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Chicks on Anime [2008-09-23]

Some Guy wrote:

Kimiko_0 wrote: Wow, this installment just swerved all over the place, didn't it? I'm still surprised by how people can take a few random facts about some extremes and characterize a whole society by them. It's like that old trope of aliens watching TV broadcasts from Earth and completely misunderstanding what human life is like. Anime fans often say how they want to learn all about Japanese culture and language, but in practice it seems they're more interested in maintaining their prejudice of Japan as wacky and exotic and incomprehensible. One small detail I wanted to comment on separately; Casey, you wrote Casey wrote: [..] these kind of wimpy, girlish male characters [..] You say that like it's a bad thing to be girlish. I hope you didn't really mean that. I agree with this, if you are going to be making commentary on a nations society and culture it is very important to have someone well learned in said culture. With reguars to that quote, I think it is important to not take the quote to much out of context, the way Casey was using it was as a means to describe "beta males", not call those properties bad. Let me talk about the actual column for a second. I think it is important keep the topic focused on anime, not the role of men and woman in society. I get enough of that in my college english class. I just feel like the conversation very quickly change from the role of "alpha" and "beta" male in anime to how men and woman interact in Japanese society. Again, I have my college english classes for that (can you believe I study mechanical engineering...).

Are you from RPGchat?

Beta Male at least according to pack rank is a very insulting term.

Kind of seems like they turn these articles into see how "Superior the west is to the east?" It may not be the intent, but that's how they come off to me.

Whoisthatguy?! An idiot wrote:

Some Guy wrote: Kimiko_0 wrote: Wow, this installment just swerved all over the place, didn't it? I'm still surprised by how people can take a few random facts about some extremes and characterize a whole society by them. It's like that old trope of aliens watching TV broadcasts from Earth and completely misunderstanding what human life is like. Anime fans often say how they want to learn all about Japanese culture and language, but in practice it seems they're more interested in maintaining their prejudice of Japan as wacky and exotic and incomprehensible. One small detail I wanted to comment on separately; Casey, you wrote Casey wrote: [..] these kind of wimpy, girlish male characters [..] You say that like it's a bad thing to be girlish. I hope you didn't really mean that. I agree with this, if you are going to be making commentary on a nations society and culture it is very important to have someone well learned in said culture. With reguars to that quote, I think it is important to not take the quote to much out of context, the way Casey was using it was as a means to describe "beta males", not call those properties bad. Let me talk about the actual column for a second. I think it is important keep the topic focused on anime, not the role of men and woman in society. I get enough of that in my college english class. I just feel like the conversation very quickly change from the role of "alpha" and "beta" male in anime to how men and woman interact in Japanese society. Again, I have my college english classes for that (can you believe I study mechanical engineering...). Are you from RPGchat? Beta Male at least according to pack rank is a very insulting term. Kind of seems like they turn these articles into see how "Superior the west is to the east?" It may not be the intent, but that's how they come off to me.

Never heard of RPGchat.

If by pack rank you are referring to wolves, then it basically means second in command. Again, I don't think the words "wimpy and girlish" should be seen as being directed at a certain group of people and meant to insult them.

Considering you took the most extreme example of Japanese culture...

Whoisthatguy?! An idiot wrote:

Considering you took the most extreme example of Japanese culture...

I did? I think you're mistaking me for someone who wrote the article or was in any way involved in its creation. I'm a forum mod, I do not have anything to do with ANN's articles or reviews or really anything outside the forums.

Disclaimer: I do not actually live in Denmark; I watched a documentary (or it might have been Sixty Minutes) on how the Danes are the happiest people in the western world. Needless to say, I was very impressed.

dtm42 wrote:

Disclaimer: I do not actually live in Denmark; I watched a documentary (or it might have been Sixty Minutes) on how the Danes are the happiest people in the western world. Needless to say, I was very impressed.

Well, I do, and I'm a parent to boot, so I am qualified to say that you pretty much got it right. There are a few minor provisions that you left out, but on the whole, it was spot on.

I should also mention that the Danish government pays a quarterly sum to the parent of any child under 18, with a sliding scale (parents of small children get a bigger cheque). It isn't a fortune, by any means, but it does take some of the edge off the expenses of raising children.

Current rates are 4038 DKK/quarter for children under 3; 3198 DKK/quarter for children age 3 to 6; and 2516 DKK/quarter for children aged 7 to 17. At present, 1 DKK = 0.198 USD.

Did I mention we have socialized medicine and an educational system that works? And free higher education, up to and including college? I could go on, but you get the idea.

