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Mizuki-Takashima
Joined: 10 Sep 2011
Posts: 215
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 Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 10:42 am
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| enurtsol wrote: |
| Mizuki-Takashima wrote: |
Randomly butting in here, but while we're on the subject I figured I'd toss in this quote as well, from The New York Times, concerning anime:
| Quote: | | In Japan, anime varies from children’s programming to sports, romantic comedies and even public service announcements and pornography. The shows that resonate in the United States tend to be action-driven, with lots of violence, as well as sexually provocative shows. The small but avid audience is made up of mostly male viewers aged 18 to 34. Distributors said comedies, sports shows and anything aimed at women tend to not work. |
The quote was taken from here: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/29/business/media/hulu-and-netflix-gain-an-advantage-with-anime.html?pagewanted=1&_r=2
I just don't understand it. Why does America hate female programming so much? |
Y'mean female animated programming. Teen/tween live-action shows are full of female leads. Manga can be quite popular with girls too, but they don't watch much of any animation on TV for some reason. Partly due to that lack of female animated programming, but that cannot be the whole of it. |
I'm sorry, I thought this thread was about animated programming, and I thought that's what TitanXL was talking about too. Not to mention with the series I mentioned after that one sentance, I figured we were all on the same page  I wasn't even trying to open the can of worms that is live-action programming, especially seeing as how I don't really watch any or know much about them myself.
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Mohawk52
Joined: 16 Oct 2003
Posts: 8202
Location: England, UK
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 10:52 am
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| enurtsol wrote: |
| Murder She wrote: | |
* Although these figures are for the second quarter, they include first quarter's revenues as well. |
Taking that into account, it seems overseas business for Toei has actually gone down.............. 
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That's not because they have tried to sell lots overseas, because they haven't, at least not in our market. 
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Sacto0562
Joined: 12 Jun 2010
Posts: 288
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 10:56 am
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One problem with the Pretty Cure franchise is the sheer length of each season: 47 to 50 episodes. That makes it really expensive to release full-season box sets in the USA, so even a full season, split into two box sets--could cost circa US$90 per season street price.
Indeed, the recent remastered releases from MarvelousAQL of Futari wa Pretty Cure and Futari wa Pretty Cure Max Heart costs over US$400 per season in Japan--ouch!
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enurtsol
Joined: 01 May 2007
Posts: 14761
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 11:43 am
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| Mizuki-Takashima wrote: |
I'm sorry, I thought this thread was about animated programming, and I thought that's what TitanXL was talking about too. Not to mention with the series I mentioned after that one sentance, I figured we were all on the same page I wasn't even trying to open the can of worms that is live-action programming, especially seeing as how I don't really watch any or know much about them myself. |
No prob at all. Just wanted us to be clear, in case people jump in the middle. 
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baadaku12345
Joined: 21 Feb 2010
Posts: 179
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 12:10 pm
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| Lynx Amali wrote: |
| darkchibi07 wrote: | | Seriously, someone needs to take a chance and bring over the Precure franchise here in the U.S. The kids of this generation needs to be exposed to at least one magical girl series just like ones before it where they were exposed to Sailor Moon. |
........................
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d31ukSQJ8pA&feature=related
Not to mention the god awful Toei dub,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NabKkGICdQo
Blue Water did a better job, IMO. Other than changing the names, it was actually pretty decent. Alot better than the Zeta Gundam dub. I actually watched it before going to school in the morning back a few years ago.
With that being said.....
TOEI, WHERE'S MY GAIKING DAIKYU MAIRYU SEASON 2 WITH ALIENS?! WHERE'S MY TOEI ROBOT GIRLS ANIME?! And, um, Live action Gaiking movie? |
Wow that Toei dub sounded really bad.... the Canadian version was OK I think. At least the background music wasn't replaced. YTV just shoved it away once it finished though.
