Forum - View topicTrigun is not all that.
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jsyxx
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I originally bought this show a little while after the first DVD release was completed. I think I may have enjoyed it a bit on the first time around, but it really didn't hold up upon multiple viewings. I don't think it deserves to be so highly reguarded. Firstly the storyline is pretty crappy. I think this is pretty obviously a result of making the anime before the manga was finished, so they gave it a thrown together ending. Why can't they just make animes after the mangas are completed? I think it would've been alot better if they did. Secondly is I don't think the character's motivations are believable. Vash and Knives both are pretty stilted characters. I also heard someone else one this board say Trigun was better than Spider-Man, becaues there were no cheesey bad-guys of the week, but that couldn't be farther from the truth with all those lame bad-guys other than Knives who had far less motivation and charcterization than any Spider-Man villain. Maybe Legato is the exception, but his motivations weren't very well explained either.
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CrackaJax
 Posts: 250 Location: Mount Olympus, Syracuse University |
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A requirement for a show to be good isn't that it has to be viewable multiple times. If this were true, most comedies wouldn't be good, since the jokes aren't as funny the second time around. Trigun has some interesting concepts spoiler[With vash being the plant thing and his angel arm and all]. It may have hokey bad guys, but its still good. A lot of the show is fluff, but it gives us something to enjoy. Otherwise, the show could've been done in 10-12 episodes.
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jsyxx
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They tried to insert some depth with the sanctity of human life concepts, but I think those completely failed and came off looking phoney to me. Its sorta similar to Gundam Wings's commentary on war, it makes no sense and means nothing. Good anime should hold up under multiple viewings. I don't think any of the jokes were funny the first time, so the comedy elements were pretty irrelavent to what I'm talking about.
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jsyxx
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And I didn't re-watch this show till a few years later, so that should've been enough time I think.
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Arkard
 Posts: 677 Location: Poland |
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Just because it doesn`t look good during the x viewing (which in case of some Trigun episodes is true) it doesn`t make it an overall bad title. I guess you have to look deeper than the first layer.
That depends on your tastes. To me the term "objective" is pretty much a legend. spoiler[You have the Earth which is almost destroyed by humans - standard anime/sf plot. The people fled the Earth in order to find another place to stay. Then we have The Plants. This is a start of originality. Not even the people from the far future know exactly what are the plants, but they have found a way to harnest their AMAZING powers. Then suddenly, 2 babies are found/born from a Plant. They are far superior than us, normal human beings. They grow along-side the humans for some time. They are met with love and despise, happiness and anger. Some people detest them. And at some point, one of the "alien" kids becomes more aware of his greatness and decides he cannot allow humans to spread in the world, so he forces a landing on the nearest planet, killing most of the SEED ships. Then the real story beggins, when people have to live on a desert planet, and where Vash decided to take revenge upon his brother.] Now, if this is crap to you, I wont say anything, because everyone likes something else. But to me it is a fairly original plot that appeals to me and my tastes.
