Yo, Zac! Still camera-shy? Too bad; I'd like to see one "Hey, Answerman" video in my lifetime. That also goes for Bamboo with "Shelf Life" & Brian Hansen with "The Click". Any super animators out want to license "Anime News Nina"? Contact Robin Sevakis, Justin's sister.
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Vicserr



Joined: 26 Apr 2004
Posts: 476
Location: Carolina, Puerto Rico USA

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 10:19 am Reply with quote
Anime Jump tv was fun, informative and truthful, as him and the AWO have stated; the specter of Moe must be eradicated from the face of the Earth, their productions razed to the ground and the land salted so that it never is fertile again, lets go back to making cool mecha shows and epic space operas Japan. Very Happy

as for the normal ANNtv, it was ok, heck i would prefer AJtv to be weekly. Cool
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Gage



Joined: 06 May 2006
Posts: 479
Location: United States

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 11:53 am Reply with quote
"I've been left sitting on my a$$ pursuing totally unimportant things like financial security, professional satisfaction..." Toole is great, haha! Very cool that you brought this feature to ANNtv.

Last edited by Gage on Sun Jan 27, 2008 2:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
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daveriley



Joined: 12 Aug 2003
Posts: 107
Location: Philadelphia

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 12:50 pm Reply with quote
It's awesome to see some vestige of Anime Jump soldiering on. Keep up the good work, Mike! Your sexy man-voice makes me envious in my naughty places.
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Murasakisuishou



Joined: 22 Jun 2006
Posts: 1469
Location: NE Ohio

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 2:11 pm Reply with quote
championferret wrote:
I guess you have a point there about GA not meant to be taken seriously.
However, you can't deny that GA is, without doubt, one of the biggest cash cows of the 'moe/otaku' industry. They're -still- pumping out new series/manga/games for it.


Well, sure. It's obvious that even though the characters are sort of satirizing the different fetish stereotypes, the fanboys are still going to adore them (I myself have something of a crush on Forte, and I'm a girl for crying out loud Wink ). If you watch the clips from the GA concerts, you'll notice that the vast majority of the audience is male. Still, because it's a wholly ridiculous anime, the 'moe' aspect (if there is one; moe is about wanting to care for and protect a cute young girl, if I'm not mistaken) isn't so in-your-face.

Also, GA has a lot more going for it than just the basic personality types of the girls; instead of one losery guy going around interacting with all of them one by one, it's the girls interacting with each other, with hysterical results. As far as the moe genre goes (if Galaxy Angel even fits into the moe genre; I don't think it does) you can't compare something like GA to Kanon. It's perfectly reasonable to enjoy one and think the other is ridiculous.
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Jarm



Joined: 04 Dec 2007
Posts: 87

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 2:20 pm Reply with quote
This show was great, nice background animations. The Mike Toole segment was pretty funny. He's right about Kanon, it's just a typical moe show. Animation is still beautiful though.
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lord-darkseid



Joined: 11 Apr 2006
Posts: 62

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 2:47 pm Reply with quote
Keep it up Mike. And bring back the forums, darn it! Razz
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