Forum - View topicHey, Answerman: Chick Habit
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PantsGoblin
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Encyclopedia Editor Posts: 2969 Location: L.A. |
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While my opinion is pretty much in line with Zac's on the article (that is, I think it's pretty biased and misleading), I have to agree with dormcat on fat (not ugly) cosplayers. I've been to conventions in Japan. I can't say I've seen anywhere near as many fat cosplayers as I have in American conventions... In fact , I can't remember seeing any... I do see ugly ones, but not fat. |
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DemonEyesLeo
Posts: 844 Location: Japan |
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I think we all are. @ Flake I mentioned this before: judging from a couple YouTube videos, a group on a social networking site, and the forums at a certain fansub site, a lot of people are liking the new dub. Oh, and I love the misspelling. |
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Haze
Posts: 14 |
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Hmm... thinking of anime and manga I've seen with a somewhat better representation of their female characters...
The best one that comes to mind right now is Sexy Voice & Robo. The manga is quite good and what I've seen of the live action series is also very good. Other series with strong female characters, that might have made the list if not for some aspects of their portrayal or for other characters in the series, are: Beck, Ghost in the Shell, Haibane Renmei, Hellsing, Kare Kano, NANA, Niea_7, Paradise Kiss, Planetes, Princess Mononoke and Uzumaki. Some last minute ones I just thought of: Beautiful People, Claymore, Ray, and Sky High. |
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MorwenLaicoriel
Posts: 1617 Location: Colorado |
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I was going to bring up that anime! ^^ Ran's a good example--particularly, from what I've seen of the series so far, she's portrayed as being very attractive to guys because of her independence and strength. But, she's never really sexualized, at least from what I've seen. (I'm currently watching the show.) Also, another one that comes to my mind (you probably all know the series I'm going to say) is Duck/Ahiru from Princess Tutu. She's never shown as a physically strong character (the opposite, in fact), but she's got a strong and realistic personality. Also, even though a certain character feels the 'need' to protect her, on at least one occasion Duck jumps in front between him and another swordsman, refuses to let him fight, and proceeds to protect HIM. (A great thing about Princess Tutu is pretty much every main character protects another one of the main characters at least once, regardless on if they're male or female. Neither Duck or Rue is purely a damsel in distress, even if they have moments where they need help.) Also, on the subject of strong females, we've got a great thread about women in anime in the anime section of the forums right now.
Actually, I've wanted to dye my hair pink for a while, and haven't had the courage to do it. XDDD (Although I'm not fat. I could be thinner, but I'm not fat. ...Yet.) This was a really, really interesting column. ^^ I defiantly like it better than the questions about fansubs and Anime Armageddon. |
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Keonyn
Subscriber
Posts: 5567 Location: Coon Rapids, MN |
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FYI, try to keep the listing to a minimum guys. Don't just list some series that go against the grain, but go in to a bit of detail on that.
I agree with you on a lot of the titles you mentioned, however in some of those titles like Ghost in the Shell the strong female lead is still objectified to a significant degree sexually. Haibane Renmei though is a perfect example as it consists of a primarily female cast that is conservative, not ridiculously well endowed, generally intelligent and diverse in their personalities and character depth. Another is Kino's Journey as Kino is female but is also strong willed, in control and exhibits a realistic array of personality and demonstrates a lot of character depth. Unfortunately you must also consider that Kino is shown to be very tomboyish to the point some people who've seen the show mistakingly believe Kino is male until they get to the episode that unmistakingly shows otherwise. Even Digimon has had its share of strong female characters, although it's had a few cliche anime females to add to the mix. However, picking out a few titles that go against a common trend doesn't necessarily make that trend untrue. You can say most political ads are attack ads and somebody could point out some examples of those that aren't, but in the end most of them still are despite those examples. It's no secret that females in anime aren't portrayed in the best of lights. From the large busty females with impossible figures to the strong but selfish and vicious females that populate other titles and everything in between there are just a lot of examples of cliche anime females in every genre that make ya cringe everytime ya see 'em. It's such a common trend that people who aren't even in to anime are familiar with it and when asked many of those people will point it out as a trait of anime, for better or worse. Sure you can point out a reasonable number of examples that counter the belief, but sadly that stack would likely pale in comparison to titles that back it up. [On a side note, if the old Answerman talkback thread stays above the new one I may just have to strangle someone, considering the circular neverending nausea inducing debate taking place in there] |
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Ai no Kareshi
Posts: 561 Location: South Africa |
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Let me pose a question. Ridiculously busty women and persistent fan service aside, does a strong female character no longer count as a strong female character the moment she is shown to have something of a figure or, say, becomes the target of a dirty joke?