Knives - spoiler[I am a far superior being that can live even up to 1000 years. I have met humans and lived with them. I know they are weak, they have useless emotions like emphaty, love, anger etc etc etc. They used me and my brothers and sisters like slaves. I hate them. I decide I cannot allow them to colonize space. So I kill most of them but some live. I have time. I will live really long. So I settle on the planet and decide to observe the humans. The pathetic little humans. They are like animals to me. So from time to time I do something to them. But then my brother - a person I thought was too weak to oppose me, does that. So I erase his past, kill everyone who can link him to the woman he "loved". But he injures me. How is that possible?? My Ego is so big it cannot understand my defeat. So I must kil Vash, then all the humans. And I am so smart so I am using strong humans to fight other humans. Soo entertaining.] Vash - spoiler[Even though I am superior to humans, I dont feel better than them. I like them, sometimes I even feel human. Even though they may hate me, it doesn`t botter me. And then there is Rem. She was so ncie to me, like a sister or a mother. In a way I loved her. My motto: to save everyone and live in Peace. But Knives killed so many people... I tried to understand him but I cant. A person should never kill anyone. But.. he killed Rem, and I cant forgive him that. So I spend my life looking for anything linked to Rem (its a way to save my troubled mind), and when I found out that Knives killed that person and made me destroy a whole city!... I must find him.. and kill him! But... when I finally find him.. I cannot kill him. That would defy everything I done so far. So I save myself by letting Knives live. (To me, The fact that Vash didn't kill Knives was the whole point of the story. It was pretty obviosu to me but still seemed pretty deep in its messege).] So I think the motives showed in Trigun are genious! They are so deep and captured attention of fans around the world. Of course, just because something is known and liked doesn`t make it good... but I liked the motives in Trigun. That`s all. I am pretty tired now, but I will edit the post later in regard to ther other part of your messege. |
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jsyxx
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What I meant was the structure of the storyline was pretty crappy. The climax, resolution, etc. just seemed to be thrown together. Obviously a result of the incompletion of the source material. |
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Arkard
Posts: 677 Location: Poland |
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I will give you that. The lack of a linear plot is the only flaw I found in this anime. But other than that it`s one of my fav shows out there. Last edited by Arkard on Wed Sep 15, 2004 3:45 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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ThatMatt
Posts: 162 |
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Yeah, I can agree that the story seemed thrown together, but I really enjoyed the fights.
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darkhunter
 Posts: 2992 Location: Los Angelas |
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No show is perfect, there's always something flawed that people will complain about. Overall, Trigun was a good show, so get over it.
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abunai
Old Regular
 Posts: 5463 Location: 露命 |
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I don't mean to belittle you, ThatMatt, and I will agree that the fights in Trigun are certainly worth watching - but how can you cite that as the most worthwhile part of the series? It seems to me that that indicates that you've missed the entire point of the story. The fights are essential to the story, yes, but they are the antithesis of the story, presented to give depth to its thesis, which is that killing, under whatever circumstances, is completely and utterly wrong. - abunai |
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deathbringer
Posts: 276 |
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I suppose it depends on your definition of good. I was sick of Cowboy Bebop the third time AS showed it, I haven't watched a single episode in over a year. I'd much rather watch every episode of Dragonball Z back to back then sit through Bebop again. But yet everyone thinks Bebop is better then DBZ. |
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Nagisa
Moderator
 Posts: 6128 Location: Atlanta-ish, Jawjuh |
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I have to disagree with the "not wanting to rewatch it doesn't make it bad" mindset. If something is genuinely well-made (quality writing, production, etc.) you should want to willingly subject yourself to it again. It should be just that good. Even if watching it again is a painful experience (SaiKano), even if you know all the shocking plot twists & revelations (Evangelion), even if you know all the jokes (FMP? Fumoffu), it should still be of the calibre that you'd be willing to see it again and it'd carry a similar impact. Sure, it can get old if you watch it too many times, but in general a desire to re-experience said title should be there.
Unfortunately, Trigun doesn't carry that level of quality for me. It's decent, but it becomes a chore to follow after a viewing or two. Sluggish plot, underdeveloped plot, so-so characters & development, and absolutely atrocious animation after the first seven or so episodes. I like it, but it's painfully overrated. |
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abunai
Old Regular
Posts: 5463 Location: 露命 |
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I completely agree.
