×
  • remind me tomorrow
  • remind me next week
  • never remind me
Subscribe to the ANN Newsletter • Wake up every Sunday to a curated list of ANN's most interesting posts of the week. read more

Forum - View topic
The Spring 2009 Anime Preview Guide


Goto page Previous    Next

Note: this is the discussion thread for this article

Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Stretch2424



Joined: 14 Mar 2008
Posts: 166
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 12:03 pm Reply with quote
One more review:

After all the complaining I've done recently about spring anime series which try too hard to be cool, the thought occured to me while watching the opening scene of Sengoku Basara that perhaps here's an example of a series which knows how to seize "coolness" right from the start. Indeed, at one point a major character mentions how cool he is. The tone of this show, with Samurai who are all obsessed with pride and showing off, and sometimes speak in English, reminded me of Samurai Champloo. Numerous warlords boast of how they intend to prevail during the current civil war, demonstrating that nobody has an ethical superiority over anybody else. The series seemed to give a fairly realistic look at feudal Japanese politics and warfare. The downside was that I was having a hard time keeping track of all the warring factions, who led them and who their star fighters were. I wish the story was being explained better; for instance, how does the "woodpecker strategy" work? I'm uncomfortable with the common practice of dividing soldiers into a handful of heroes versus common grunts whose only purpose is to demonstrate how awesome the stars are by being cut down by them en masse. I don't really see why the guy who fights with two spears is any better, morally speaking, than anybody else. An attempt to inject some comedy into the story during the second half seemed odd. For all the coolness early on, I was feeling rather ambivalent at the end. I'm not really detecting a riveting plot taking shape, just magically enhanced duels in which nobody of any importance wins or loses. Perhaps if this is only 13 episodes long I wouldn't mind committing to it, otherwise I'm not so sure.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kpk



Joined: 05 Apr 2009
Posts: 484
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 12:42 pm Reply with quote
Stretch2424 wrote:
One more review:

After all the complaining I've done recently about spring anime series which try too hard to be cool, the thought occured to me while watching the opening scene of Sengoku Basara that perhaps here's an example of a series which knows how to seize "coolness" right from the start. Indeed, at one point a major character mentions how cool he is. The tone of this show, with Samurai who are all obsessed with pride and showing off, and sometimes speak in English, reminded me of Samurai Champloo. Numerous warlords boast of how they intend to prevail during the current civil war, demonstrating that nobody has an ethical superiority over anybody else. The series seemed to give a fairly realistic look at feudal Japanese politics and warfare. The downside was that I was having a hard time keeping track of all the warring factions, who led them and who their star fighters were. I wish the story was being explained better; for instance, how does the "woodpecker strategy" work? I'm uncomfortable with the common practice of dividing soldiers into a handful of heroes versus common grunts whose only purpose is to demonstrate how awesome the stars are by being cut down by them en masse. I don't really see why the guy who fights with two spears is any better, morally speaking, than anybody else. An attempt to inject some comedy into the story during the second half seemed odd. For all the coolness early on, I was feeling rather ambivalent at the end. I'm not really detecting a riveting plot taking shape, just magically enhanced duels in which nobody of any importance wins or loses. Perhaps if this is only 13 episodes long I wouldn't mind committing to it, otherwise I'm not so sure.


I meant here:

animenewsnetwork.com/feature/2009-04-03

no more reviews?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Key
Moderator


Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 18222
Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley)
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:05 pm Reply with quote
kpk wrote:
SO... no more reviews?


Yeah, it seems like all of the new TV series that are likely to be subbed are now out, so it's time to close shop on the Spring Preview Guide. This season did better on coverage and promptness than last season, I think.

Overall, I thought the season's premieres started slow but finished strong, as most of the commonly 4+ rated series came in the second half of the run. We won't know how good the season is going to be for a few months yet, but my estimation is that this one was an average season overall. Nothing looks like a mega-hit (except maybe the new FMA), but there are several with potential against a swath of mediocre titles and only a couple of total turds.

This also definitely looks like the Season of the Game Adaptations; has there ever been such a high percentage of them coming out at once? There are, what, at least a half-dozen in this new season? Very little for true moe-focused titles, too (is there really one besides K-On?) against a wealth of fantasy series, which suggests that perhaps the moe craze is finally over.

