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REVIEW: Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha DVD

No, in fact, the only thing I've ever seen on this site that's made me not want to watch moe? The fans that come here in legions acting like they're some sort of oppressed minority on par with women not being allowed to vote. I've only seen maybe one or two short comments on why people should watch Nanoha. Most of you aren't doing that. Instead, you're wasting your energy saying "Carl should be fired" or "ANN has an agenda!" instead of saying WHY you like the show. So far, all I've gotten is that you don't think the whipping scene is fanservice. Okay, fine, that's a great, valid point. Anything else? Why do you like the show? It's moe? And...it has beams? Is that all?

The reason why it's good then is that it is like Sailor Moon, CCS, Dragonball Z, and Gundam merged together.

Emotionally complex plot with awesome actions sequences that have at least some decent form of TACTICS. It's tactics WITHOUT the drawn out explanations of how the special technique was created and how hard they trained to get it.

THAT is why Nanoha is awesome!

grgspunk wrote:

Quote: I personally think that the idea that this site has an agenda because the reviewers don't have the same tastes as you as ridiculous. I've seen high ratings given to shows like Kanon and Air here on ANN. There's people like you that are registered to the forum that like moe--hopefully, I'm assuming, for doing more than just complaining every time a reviewer doesn't agree with your point of view. The idea that ANN is some massive conspiracy to undermine the shows you like is ridiculous. I don't think I've ever read a review, news article, or column on this site that has made me go "oh, ew, everything in this one genre must suck". In fact, it convinced me to put Kanon and Air on my "want to watch" list on anime-planet. What, you think saying crap like "moe overkill" in Kanon's review isn't indicative of an inherent unfair bias for you?

No, because not everyone likes moe, and for those that don't, they might find it overkill. That volume was still given something like a B, was it? Key reviewed the entire series and it was positive. I'm pretty sure Bamboo gave it a high rating, too.

Your tastes are selective. That doesn't mean that everyone that doesn't share your tastes mean they're a bad reviewer.

1. Did you actually read the thread about all the criticism on the review about lacking internal consistency? Or not explaining why he score things like music a C, which for what it is worth have absolutely nothing to do with how moe or how bad the story is. Even if he thinks it's generic he doesn't say so, and there's no way to know. Yet, a C? Why not an A or a F? He could've given such a grade and there's no way to tell why.

2. There's another point on internal consistency. The review says as much about Nanoha treading on the tropes of the genre in a very precise manner, especially on the part of the character drama. In that end, it was compared with CCS and Tweeny Witches...and yet those shows have A and B+ kind of scores for "story." Why the huge dip? Sure, it failed to achieve those heights, but a D? I am partial to those in this thread who suggested those external biases sinking the score an extra grade as a result.

3. Someone made a comment about how less than 1% of the show was cited (and they are not even plot-significant things) in the review, repeatedly, which became the basis of a major criticism for the show. While that's his opinion, it does make you wonder if the reviewer made a call on just a small part of the show and it taints the rest of the show unfairly. Whether or not this is the case I don't know, but it leaves your readers in the dark. It could've been more clearly articulated in the review at the very least.

4. For a show that gets panned on the fanservice element, the review doesn't mention how frequent it is. I think this is more a factual point that helps people to gauge a more clear picture of what Nanoha is. If I haven't seen the show before I would probably walk away with a wrong image of just how fanservice-y Nanoha was. Amid naked elementary school girls indeed :pedobear:

I'm in a playful mood so I'll entertain

MorwenLaicoriel wrote:

No, in fact, the only thing I've ever seen on this site that's made me not want to watch moe? The fans that come here in legions acting like they're some sort of oppressed minority on par with women not being allowed to vote. I've only seen maybe one or two short comments on why people should watch Nanoha. Most of you aren't doing that. Instead, you're wasting your energy saying "Carl should be fired" or "ANN has an agenda!" instead of saying WHY you like the show. So far, all I've gotten is that you don't think the whipping scene is fanservice. Okay, fine, that's a great, valid point. Anything else? Why do you like the show? It's moe? And...it has beams? Is that all?

