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enurtsol
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And it's not like America didn't have its own period neither: In the early decades of Hollywood, if Negroes, who joined the profession of acting of their own volition, wanted to take the prominent on-screen route, as opposed to background extras, knowing full well there are some rules they had to follow and what kind of roles they were allowed to act. Of course, they can choose to betray those expectations of the masses of movie-going public at the time, but that meant those masses would no longer financially support their endeavors and stop paying for their movie tickets. So America should just shut up - it's just the way it should be. |
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Galap
Moderator
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Yes, but that's STUPID. |
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CrowLia
 Posts: 5505 Location: Mexico |
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It's not only that it's stupid and draconian, it's that it boggles the mind how people have completely assimilated the practice, to the point in which "that's just how it is" and no one even questions WHY
It's funny that you'd ask that because it was you, Ryan, who kept going and going about how KyoAni otaku had the right to feel betrayed by KyoAni and hate them because their money made them famous and thus KyoAni owed them and couldn't do anything that didn't pander specifically to their particular market. Funny how Free ended selling a lot more than all the recent KyoAni otaku shows |
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Lavnovice9
Posts: 276 |
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With all due respect, your analogy is stupid, if not tasteless. You're taking an issue of racial injustice where blacks had literally no other option and were threatened or even killed over and saying it's the same as a completely 100% optional career choice. If a woman does not like the rules of the idol industry, she can become a regular singer or musician like the tons female artists like Yumi Matsutoya, Mai Kuraki, Namie Amuro, Utada Hikaru, or Crystal Kay, where they are free to date, marry, and have children. You cannot compare the suffering of African Americans with a bunch of butthurt, crazed, industry haters who don't even know the difference between a singer and an idol. |
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504NOSON2
 Subscriber Posts: 647 Location: Body:Santa Barbara, CA ~ Heart:New Orleans, LA |
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enurtsol, that's a fallacious analogy, at best. You're comparing a period in American history that was characterized by segregation and legal discrimination and withholding of civil rights of an entire group of people, to girls being expected to act like they're single virgins for a couple of years. There was also massive amounts of openly expressed disdain for Black people among the white American population, at large. Black people were also a minority with a lower percentage than they (we) are now. Black actors also weren't revered by subgroups of Americans, given access to flourish in various other branches of the media, and given cult leader like status among movie-goers.
Idol stars in Japan have all of the aforementioned benefits, as well as freedom of opportunity to pursue whatever other careers they want. Remember, Idols are subset of entertainers that get full exposure and the benefits of a variety of careers in voice acting, acting in commercials, TV spots, movies, reality shows, etc. They aren't pigeonholed to certain roles, other than retaining the image of "purity". Last edited by 504NOSON2 on Fri Feb 28, 2014 3:41 am; edited 1 time in total |
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ATastySub
Past ANN Contributor
 Posts: 647 |
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Glad you spent several paragraphs to say
Thanks dude. Not like that's a reason for things like that to change. Or that the people defending it aren't horrible people. Nope, couldn't possibly be anything like that. |
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Mister Ryan Andrews
 Posts: 219 |
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That kind of argument won't win you any awards, mate 
No one needs to question why because people who know how the industry works already know why. Seriously, this isn't some grand mysterious concept that requires the mind of a college student who thinks they know how the world works after a semester of classes. It's literally in their contract they sign with the company and the image the industry is is founded upon. It's no different than any other job having its own set of requirements and expectations. Lavnovice9 brings up a great point: go be a non-Idol singer if you hate idol industry so much. This is what being an idol is. Idols are build on purity, late night anime is based on disk sales, Kamen Riders are built on appealing to middle aged Japanese house wives, and the wheels keep on turning.