So which ones are keepers for this season? Although Basquatch! (for visuals) and Crossing Game (for story) were the two most impressive premieres, East of Eden and Guin Saga are the ones I'll actually be watching, maybe also Valkyria Chronicles (although the second episode impressed me far less than the first). I may also have to watch some more of Asura Cryin' - at least until I figure out what the hell is going on there, anyway. A couple of others at least merit consideration a second look, but it's doubtful I'll follow out more than three.

What are the overall impressions of others on the new season?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website My Anime My Manga
HitokiriShadow



Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 6251
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:42 pm Reply with quote
The real stand out shows of the season for me are Eden of the East and Valkyria Chronicles, though the latter is heavily influenced by me being a big fan of the game and having a general idea of where things are going. Cross Game is off to a great start but I'm a bit more hesitant on that one since the first episode seems like a prologue. However, I have a feeling it will join Eden and Valkyria in my A grade category soon.

Full Metal Alchemist is off to a solid start but I wouldn't put it up with others, at least not yet.

Hayate the Combat Buter suffered a weak first episode (a combination of a relatively weak storyline being watered down and cramming 4-5 chapters into one episode while trying to use it to reintroduce the cast) but the second episode was much better.

Saki is pretty fun, even if I don't understand 90% of what's being said during the matches. The game is depicted is such a ridiculously over-the-top manner, that understanding the game is unnecessary.

K-ON is nice but nothing particularly special. It might be the kind of show that just grows on me as it goes along though.

I expect Tears to Tiara to get better, but its nothing special so far. I blame this partially on taking a half-episode's worth of content being dragged out over two full episodes. Phantom doesn't suffer from the same pacing issues, but its hard to get a read on just yet. Both are off to decent starts but little has happened as of yet. Basquash's main character annoys me quite a bit and the premise doesn't appeal to me, but I like Sela and Miyuki enough to continue for now.

Asura Cryin''s second episode was a significant improvement over the first, but its still decent at best. I need to see a bit more Guin Saga to decide how I feel about it. Shangri-la is okay but I'm not expecting much from it; it has some interesting elements in its premise but the execution is severely lacking and seems like they made a list things they thought sounded interesting/relevant or entertaining and tossed them in a blender without much thought put into it. Hatsukoi Limited surpassed my very low expectations and might be decent. Queen's Blade is trash, but its fun trash.

Tayutama was basically what I expected, which was a soulless, phoned in harem/h-game type series. I initially turned off the episode about two minutes after Hammer Girl showed up. Then I decided to try finishing out the episode and regretted wasting those ten minutes of my life.

-----

TL;DR version: Eden of the East and Valkyria Chronicles are awesome. Cross Game, Hayate and FMA are pretty good too.

Overall, there aren't many amazing shows but there are not many outright failures either. I have noticed the relative lack of "moe" or harem-ish series, and it is certainly interesting though one season does not a trend make.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
0utf0xZer0



Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 80
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:10 pm Reply with quote
4nBlue wrote:
Quote:
Hatsukoi Limited is this season's piece of high-grade eyecandy, where the girls are doe-eyed and desirable, yet lack the banality of the erogame world (the source material is, in fact, a manga) and the soft-colored backgrounds are an artistic work in their own right.

I find the comment about erogames weird after the praise for Nitro+ in the Phantom review. Most eroge are pure crap, but like you should be aware there is some good ones that deserve an anime adaption. Just because most eroge, like most of anime and manga, are crap is not enough of a reason to bash them in an unrelated review.


I would tend to say that the anti-erogame reviewers on ANN are biased against erogames unless they don't conform to the stereotypical image of one, which is why Aquaplus RPGs and Nitroplus games seem to review better than most.