Sluggish plot? I'd rather call it uneven. It seems obvious that there are some episodes that could have been removed without losing the central storyline, and are therefore essentially superfluous. Underdeveloped plot? I'll halfway agree with this. There are a lot of loose ends left dangling - but this may simply be an artifact of the production process. I suspect that the series was meant for a longer run. So-so characters & development? No. I'll grant you, many of the secondary characters are complete cardboard cut-outs, but the central characters have sufficient depth (not that one couldn't wish for more). Absolutely atrocious animation after the first seven or so episodes? Yes, I mostly agree with this point. The animation could have been a great deal better. But the story gets better, so that sort of outweighs the animation - at least, it did for me. I was captivated enough to sit through it all. - abunai |
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DragonofHeaven
 Posts: 115 |
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Agreed, I bought the series a while ago, not knowing it would be on CN anytime soon. I finished the series in a few days and was rather impressed with it, for a while anyway. A few months later, I found it a bit stale the second time around. In a while, I started skipping episodes and only watched the few choicey ones that I really liked. I don't see much re-watch value in it, save for the funny episodes and the Project Seed DVD and on. Because it has a bit of an episodic nature and is a one-hit wonder with the casual viewer, Adult Swim cashed in on Trigun and therefore got the kind of attention AS tends to suck in when it comes to their anime.
I wouldn't say it was crappy. I probably shouldn't have bought the series though; I didn't know Adult Swim would eventually get ahold of it-_- The ending wasn't too shabby; it ends on a postive note and I like how the series leaves off with an open ending. As for why it was made while the manga was still coming out, it was probably because of demand...then again, I don't think Trigun was that much of a hit in Japan....I don't know.
There were only like 2 or 3 good ones; their fights lack some substance. Its "counterpart," Cowboy Bebop, is much better about that.
Agreed, Trigun is appealing to me mostly for Vash's phisophical views on life; I'm not a big fan of the action sequences in this series.
I suppose you made a good point; it has a low "replay" factor, especially since AS airs it week after week like Cowboy Bebop's infamous nonstop 2-year run. The plot lacked some substance in the middle of the series; the Gung-ho Guns need more background. It was like they were just stuck in there. Also, I am suprised that after 26 episodes that you still know very little about Meryl. The animation wasn't bad in my opinion; I suppose it is just a difference in taste. And pretty much everything on Adult Swim is overrated because it is a main anime source for a lot of people. Everyone knows of the AS series. Last edited by DragonofHeaven on Wed Sep 15, 2004 8:02 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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darkhunter
Posts: 2992 Location: Los Angelas |
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There are a lot of memorable scene in Trigun.
Some people just watch it and don't think about it. Spoiler Warning!! Some of the scene I can remember: spoiler[Remember when he had to shoot the runaway guy and his girlfriend because it was his job. I was thinking, damn why is Vash so bad, I thought he was a good guy. But then at the end, he did shoot them......but with a rubber bullet, so they can escape and be together. -While trying to run away from the townfolk, he was capture (well kind of) by the ladies of the town. The Nebraska family then wipe out the house they were in. All the ladies were knock out, but Vash still continue helping the them even though they wanted to capture him. Or how Mryle was shooting and taking down the Nebraska family, to proect the old's folk house. You're thinking how can she shoot so good, but in fact it was Vash all along. Hiding from far away. -Fighting the one eye women, she hypnotized him and move in a blink of an Eye. She said she could of kill him in 3 times. Vash respond then heco uld of "grab her breast her 5 times". Clever line. Anyways, Vash is clever enough not to be hypnotized due to focusing on a paint to his finger. How about Wolfwood, who you think is gonna be there till the end, suddenly die.] There are many more secene. Even though the plot was disjointed at times, there are many memorable scene that I can remember, more than other anime. Plus Vash & Wolfwood are an excellent character. The main plot is about Vash's life (past, present, future) anyways, so u don't expect much from the others. And even thoug he had the power to kill, he's not going to kill anyone because of a promise. Unlike other hero, this doesn't make him invincible, he has scar all over his body. [quote="DragonofHeaven"]
I didn't think Cowboy Bebop, Wolf's Rain, Witch Hunter Robin or Outlaw Star were overrated. They're well done and they dersvered to be consider good by many people. Have you ever saw an anime that's not on AS? There are tons of bad one or just mediocre anime. Also, I'm assuming you're female because most female I know dont' like action title at all. Trigun is a good action title. Recommend if you're an action fan. [EDIT - Use spoiler tags, please. Thanks. -C] |
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