I'm pretty sure I never said any of that, unless you can show me a post where I did. So rather than putting fake words in my mouth can you show some sources of how tons of fans were betrayed or whatever the issue was? Otaku seem to be eating that show up as well as fujoshi. |
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Galap
Moderator
Posts: 2354 |
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Let me rephrase it then: How do you get from the is to the ought? No one's contesting that people get mad when idols do things like have romantic partners. No one's even really contesting that there are 'rules' in place that forbid idols from doing that. It shouldn't be that way. Just saying that that's how it is in no way justifies it. |
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enurtsol
Posts: 14766 |
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Let me remind people that we're talking about Japan here, where females are treated close to 2nd-class citizens. Think about it. (Yes, Japan has laws - there are laws, and then there's practice. After all, J-lawmakers are made up of only 8% female. There's a reason guys can get away with so much in Japan that would be gender discrimination in many other places.) Last edited by enurtsol on Fri Feb 28, 2014 4:48 am; edited 1 time in total |
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CrowLia
Posts: 5505 Location: Mexico |
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It's cute that you thought I wouldn't bother looking for them Here animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=2931757&highlight=kyoani+money+otaku+free#2931757 animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=3040101&highlight=kyoani+otaku+money#3040101 animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=2831972&highlight=kyoani+otaku+money#2831972 Is this the moment in which you tell me you never knew of that other Ryan and you're in no way associated to him, that your showing up in this thread a day after RS was banned is purely coincidence? |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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^
He joined a month ago so he probably isn't RyanSaotome. Still, just to be sure, I'll PM Tony K. and ask him to check the IP numbers. Edit: I looked through Mister Ryan Andrews' posting history, and while his general attitude towards otaku and the Japanese industry are the same as RyanSaotome's, he differs in some key areas too, like how the former actually liked Free! while the latter thought it was a betrayal of the KyoAni fanbase. Plus Mister Ryan Andrews has a very different posting style that RyanSaotome. It is possible that RyanSaotome made a second account and changed his style and opinions somewhat to hide himself, but it seems like a lot of effort to go through. Especially when the account name is not attempting to hide and the account was made a month before he was even banned. We'll see what the mods say about the IP addresses. Last edited by dtm42 on Fri Feb 28, 2014 5:07 am; edited 2 times in total |
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ATastySub
Past ANN Contributor
Posts: 647 |
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If it is actually RyanSaotome I'd be seriously amazed that he started posting in the very thread he was banned in.
And I don't think Ryan Andrews has specifically said anything about Free, but the rants of otaku voting with their wallets and therefore demanding control of the industry are certainly there. As if these, "fans want sexism so sexism is ok," posts weren't enough. |
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CrowLia
Posts: 5505 Location: Mexico |
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I checked his join date first things of all, but I don't quite believe in coincidences. I also don't want to believe that all the Ryans in the world are horrible a person I disagree with politically twats. Of course, if they are indeed different people I'll apologize for making unfounded accussations, but I'm still calling their arguments BS. Also, since the second Ryan did ask when anyone had said anything about otaku feeling entitled to KyoAni and hating Free, the links are still valid to some extent, regardless of how many Ryans there are |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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I posted my edit after you wrote this, but he apparently liked it. animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=4187918#4187918 |
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ATastySub
Past ANN Contributor
Posts: 647 |
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Good point. I didn't notice that he called for evidence of anyone being upset about it. So on that note have an ENTIRE BLOG
http://mantearsflowingfree.tumblr.com/ And these are choice examples from a sea of tears. Not even close to needles in a haystack. The only reason anyone is trying to hush up the massive overreaction that happened is because, surprise surprise, FREE was a GOOD SHOW. It didn't humiliate it's cast for the sake of it's audience and, as the metric moe fans always stick to as being the divine right of the industry, it sold. Edit: Dtm, was typing this out when you posted. Ok, he liked it. That's fine, but doesn't change the fact that as soon as the show was announced (hell, even before it was a show and was simply a commercial) tons of anime fans threw hissy fits over KyonAni's betrayal. Trying to wave that away is pretty disingenuous. |
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