Of the three reviewers on ANN whose thoughts on erogames I've evaluated, I would tend to say that Santos and Kimlinger let their anti-erogame bias affect the neutrality of their reviews, while Martin does not. To ascertain this, I ran a test case between reviews of a bottom tier erogame adaptations (Tayutama) and a more typical bottom tier anime (Kurogane no Linebarrel). I feel that the two actually have a lot of similarities in terms of flaws:
-Both have somewhat contrived plots for how the hero gets his girl or mecha. In fact, Linebarrel is worse in this regard: how much more "this doesn't make sense and is just an event to advance us from A to B" can you get than Linebarrel's first episode? It starts with having a mecha fall onto a guy, then has him wake up next to a naked girl. After he gets said girl dressed, mecha attack and the girl explains that he can summon a mecha by groping her boob. Of course, said mecha allows a newb pilot like him to totally own the more experienced bad guys. Say what you will about Tayutama's "contrived" circumstances, but the writers actually do a fairly good job at justifying the scenario at hand. Unlike in many supernatural girlfriend shows, the heroines love for the guy is even somewhat explicable due to the resemblance between Yuuri and the guy from the past.
-Linebarrel is less predictable, but only because it's hard to predict what the writer will pull out of his ass next.
-Tayutama has generic production values (which is a shame given that the promo art I saw for the game was amazing). Linebarrel has generic Gonzo style "obvious CG".
-Characterization of secondary characters is pretty bland in both. (Of course, Tayutama's are generic harem characters and Linebarrels are generic mecha anime characters.)
-Tayutama has a single strong point to balance the negatives out, and that's young Mashiro's combination of cute and badass. Linebarrel also has a single strong point, which is that the lead characters isn't your typical mecha pilot, instead being a self righteous asshole. In both cases, the ending of the first episode seriously undermines this strong point: in Tayutama, we don't know if adult Mashiro still has the more agressive, badass side, and in Linebarrel the end of episode "WHAT A TWIST!!!" is so headdesk worthy as to destroy confidence in the writer's abilities to capitalize on their unique lead.

Yet in spite of all these shared flaws, Linebarrel gets a 2.5 from Santos and Kimlinger, Tayutama a 1.5. In ANN review terms, that's the difference between passable entertainment and pure crap. Why? I can only conclude that these reviewers dislike generic harem elements in a way they don't dislike generic mecha elements. I don't know enough about Santos' review history to shed more light on whether that actually is the case for him, but I can say I'm pretty certain it's the case for Kimlinger, who in the fall preview guide pretty much eviscerated Chaos Head for having - you guessed it - generic harem elements, despite the fact the show is pretty unique for an erogame adaptation.

(BTW, I wouldn't say every review by these reviewers is necessarily bad. I found Kimlinger's Guin Saga review genuinely useful in that it convinced me to watch a rather enjoyable show, it's just that after his Nanoha review a while back and all the erogame adaptation reviews, I don't really consider his opinion on moe stuff worth much.)

Theron Martin actually rates Tayutama and Linebarrel exactly the same, so he comes out of this comparison looking pretty good in terms of not having an axe to grind against a genre. I think he would have sounded far more objective if he had left it up to the reader to decide if Tayutama's cuteness was enough to outweigh its flaws - after all, your thoughts on that probably determine whether you'll enjoy the show or not - but unlike the other two reviews I felt like the show was given fair consideration even though the general tone of the review was negative.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kyokun703



Joined: 06 Jan 2005
Posts: 2505
Location: Orgrimmar
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:16 pm Reply with quote
Let's see...

I'll probably keep watching Basquash, 07-Ghost, FMA:B and Ristorante Paradiso for now. Dropping Saki for the fanservice. Still need to watch Cross Game and Eden of the East. On the fence about Sengoku Basara and Hatsukoi Limited. SB was fun and all, but I just don't see it maintaining my interest. And I don't know if I'll be interested in HL if it jumps from girl to girl instead of following one couple. I'll probably end up dropping both of those.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
nightjuan



Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 1473
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 3:39 pm Reply with quote
4nBlue wrote:

I find the comment about erogames weird after the praise for Nitro+ in the Phantom review. Most eroge are pure crap, but like you should be aware there is some good ones that deserve an anime adaption. Just because most eroge, like most of anime and manga, are crap is not enough of a reason to bash them in an unrelated review.


