Forum - View topicIt is really wrong to call someone an otaku?
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Chiibi
 Posts: 4829 |
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But it's true. 
I don't think people are as touchy about it as they used to be. I read a lot of raw manga and the manga-ka will write in the freetalk panel stuff like "Yeah, I bought a DVD of Macross Frontier. Otaku! Otaku!" And this was a female manga-ka too.... |
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EricJ
 Posts: 876 |
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Good, can I add "You're a shallow showoff pest"? 
(And no, most athies aren't, they just think they are.) An atheist would be about the last person on planet Earth who "doesn't care what society thinks", unquote, as he's constantly trying to rub his "difference" in everyone's face for status, get the martyr thrill of calling them idiot victims of our modern conspiracies, and, ironically, nail himself up on his own social cross when said idiots click their sad unenlightened tongues. In contrast, the true otaku--in the Western "geek" sense (a word here used with niche pride by those within it)--seeks to construct rather than deconstruct, and frequently embarrasses himself in public hoping to find new willing converts that need that extra push. It's true of the Japanese ones, too, although it isn't helping them much. The Athie converts others out of loneliness, the (positive) Otaku evangelizes, so that the "justice" of the art form may triumph. 
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Mesonoxian Eve
Posts: 1858 |
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While laughably ridiculous, there's a point here. It's how the term is used that denotes its true definition. Simply being called "otaku" means nothing without the expression behind it. Of course, this can be true of any word, and when we're dealing with a text based communication system, you can bet there's going to be more of a negative definition than a positive one, for the most part. It reminds me of "tsundere" and, more recently, "moe". Hmm. I think I just created an anime series! The Tsundere Moe Otaku and Her Three Yaoi Friends. 
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Alan45
 Village Elder Posts: 9853 Location: Virginia |
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@Chiibi
My point was that even if it is true in the sense that you understand the word, the person you are trying to communicate with may have a significantly different and possibly negative definition of the word. In Japan it is a native, if slang, term and most people will have a similar understanding. Here you can't assume that. |
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Chiibi
Posts: 4829 |
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I'd watch the hell out of that. :'DD @Alan: I'm just saying from my experience with Japanese people that "otaku" seems to have lost much of its formerly offensive connotation. Not so long ago, I was talking to a Japanese man at work who came into the store to shop. I don't remember how it occurred but he asked me if I liked anime. I told him yes. He introduced me to his wife who said she loved anime too and we got to talking about it a bit. She asked me, quite casually if I was an otaku. I hesitated because I knew I might have to be careful. But I said with an embarrassed grin, "To be honest, yes, probably." She laughed and asked me what my favorite anime was. I told her and she said she'd watch it. 
So while I wouldn't walk around Japan with オタク tattooed on my forehead, it just may be that it's okay to use the term on oneself in front of Japanese people, depending on the company you are in. |
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Alan45
Village Elder Posts: 9853 Location: Virginia |
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@Chiibi
I think we are agreeing with each other, it is just in the phrasing. The original question was should you call someone an otaku. My basic response is No, unless you know how they will respond. The same thing would apply to describing yourself that way. In your example you had already both established that you liked anime. What you admitted was that you were into it enough that you recognized the term and realized that it applied. |
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vanfanel
 Posts: 1242 |
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Here is wisdom. That word is indeed a landmine, and depending on the person, can really get you tarred and feathered. I'll never forget: about nine years back, I'd been living in Japan for a few months, and had to have some repairs done in my room. It so happened that I had put a small number of Galaxy Express 999 gachapon on my bookshelf. Pure nostalgia; they were quite small; no exaggerated body proportions or revealing outfits whatsoever; nothing else weird in sight. The repairmen arrived, and at the first sight of those, one of the men (not suspecting that the white guy might understand), joked to the other right in front of me: "Feels like walking into Miyazaki Tsutomu's apartment!" (Miyazaki Tsutomu was a serial killer whose vast library of anime and pornography made him the poster boy of "otaku" in Japan for years.) So yeah. I'm a fan because anime is one way I relax and enjoy myself. I am NOT an otaku because anime is not my escape from some harsh reality I can't deal with otherwise. But I can't expect people here to make that distinction, so I -- like most Japanese people -- just keep it to myself during the day now, and enjoy my hobbies in the evening when there's no one around who'll jump to conclusions. |
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Ente-Geminis!
Posts: 5 |
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WOW i started a very long argument
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SpacemanHardy
Posts: 2509 |
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@Ente-Geminis!
Hi ReverseTitan/MentalMachine/Yamadakun/etc/etc.
Oh, don't even bother hiding it. We KNOW it's you. 
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Jose Cruz
 Posts: 1775 Location: South America |
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I watched Lain in one sitting (EVA is a bit too long for that), it's less than 6 hours. I couldn't sleep well that night due to the impact of the series but I am still alive.  In fact, I think that series such as Lain were made to be watched in few sittings.