- abunai

Some Guy wrote:

Whoisthatguy?! An idiot wrote: Some Guy wrote: Kimiko_0 wrote: Wow, this installment just swerved all over the place, didn't it? I'm still surprised by how people can take a few random facts about some extremes and characterize a whole society by them. It's like that old trope of aliens watching TV broadcasts from Earth and completely misunderstanding what human life is like. Anime fans often say how they want to learn all about Japanese culture and language, but in practice it seems they're more interested in maintaining their prejudice of Japan as wacky and exotic and incomprehensible. One small detail I wanted to comment on separately; Casey, you wrote Casey wrote: [..] these kind of wimpy, girlish male characters [..] You say that like it's a bad thing to be girlish. I hope you didn't really mean that. I agree with this, if you are going to be making commentary on a nations society and culture it is very important to have someone well learned in said culture. With reguars to that quote, I think it is important to not take the quote to much out of context, the way Casey was using it was as a means to describe "beta males", not call those properties bad. Let me talk about the actual column for a second. I think it is important keep the topic focused on anime, not the role of men and woman in society. I get enough of that in my college english class. I just feel like the conversation very quickly change from the role of "alpha" and "beta" male in anime to how men and woman interact in Japanese society. Again, I have my college english classes for that (can you believe I study mechanical engineering...). Are you from RPGchat? Beta Male at least according to pack rank is a very insulting term. Kind of seems like they turn these articles into see how "Superior the west is to the east?" It may not be the intent, but that's how they come off to me. Never heard of RPGchat. If by pack rank you are referring to wolves, then it basically means second in command. Again, I don't think the words "wimpy and girlish" should be seen as being directed at a certain group of people and meant to insult them.

Clearly not

wimp (wmp) Slang
n.
A person who is regarded as weak or ineffectual: "the impression that he is a colorless, indecisive wimp, and not a leader among men" James J. Kilpatrick.
intr.v. wimped, wimp·ing, wimps
To be timid or cowardly. Usually used with out: w

Kimiko_0 wrote:

I'm still surprised by how people can take a few random facts about some extremes and characterize a whole society by them. It's like that old trope of aliens watching TV broadcasts from Earth and completely misunderstanding what human life is like.

I sometimes see this contrary statement made in other discussions attempting to analyze Japanese society. However, I have yet to see any evidence to support the notion that these views on the status of women, the escapist pop-culture, the seeming social chasm between the sexes, are resultant of widespread ignorance and uncultured generalizations on the part of us Americans.

I'd just wish our friend Kimiko_O would point out the instances where our esteemed writers erred, so we all can better understand, instead of (ironically) making a sweeping statement about how they were completely wrong.

dtm42 wrote:

Disclaimer: I do not actually live in Denmark; I watched a documentary (or it might have been Sixty Minutes) on how the Danes are the happiest people in the western world. Needless to say, I was very impressed.

Well, I do, and I'm a parent to boot, so I am qualified to say that you pretty much got it right. There are a few minor provisions that you left out, but on the whole, it was spot on.

I should also mention that the Danish government pays a quarterly sum to the parent of any child under 18, with a sliding scale (parents of small children get a bigger cheque). It isn't a fortune, by any means, but it does take some of the edge off the expenses of raising children.

Current rates are 4038 DKK/quarter for children under 3; 3198 DKK/quarter for children age 3 to 6; and 2516 DKK/quarter for children aged 7 to 17. At present, 1 DKK = 0.198 USD.

Did I mention we have socialized medicine and an educational system that works? And free higher education, up to and including college? I could go on, but you get the idea.

- abunai

Animerican14 wrote:

Wait, Denmark's government pays people to be parents? WTH?

They get paid parental leave. Basically, when a couple have a baby and wish to take time off work, the Government will pay them their salary even though they are not "working" anymore. These payments typically go on for six months, and can be paid to either the mother or the father, or both. This means that the father can stay home and look after the child if he wants to. Or they can both stay home.

Employers are also forced to keep a person's job vacant while they are on leave, and let them continue working in their exact same job should they wish to return after their leave. They are also not allowed to discriminate against people who wish to take leave.

How's that for flexibility? Sounds like a utopia, doesn't it?

So yeah, the Government there - for all intents and purposes - pays people to be parents, by removing all the traditional barriers to taking time off to be a parent. People still get paid their normal salary, and they still have a job to go back to.

Which means that Danish kids are happy and healthy, and Danish parents are able to pursue both work and family as they wish. The result? A pretty healthy, very happy nation. Perhaps not an economic powerhouse, but nonetheless a much better place to raise a family than Japan or the United States.

That, along with free healthcare, screams SOCIALISM with a capital S and an exclamation point! Then again, what do you expect from a nanny state? Not only do people end up thinking the government should kiss their boo-boos, but that....