I can't speak about the rest, but I would add that Phantom of Inferno, like a number of other games, had a non-pornographic release on DVD and on PS2 in Japan, which is probably a fairly good sign in terms of the quality of its story. In fact, it's one of those cases where one might say the resulting product probably benefits from implying rather than showing, if you know what I mean, and has a darker outlook right from the get go without any harem or skirt chasing elements per se.

Stretch2424 wrote:
Actually, I hope 07-Ghost isn't all that similar to Code Geass, because I'm not a big fan of CG. It was the uniforms, and the setting of aristocratic young officers serving an "empire", which set off the CG alarm in my head. However, although the Ghost manga may have preceded CG's airing on TV, I wouldn't be surprised if the makers of the Ghost anime don't modify it to be more like the wildly popular CG.


While I've barely paid any attention to 07-Ghost at the time of this writing (always subject to change), I'd say the similarities are visual, more than anything else, since even the setting seems to be different enough outside of the uniforms and the manga is both older and still ongoing...but the two anime series do share the same musical composer, though I actually prefer his previous compositions to what little I've heard of 07-Ghost's (so far).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
HitokiriShadow



Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 6251
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 4:25 pm Reply with quote
nightjuan wrote:

I can't speak about the rest, but I would add that Phantom of Inferno, like a number of other games, had a non-pornographic release on DVD and on PS2 in Japan, which is probably a fairly good sign in terms of the quality of its story.


A lot of H-games/"dating sims" get non-ero releases at some point. It says nothing about quality, only that the creators think they can milk more money out of it by releasing an all-ages version. I think most visual novels that get turned into anime also have all-ages releases of the games. Not coincidentally, you can find many of the game re-releases coming out around the same time the anime airs.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
nightjuan



Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 1473
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 6:47 pm Reply with quote
HitokiriShadow wrote:

A lot of H-games/"dating sims" get non-ero releases at some point. It says nothing about quality, only that the creators think they can milk more money out of it by releasing an all-ages version. I think most visual novels that get turned into anime also have all-ages releases of the games. Not coincidentally, you can find many of the game re-releases coming out around the same time the anime airs.


I'll accept that my interpretation doesn't really work for the genre as a whole, it was a mistake on my part and you are right to point it out, but then the question would be: why do the creators think an all-ages version would be successful without the porn? The exact reason will vary, but there has to be one.

I think there are many pornographic games out there that couldn't possibly have an all-ages release, or at least not a very successful one, because...frankly, all the appeal they have is nudity and sex. In the case of something like Kanon, for instance, all-ages releases actually make some sense because there is more to the story than that.

In this particular case, the story doesn't really follow the transparent, straightforward structure of a dating sim though, which was another one of my points, and the two specific all-ages releases I've referred to (DVD: 2001-2002 PS2: 2003) didn't coincide with either the current anime adaptation (2009) nor with the previous OVA (2004), but then again you could always argue they were already planning something behind the scenes.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Joe Mello



Joined: 31 May 2004
Posts: 2266
Location: Online Terminal
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 7:13 pm Reply with quote
0utf0xZer0 wrote:
I would tend to say that Santos and Kimlinger let their anti-erogame bias affect the neutrality of their reviews, while Martin does not.

Maybe I'm grasping but I thought reviews were, by their nature, subjective.

If any of the reviewers had any vendetta against anything, it'd be a little more visible, wouldn't you think?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
penguintruth



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 8462
Location: Penguinopolis
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 7:37 pm Reply with quote
I only picked up three programs this season- Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood, Dragon Ball Z Kai, and Shin Mazinger Z. It's enough. Last season I dropped Casshern Sins due to lack of time (you'd think I'd have plenty of time, since I have little else to do but write and sleep), and I've picked that back up since, too. So I've got enough shows to keep me busy.

Though I guess the shows I'm watching are all "repeats" in some way. But I have a feeling I'll be watching them all the way through.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address My Anime My Manga
Kalessin



Joined: 15 Aug 2007
Posts: 931
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:19 pm Reply with quote
Joe Mello wrote:
0utf0xZer0 wrote:
I would tend to say that Santos and Kimlinger let their anti-erogame bias affect the neutrality of their reviews, while Martin does not.

Maybe I'm grasping but I thought reviews were, by their nature, subjective.