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ArsenicSteel
Joined: 12 Jan 2010
Posts: 2370
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 12:40 pm
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| Sacto0562 wrote: | | One problem with the Pretty Cure franchise is the sheer length of each season: 47 to 50 episodes. That makes it really expensive to release full-season box sets in the USA, so even a full season, split into two box sets--could cost circa US$90 per season street price.
Indeed, the recent remastered releases from MarvelousAQL of Futari wa Pretty Cure and Futari wa Pretty Cure Max Heart costs over US$400 per season in Japan--ouch! |
That is indeed a problem. Stuff costs money.
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WeirDiE_InC
Joined: 12 May 2010
Posts: 414
Location: The GVRD
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 1:28 pm
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| ArsenicSteel wrote: |
| Sacto0562 wrote: | | One problem with the Pretty Cure franchise is the sheer length of each season: 47 to 50 episodes. That makes it really expensive to release full-season box sets in the USA, so even a full season, split into two box sets--could cost circa US$90 per season street price.
Indeed, the recent remastered releases from MarvelousAQL of Futari wa Pretty Cure and Futari wa Pretty Cure Max Heart costs over US$400 per season in Japan--ouch! |
That is indeed a problem. Stuff costs money. |
I'll bet you guys anything that those would've been released in singles over here.
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Sunday Silence
Joined: 22 Jun 2010
Posts: 2047
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 3:36 pm
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| WeirDiE_InC wrote: | | I'll bet you guys anything that those would've been released in singles over here. |
Or worse.....bits and pieces (see the Power Rangers Franchise for an example.....scattered episode releases on VHS and DVD, no full complete series sets ever in the franchise.....)
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TG72
Joined: 28 Jan 2011
Posts: 334
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:08 pm
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| TitanXL wrote: | |
Executives have flat out said "girls don't sell" when it comes to cartoons, so I doubt any network will. Americans don't like the idea of female leads which is why 99% of cartoons star males. |
Maybe Avatar: The Legend of Korra will pave the way for a few others. Not that it's going to help Precure, but we may see some more with female leads if it's a hit
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Lord Geo
Joined: 18 Sep 2005
Posts: 2546
Location: North Brunswick, New Jersey
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:13 pm
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Seeing Saint Seiya on that list just shows how obvious it is that Saint Seiya is the anime equivalent of soccer: It's popular everywhere but North America, though admittedly at the very least soccer has its moments in the sun over here (World Cup & Olympics) and there were at least two efforts to make North Americans care about the soccer (Pele & David Beckham). Seiya has only had one real effort (DiC/ADV; CrunchyRoll's streaming of Lost Canvas didn't seem like a big deal outside of it being the first OVA to be simulcasted).
Shame, too, since Saint Seiya is such an awesomely-enjoyable series.
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Surrender Artist
Joined: 01 May 2011
Posts: 3264
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:20 pm
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| TG72 wrote: | | Maybe Avatar: The Legend of Korra will pave the way for a few others. |
Oh, dude, don't. Invoking the word Avatar anywhere near TitanXL is apt to put you in a world of nuisance.
(I happen to likewise harbor a small hope that The Legend Of Korra improves things for female protagonists, particular those that aren't conspicuously and narrowly 'girly', but I'm pessimistic, if for no other reason that I'm not allowed to have nice things)
Last edited by Surrender Artist on Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:36 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Mohawk52
Joined: 16 Oct 2003
Posts: 8202
Location: England, UK
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:33 pm
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There are plenty of girls what would watch Magic Girl anime, We have two cartoon channels targetting girls especially on our DTH Sat platform, which seems to be doing well enough, problem is there isn't enough merchandise available with something like Precure, which these channels TXed the first series with the Canadian dub and still repeat, to sell to them afterwards without heavy import duties, as that's where the broadcasters get a good chunk of their returns. I remember when Sailor Moon was on our CITV the toy stores were full of the dolls and accessories and when they were gone, so was the anime.