I think I read a research on the proportion of the population that watches anime that from the age bracket 20 to 29 in Japan about 6-7% watches more than 6 series a week, that would be perhaps 5 hours a week. I think that the proportion of the population of the same age bracket that spends more than 5 hours a week reading manga is probably higher as well. Last edited by Jose Cruz on Wed Jan 01, 2014 4:32 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Jose Cruz
Posts: 1775 Location: South America |
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It is a well known fact that American mainstream society is extremely hostile to any form of foreign cultural product. This includes animation produced in Japan (in fact, this hostility probably even resulted in the creation of a specific term to designate all animation produced in Japan). It is not considered abnormal today for an adult in the US to watch Simpsons and Family Guy and other mediocre domestic animation. In the same way it is not considered abnormal for an adult in the US to watch American movies. However, how many Americans watch more than 5 hours of French or Indian live action movies per week? Certainly even less than the number who watch 5 hours of anime. In that respect the negative American perception of fans of Japanese animation is just something we expect from the country's cultural characteristics. In the case of Japan, society there is very hostile to people outside of the social norm. For instance, there are very few fat people in Japan because of social pressure to conform. In the same way, any people obsessed with any hobby, such as animation, are under pressure to conform and allocate their free time more like the average joe.
Otaku just means nerd in Japan. Formally, someone who invest their entire free time and disposable income into a single specific hobby or set of associated hobbies (such as collecting merchandise from their favorite fictional characters). This comes with the said individual associating his persona with his hobby as well. Someone who just watches a substantial amounts of animation is not considered an otaku. It is someone who has his/hers personal identity defined by the hobby. |
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Jose Cruz
Posts: 1775 Location: South America |
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Yes you can. It's called video game geek. Of course, American society is more tolerant of video game otaku than Japanese society, as long as said videogames are only or at least mainly made originally in English, of course. Though someone who's obsessed with JRPGs would be considered a very abnormal person in the US. |
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Bango
 Posts: 1122 |
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I call myself one all the time but I'd never call somebody else one until they identified that way. It's just one of those things. Some people wear it as a badge, some people take the more traditional meaning and assume you're telling them they don't bathe.
There's some social backlash but it's the type of thing that would happen anyway because such people are very judgmental and extremely irrational. At a previous job everyone in training had to say their name, a hobby and a goal. Standard stuff. I announced my hobby as "geek stuff because I'm a geek" and the instructor approached me later and recommended counselling because, to him, I had a dangerously low self esteem. Anyone who knows me knows that's not the case but to him sci-fi, video games and D&D were shameful things and signs of a person in great mental distress. So I'd say it's not really wrong to call somebody an otaku but it'd a roll of the dice on how they'll react. |
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mdo7
 Posts: 6263 Location: Katy, Texas, USA |
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Well that would depend on how the word is use, I know otaku can be use as a derogatory word. Like people in Japan would describe otaku as extreme anime fans with no life. Hell, I've seen people describing hikikomori as otaku also. Otaku can be used negatively or sometime in a bad way like for example, are any of you familiar with the Japanese serial killer, Tsutomu Miyazaki. He was dubbed "the otaku murderer". Also do any of you recall the half-Japanese 21 years old that the Japanese media said was an otaku. That and the Japanese media seem to make his half-foreigner heritage a big deal. Yep another example of demonzing otaku and their subculture (and also targeting foreigners for criminal acts). Also I like to mention the suspect, Kaoru Kobayashi who kidnapped a 7 year old Japanese girl wasn't an otaku at all, but before his arrest, the Japanese media blamed otaku for the kidnapping of a 7-year old Japanese girl. I read it that law enforcement/police in Japan harassed otaku and doing inappropriate law-bending just to try to arrest otakus when they're innocent of criminal act. Yes otaku can have negative reputation and I remembered reading from comic book league defense fund website talking about how otaku in Japan are sometime Japanese media favorite scapegoat.
I'll quote some part of the article if you're too lazy to read the whole thing:
Otaku can be used not in a negative term (but also neutral), like as other people said, otaku doesn't mean anime fan, there's also video game otaku, automobile otaku, camera otaku, cosplay otaku. Hell, I heard even K-dramas fans and K-pop fans (sorry if I have to bring up Korean stuff on here but I'm keeping it on topic) are even called otaku too, which I would proudly be called. I mean even Girls Generation/SoShi/SNSD/Shojo Jidai fans (or SOnes) are even called otakus  according to this SNSD variety show, the subtitles even said otaku.
So you see otaku can be applied on many thing not only anime and manga.
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ReverseTitan
 Posts: 109 Location: Hong Kong |
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No it isn't. I have much more attitude than this guy. @Jose Cruz Last time I checked, British movies are foreign film. If it isn't made in the US(and to a lesser extent Canada), it is a foreign film. English=/=not foreign. The reason why American films do well outside the US+Canada, but the reverse does poorly is because films from outside the US lack universal themes and as such, films do poorly. Chinese films are too Chinese. German films are too German. British films are not too British. See the pattern here? Do you see why British films are the only foreign film to have success in the US? It is because British films are UNIVERSAL for the most part. Simple logic. Also, most animation in Japan is mediocre/crap as well. Sturgeon's Law cannot be bypassed. It applies to any and everything. Japan still has a hostility to games not from Japan. Not just western ones, but even ones from S Korea, even though Japan lost its status as the largest video game market years ago, so it is less intrusive than the US' "disdain" of non-British foreign film, because unlike the US, which has little need or desire to import foreign film, due to sheer size, while Japan does not. The best selling "western" game is Japan is funnily enough, not a western game. |
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