3. Someone made a comment about how less than 1% of the show was cited (and they are not even plot-significant things) in the review, repeatedly, which became the basis of a major criticism for the show. While that's his opinion, it does make you wonder if the reviewer made a call on just a small part of the show and it taints the rest of the show unfairly. Whether or not this is the case I don't know, but it leaves your readers in the dark. It could've been more clearly articulated in the review at the very least.

omoikane wrote:

1. Did you actually read the thread about all the criticism on the review about lacking internal consistency? Or not explaining why he score things like music a C, which for what it is worth have absolutely nothing to do with how moe or how bad the story is. Even if he thinks it's generic he doesn't say so, and there's no way to know. Yet, a C? Why not an A or a F? He could've given such a grade and there's no way to tell why.

Okay, tell me then, how frequent did you find the fanservice?

Of all the things he could have said, why'd he have to say something so stupid-sounding like "moe overkill"?

And another thing, I'm not here to convince anyone about how great the Nanoha series is: I'm here to talk about the review itself, as that's what the point of a "talkback" is about.

omoikane wrote:

I'm in a playful mood so I'll entertain MorwenLaicoriel wrote: No, in fact, the only thing I've ever seen on this site that's made me not want to watch moe? The fans that come here in legions acting like they're some sort of oppressed minority on par with women not being allowed to vote. I've only seen maybe one or two short comments on why people should watch Nanoha. Most of you aren't doing that. Instead, you're wasting your energy saying "Carl should be fired" or "ANN has an agenda!" instead of saying WHY you like the show. So far, all I've gotten is that you don't think the whipping scene is fanservice. Okay, fine, that's a great, valid point. Anything else? Why do you like the show? It's moe? And...it has beams? Is that all? 3. Someone made a comment about how less than 1% of the show was cited (and they are not even plot-significant things) in the review, repeatedly, which became the basis of a major criticism for the show. While that's his opinion, it does make you wonder if the reviewer made a call on just a small part of the show and it taints the rest of the show unfairly. Whether or not this is the case I don't know, but it leaves your readers in the dark. It could've been more clearly articulated in the review at the very least.

That was probably me. One of the big scenes he mentions is a spoiler[10-15 second clip of one of the main charachters being tortured by her mother for failing to aquire some gems for her. It shows her whipping her and some strips of clothing flayed off her back and bloody marks from the whip. ] Somehow this became an element of fanservice as he calls it and proof that the directors have a S&M fetish. Despite the fact that this is about .0008% of the show, it was worthy of being mentioned twice and the basis of proof that the directors have a S&M fetish. I'm personally not aware cruel treatment of a young girl is fanservice but it is to Carl apparently which seems really odd.

i figuire 13 episodes at ~22 minutes an episode = 286 minutes of anime or 17,160 seconds, of which those 17,000+ seconds 15 seconds prove a fetish.

"This show may not necessarily turn non-moe fans around, but..."

"Whether this show is right for you or not depends on whether you into the moe genre..."

"This show is best viewed if you have an appreciation for moe-style titles..."

Of all the things he could have said, why'd he have to say something so stupid-sounding like "moe overkill"? That's just begging for flak.

Rating: whatever it is you think the rating should be (of 5, but you can change that scale if you need to because it might be unfair)

Review: I like this show as much as you like it, if not more, or less. It's about people doing things. I enjoyed it, but also liked some parts more than I liked other parts, but I also loved some parts, so that was good. There are many attractive people in this show and I plan on enjoying their attractiveness throughout the show. In addition, the music was also something I liked about this show. And the animation was something I liked.

Also, things happened in this show. Some of them I liked, others I loved. If you like shows like this one, you will like this show.

Overall, Clannad After Story is a show that I liked as much as you did, if not more, or less.

MorwenLaicoriel wrote:

Okay, tell me then, how frequent did you find the fanservice?