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TitanXL
Joined: 08 Jun 2010
Posts: 4036
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:44 pm
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| TG72 wrote: | | Maybe Avatar: The Legend of Korra will pave the way for a few others. Not that it's going to help Precure, but we may see some more with female leads if it's a hit |
Well, again the only reason that got greenlit is because the creators worked for Nickelodeon previously and it has brand recognition. If a show originates like that, then it can't really change anything.
| Lord Geo wrote: | | Seeing Saint Seiya on that list just shows how obvious it is that Saint Seiya is the anime equivalent of soccer: It's popular everywhere but North America, though admittedly at the very least soccer has its moments in the sun over here (World Cup & Olympics) and there were at least two efforts to make North Americans care about the soccer (Pele & David Beckham). Seiya has only had one real effort (DiC/ADV; CrunchyRoll's streaming of Lost Canvas didn't seem like a big deal outside of it being the first OVA to be simulcasted). |
There's a few series you can say that about. America is kind of the odd-ball out when it comes to anime, in the grand scheme of things. Detective Conan and Shin-chan are other examples.
| Surrender Artist wrote: | | (I happen to likewise harbor a small hope that The Legend Of Korra improves things for female protagonists, particular those that aren't conspicuously and narrowly 'girly', but I'm pessimistic, if for no other reason that I'm not allowed to have nice things) |
The "girly" complaint is actually why there's such a big problem with them in the west I would say. Unless they're tomboyish, men-in-girls-bodies stereotypes (which Korra appears to be) then it probably won't get greenlit; and people will see it as "weak" or a hinderance like you said. You can see that in things like Wonder Woman, Lara Croft, and other big western female pop culture icons as well. It's an interesting juxtaposition. In Japan, femininity is empowered. Magical girl henshin can be seen as puberty, and their outfits are dresses and similar traditional girl clothing. In the west, they seem to do everything they can to de-feminize things and make the female characters as masculine and tomboyish as possible, as if the very idea of femininity is impossible to be seen as strong and males are inherently better, so if a woman wants to be strong, she needs to be like a man. It's an interest take between cultures.
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enurtsol
Joined: 01 May 2007
Posts: 14761
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 5:34 pm
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| Surrender Artist wrote: | |
(I happen to likewise harbor a small hope that The Legend Of Korra improves things for female protagonists, particular those that aren't conspicuously and narrowly 'girly', but I'm pessimistic, if for no other reason that I'm not allowed to have nice things) |
They should make more of those chibi shorts as omake. 
| TitanXL wrote: | | In Japan, femininity is empowered. Magical girl henshin can be seen as puberty, and their outfits are dresses and similar traditional girl clothing. In the west, they seem to do everything they can to de-feminize things and make the female characters as masculine and tomboyish as possible, as if the very idea of femininity is impossible to be seen as strong and males are inherently better, so if a woman wants to be strong, she needs to be like a man. It's an interest take between cultures. |
Though to be fair, at the same time Japan also de-powers them such as by constantly being victims of unwanted voyeur shots. So Japan is trying to have it both ways. Then again, Japan is quite a patriarchal society, so they most likely don't even see it that way.
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Anymouse
Joined: 18 May 2007
Posts: 685
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Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 5:54 pm
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| Quote: | | Japan is quite a patriarchal society |
And fans of Japanese animation are very stereotyping. 
Seriously, they may be patriarchal but they are no more so than the people from Mad Men. That isn't patriarchal enough for me to call them patriarchal.
Oh, and I can tell from this list that Japanese animation has really been going to crap. There aren't any Space Operas or serious Robot Stories, or Cyberpunk. It's just a bunch of silly crap about schoolgirls, "Dragon Balls", Superheroes or goofy pirates. We need to get back to the way anime ways 10 years ago, when the only two Directors were Satoshi Kon and Hayao Miyazaki. Everything was good back then.
Yes, tongue fully in cheek.
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