If any of the reviewers had any vendetta against anything, it'd be a little more visible, wouldn't you think?


Reviews are definitely subjective and definitely subject to bias. Given some of the comments in the reviews with regards to harems and moe and such, I think that it's safe to say that some of the reviewers are not fans of those particular genres and are generally biased against them such that a show in those genres must be particularly good for them to like it. However, that's very different from a vendetta. If any of the reviewers truly hated a particular genre and had a vendetta against it, then I think that it would be very clear and that the scores for that genre would be very low regardless of the show's quality. I don't that that's the case here.

Each individual reviewer has their own likes and dislikes and will react to a given show in their own biased way. Regardless of how much they might try to avoid it, those biases will affect their reviews. However, it still gives us a perspective on the show in question, and with multiple reviewers, we get multiple perspectives and a better chance to get something close to an objective picture. But entertainment is highly subjective to begin with, so true objectivity is going to be impossible.

Really, as someone pointed out earlier in this thread, one of the main advantages of having people review shows like this is that because they review shows on a semi-regular basis, we can become somewhat familiar with their particular biases and how their opinions differ from ours and thus be able to gauge from their reactions what our reactions will likely be.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
0utf0xZer0



Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 80
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:37 pm Reply with quote
I was kind of hoping not to get dragged into this kind of debate again...

Sure reviews are subjective. But I would say that the point of a review isn't to voice your opinion, it's to give the reader a complete and accurate picture of what they're getting into. Injecting your personal biases into the review undermines that. At least, that's how I see it. I get the impression ANN might be a little more accepting of personal opinions in reviews than I am.

I never said the reviewers had personal vendettas against a genre or its tropes, but I do think they have a bias against harem shows, erogame adaptations, and moe shows. I would also say that if you're familiar with these types of shows, this bias is rather obvious. It's probably most notable in cases like Kimlinger's review of Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha due to the hyperbolic language used in these cases, but it's a pretty consistent feature in the work of the two editors in question.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Zac
ANN Executive Editor


Joined: 05 Jan 2002
Posts: 7912
Location: Anime News Network Technodrome
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:40 pm Reply with quote
0utf0xZer0 wrote:
I get the impression ANN might be a little more accepting of personal opinions in reviews than I am.


It's been said once, and then a million times - a "review" that does not contain an opinion is not a review, it's a plot synopsis.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website My Anime
HitokiriShadow



Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 6251
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:47 pm Reply with quote
nightjuan wrote:

I'll accept that my interpretation doesn't really work for the genre as a whole, it was a mistake on my part and you are right to point it out, but then the question would be: why do the creators think an all-ages version would be successful without the porn? The exact reason will vary, but there has to be one.

I think there are many pornographic games out there that couldn't possibly have an all-ages release, or at least not a very successful one, because...frankly, all the appeal they have is nudity and sex. In the case of something like Kanon, for instance, all-ages releases actually make some sense because there is more to the story than that.

In this particular case, the story doesn't really follow the transparent, straightforward structure of a dating sim though, which was another one of my points, and the two specific all-ages releases I've referred to (DVD: 2001-2002 PS2: 2003) didn't coincide with either the current anime adaptation (2009) nor with the previous OVA (2004), but then again you could always argue they were already planning something behind the scenes.


There are certainly many games that won't work well (or at all) as a non-pornographic game. For example, I couldn't imagine games with titles like "My Sex Slave is My Classmate" and "Suck My Dick or Die!" getting all-ages releases. I think its safe to say those don't have much aside from the sex.

But a lot of the games (say, Akane-iro no Somesaka, or Tayutama) actually have entertainment value outside of just the porn. They at least try to have some character development and give the girls a bit of personality and something to enjoy other than just sexually assaulting them. It doesn't have to be complex stories like Fate/Stay Night or even Kanon. People like to get into the stories because they find some sort of entertainment out of the developing romance or, more likely (at least where I usually hang out, most of us don't exactly have a very high opinion of 99% of the self-insert leads), just the characters being themselves. In other words, the same reasons many people like non-H-game stuff like Aria or Maria-sama ga Miteru.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous    Next
Page 41 of 44

 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group