Typically at most about once an episode for a 15 second period when she transforms. Their was one episode where they visited a hotspring on vacation that had a bit more fanservice but it was mostly aimed at the more adult supporting charachters.

Just to let you know, I don't look at whether a reviewer gives a "B" or a "C" for a title, as there's always the risk of inconsistency with the writing. I prefer to look at the writing, as that tends to be the most indicative of the reviewers opinion of the title due to the fact that there's more detail. It may have been positive overall, but I can't help but notice that they couldn't simply resist sneaking in a thorn or two with outlandish wording.

I mean, I could have easily worded that phrase and informed non-moe audiences in a bunch of ways without sounding like a biased jackass:

"This show may not necessarily turn non-moe fans around, but..."

"Whether this show is right for you or not depends on whether you're into the moe genre..."

"This show is best viewed if you have an appreciation for moe-style titles..."

Isn't the music a small detail to quibble on? "Music: C" basically tells me "the music is generic", why should he add a random sentence saying something that's actually said...at the end of the review? I don't see how one sentence would've made this a better review.

He compares it unfavorably to those two shows. How is CCS and Tweeny Witches any less moe than Nanoha?

If you're talking about the whipping scene, I've said it's a good argument that you (general you) didn't find the scene fanservicey. I still haven't heard a good argument for why I should watch the show, though--just why I shouldn't listen to Carl. Which isn't making me want to watch the show, since...the review made me want to watch the show. So ignoring what the review tells me means I should ignore wanting to watch the show. O...kay...?

Okay, tell me then, how frequent did you find the fanservice?

Brians9824 wrote:

omoikane wrote: I'm in a playful mood so I'll entertain MorwenLaicoriel wrote: No, in fact, the only thing I've ever seen on this site that's made me not want to watch moe? The fans that come here in legions acting like they're some sort of oppressed minority on par with women not being allowed to vote. I've only seen maybe one or two short comments on why people should watch Nanoha. Most of you aren't doing that. Instead, you're wasting your energy saying "Carl should be fired" or "ANN has an agenda!" instead of saying WHY you like the show. So far, all I've gotten is that you don't think the whipping scene is fanservice. Okay, fine, that's a great, valid point. Anything else? Why do you like the show? It's moe? And...it has beams? Is that all? 3. Someone made a comment about how less than 1% of the show was cited (and they are not even plot-significant things) in the review, repeatedly, which became the basis of a major criticism for the show. While that's his opinion, it does make you wonder if the reviewer made a call on just a small part of the show and it taints the rest of the show unfairly. Whether or not this is the case I don't know, but it leaves your readers in the dark. It could've been more clearly articulated in the review at the very least. That was probably me. One of the big scenes he mentions is a spoiler[10-15 second clip of one of the main charachters being tortured by her mother for failing to aquire some gems for her. It shows her whipping her and some strips of clothing flayed off her back and bloody marks from the whip. ] Somehow this became an element of fanservice as he calls it and proof that the directors have a S&M fetish. Despite the fact that this is about .0008% of the show, it was worthy of being mentioned twice and the basis of proof that the directors have a S&M fetish. I'm personally not aware cruel treatment of a young girl is fanservice but it is to Carl apparently which seems really odd. i figuire 13 episodes at ~22 minutes an episode = 286 minutes of anime or 17,160 seconds, of which those 17,000+ seconds 15 seconds prove a fetish.

But couldn't it have just as easily been left out? Even if it was the tiniest portion of the show, why was it included at all? Did people necessarily need to see it happen to get the point? Maybe that was the reasoning.

But couldn't it have just as easily been left out? Even if it was the tiniest portion of the show, why was it included at all? Did people necessarily need to see it happen to get the point? Maybe that was the reasoning.

Had the series devoted a little more time to crafting likeable leads (as opposed to moe archetypes) and less time to sating appetites for gloppy, codified emotional darkness, or more time to Shinbo's oddball humor and less time to Tsuzuki's thinly-disguised S&M fantasies,

Nanoha and Fate are given back-stories that paint them in shades of alienation and loneliness,