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v1cious
Joined: 31 Dec 2002
Posts: 6202
Location: Houston, TX
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Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 3:31 pm
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i can't imagine how anyone is surprised by this. Japan is the bastion of high tech materialism.
Last edited by v1cious on Mon Jun 19, 2006 4:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
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penguintruth
Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 8461
Location: Penguinopolis
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Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 3:39 pm
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Sometimes it's hard to follow who's speaking in some manga. The bubbles aren't always attached to the speaker and sometimes the floating bubbles have dialogue that can be said by any character on a particular page.
Last edited by penguintruth on Mon Jun 19, 2006 4:04 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Wolverine Princess
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1100
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Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 3:51 pm
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Quote: | Sometimes it's hard to follow who's speaking in some manga. The bubbles aren't always attached to the speaker and sometimes the floating bubbles have dialogue that can be said by any character in a particular page. |
And it's this reason why that for the life of me, I can't understand Liling Po. I've read the first volume five times over, and I still have trouble understanding who's talking and what's going on.
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Wyvern
Joined: 01 Sep 2004
Posts: 1556
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Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 3:52 pm
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In this instance, maybe Japanese manga publishers can take a tip from American ones. Nearly every english manga I've seen has a "how to read manga" page, usually on the inside back cover, that shows how to read unflipped manga. They could put something similar on the first page of Weekly Shonen Jump or whatever.
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SoulSlayer
Joined: 05 Jun 2006
Posts: 14
Location: Tokyo/Kansas
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Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 4:33 pm
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I’m officially confused, stunned, shocked, disgusted.....
oh and I may or may not be losing the will to live after this. I could almost cry but then I'm forced to remember I'm dead on the inside.
Parents need to start beating their kids again and get them reading.
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shattercone
Joined: 11 May 2004
Posts: 44
Location: Tempe, Arizona
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Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 4:50 pm
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So exactly how does one go about measuring the decline of kids knowing how to read manga? Does some researcher just ask 1000 random kids on the street if they know how to read manga? And if that's the case, do they do this every year?
This all sounds fishy to me... like some sort of tactic to get teaching manga into the schools. I can see a bunch of marketing specialists sitting around, "ooh, sales are down, let's find a way to get those kids reading manga again. I know, let's make it a social issue -- manga illiteracy! Now kids will have to purchase our books for school!"
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AstroNerdBoy
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Posts: 413
Location: Denver, CO
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Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 5:49 pm
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Kouji wrote: | Now wasn't it Al Kahn who said kids didn't read enough these days because they prefered free visual entertainment over reading and everyone accused him of being a liar? But when Japan makes the same statement everyone's all civil about it. Great job for being consistent with your reactions there, anime fans. |
Nice try in attempting to stir the pot.
Actually Mr. Kahn did say that, but this article isn't that Japanese kids don't want to read, but that they can't follow the panels. So this looks like an apples and oranges situation you are raising, but thanks for playing.
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AceRyonik
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 145
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Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 6:51 pm
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Maybe they don't know they're supposed to read right to left.
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Tsunami Jones
Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Posts: 14
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Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 6:58 pm
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AceRyonik wrote: | Maybe they don't know they're supposed to read right to left. |
Just look at it this way: With the way Japan is going, in a few years they won't even have any children! Problem solved
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Kuririn
Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 24
Location: PR
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Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 7:11 pm
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why do you say that?
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Haterater
Joined: 30 Apr 2006
Posts: 1727
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Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 7:48 pm
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I think Japan is having a low birth rate problem, so if they can't raise that rate up, there won't be many children in the future.
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LordRobin
Joined: 25 Feb 2003
Posts: 354
Location: Akron, OH
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Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2006 11:00 pm
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penguintruth wrote: | Sometimes it's hard to follow who's speaking in some manga. The bubbles aren't always attached to the speaker and sometimes the floating bubbles have dialogue that can be said by any character on a particular page. |
I think manga could learn from western comics in this respect. In a western comic book, there's no doubt who's saying what. Speech bubbles are clearly defined, with sharp pointy bits indicating the speaker. It obviously respresents speech.
In manga, by contrast, the "pointy" part of the speech bubble can be so subtle, I've had to search for it. Or sometimes it points inward!! It took me a moment to figure out that meant the speaker was off-frame.
Also, what's with whispering being represented by "cloud balloons"? In western comics, whispering is usually represented by a speech bubble drawn with a dashed line. It makes sense -- after all, whispering is just another form of talking. Western comics use the cloud balloon to represent internal thought. Manga doesn't use a bubble at all for thought, instead depicting it via narration text, or by "floating text" that never has any kind of pointer to indicate the thinker. (Mind you, the thinker's usually pretty obvious.)
So while I wouldn't say manga is in any way difficult to read, there's an argument to be made that it's less intuitive than our comic books.
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Pop-Art Samurai
Joined: 29 Nov 2004
Posts: 62
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Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 12:31 am
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Quote: | I think manga could learn from western comics in this respect. In a western comic book, there's no doubt who's saying what. Speech bubbles are clearly defined, with sharp pointy bits indicating the speaker. It obviously respresents speech...So while I wouldn't say manga is in any way difficult to read, there's an argument to be made that it's less intuitive than our comic books. |
Maybe it's because I'm pretty selective about my reading, whether it be manga or western comics, but my experience with western comics says otherwise. Granted, I know that what comes to mind for me is not the norm, that being things like Watchmen, V for Vendetta and some of Gaiman's work, but even in some more mainstream stuff it seems to me the trend is growing toward convoluted dialogue. But maybe that's just me.
And thinking of Watchmen, let's hope people who have problems reading manga never try reading that. I'm sure it would blow their minds... of course, it would blow most minds anyway, just for different reasons.
Quote: | Parents need to start beating their kids again and get them reading. |
Agreed whole-heartedly. Back in my day we read real books...
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uncutpokemon
Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Posts: 90
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Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 8:21 am
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Kouji wrote: | Now wasn't it Al Kahn who said kids didn't read enough these days because they prefered free visual entertainment over reading and everyone accused him of being a liar? But when Japan makes the same statement everyone's all civil about it. Great job for being consistent with your reactions there, anime fans. |
pk first kahn bastard says "us kids don't read" now some japanese people say that japanese kids can't read, whats next? god i hate al kahn
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DarkTenshi90
Joined: 04 Sep 2005
Posts: 440
Location: Nebraska
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Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 9:37 am
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I had no problem reading the first manga I got (go figure, it was Pokemon, but anywho), I mean, it's not terribly difficult to read, but maybe it was because it was flipped. I remember when I picked my my first unflipped manga (Wish), yeah... didn't really understand what was going on within it... took me awhile to get it, my sister had to point it out... and she dislikes manga and anime, weird.
So really, I can understand why younger kids have a tough time. Practice makes perfect, eh?
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