One more thing I would like to point out is that there probably are just as many stereotyped male characters out there. Just because a girl has a stock or dull personality doesn't automatically make her a weak character or basis for a complaint against sexual discrimination. That kind of thing is abundant in anime. |
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Kenotic
Posts: 167 |
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Sorry about that, I mentioned why I loved those series I mentioned in another thread, but I'll recap on the two you didn't mention. Boogiepop Phantom is impressive in part because of the psychological horror of the series, but also that the main female cast seems to be well-grounded. There are no pinups here, and the series demands that some of its characters be intelligent enough to figure out what is going on. Even the naive characters aren't played for laughs and demeaned, instead they're tragic characters (usually taken out or corrected by other females).
Oddly enough, she still seems to get proposed to/hit on a few times. Even funnier to me is that people can see the whole series and conclude that she's a guy. (BTW - Hi from about 15 miles and a detour up 35W!) |
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar Posts: 16935 |
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No she still counts as a strong character provided those physical traits don't start outweighing what makes her a strong character. They can be there but they have to be in balance and not overshadow any good aspects on the female. |
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Hon'ya-chan
Posts: 973 |
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Clearly Geoffrey Kelley is a plant of Bandai. DAMN YOU BANDAI!!
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belisarius
Posts: 203 Location: Concord, NC |
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Re: Obese cosplayers
Obesity rate in Japan - Less than 5% Obesity rate in America - Hanging around 25% Nothing to do with the fans, everything to do with the culture and diet. There's just more fatsos here. Also in before "I DEMAND A SOURCE FOR YOUR SLANDEROUS NUMBERS" http://www.obesityinamerica.org/geographic.html |
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Lampton
Posts: 6 |
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When I first read the question regarding "strong female leads/characters" in anime, I immediately thought of "Claymore".
In fact, pretty much every female characters I saw on that show was pretty strong, and I never really got the idea of "fan service" in any scenes including the ones with nudity. Each character never had to rely on fan service, "moe", or any general image some female characters are slapped with in many anime. Also, now that I think about it, I think that show also had an idea of feminism presented in it, as well. Not as in "feminazi", but more in showing these women present themselves as dominant figures, even when provoked by male characters for being female. |
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Tyrenol
Posts: 398 Location: Northern California |
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I, for one, wish that there are more black (African-American) people represented in anime.
Or are the last "good" "black" anime characters Dearka Elsman and Loran Cehack from Gundams SEED and Turn-A respectively? As for female anime characters: I usually see them as "vicious monsters who will readily kill a man for no reason at all." The weak girls, the teasers, the strong silent types, and women created under Hayao Miyazaki. But the one I usually find are the ones that hate and will kill men. But that's not really true either. Am I right? And about anime being superior over what America makes: It's kind of a hard question to answer since most animation right now is made somewhere in Asia. Hey! Here's an equation: Japanese toys + American directors = Transformers 2007 movie. 3rd in summer box office hits(?) More "it was a'ight" than anything else. It's better together than apart. The entertainment industries all over the world have yet to learn... |
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ikillchicken
Posts: 7272 Location: Vancouver |
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In S.A.C.? Definitely. However, I would disagree if were talking about the original. Without a doubt there was plenty of nudity, but I always found it to be very non-fanservicey. Also, though she was by no means bad looking, she was really not nearly as flashy as her SAC counterpart. When you put it all in context with the concepts of the movie, I wouldn't really say it was ever presented in a sexual way. |
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Foaming Foamer
Posts: 6 |
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Shurei Ko from Saiunkoku Monogatari is a good example of a positive portrayal of women in anime. She is strong-willed and intelligent, she is my role model!!
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Steroid
Posts: 329 Location: At home, where all good hikikomori should be |
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Funny. If a male character is shown as a sex object, with the popular charactaristics accentuated, no one complains about objectification. But if it's a female character they do. Seeing all the counterexamples of what "strong" women in anime should be, Utena, San from Mononokehime, Kino, etc., it seems that to be a strong female, you have to be, well, masculine. Is that the feminist ideal? To destroy femininity? Don't see how that's a good thing.
Oh, and just a procedural note: I love how each Answerman column has a subtitle like Chick Habit, so I can tell the forum threads apart. It's like I say: subtitles are always better. |
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