Forum - View topicShigurui (TV).
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DKL
 Posts: 1951 Location: California, USA |
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Shigurui
I wasn't quite sure where to put this, but this show has apparently started airing... I uh... managed to get the official promotinal trailer from the site: http://www.wowow.co.jp/anime/shigurui/asx/shigurui_promo2_500.asx It looks EXACTLY like Texhnolyze... but with samurai. So... can anyone kinda expand on what the show is about? (besides being supposedly violent) There doesn't seem to be anything in the ANN encyclopedia. Yeah, I wish that this opening post could be a little meatier, but there isn't much info to go on, so, hopefully, Japanese readers can expand on this adaptation of a supposedly infamous work. |
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HellKorn
Posts: 1669 Location: Columbus, OH |
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Technically Shigurui isn't supposed to start airing until the nineteenth. The first episode got a "preview" of sorts.
You have a lot old guys in both. (I still remember the interview with Ueda and ABe, particularly the latter's comments on how it was different to create characters designs that were distinctive from each other for "so many oyaji," or somethin' like that.) Actually, I do wonder why Madhouse went for Hirotsugu Hamazaki and Hidetoshi Kaneko. Hamazaki now has one of the most distinctive directing styles that I've seen in anime, having seen Texhnolyze and skimmed through the first episode of Shigurui (no English subs yet). With Kaneko as the art director, I would love to have another series as them together after Texhnolyze because visually there isn't anything else like it out there, nor is there anything in anime that focuses so greatly to tell its story through the visuals (aside from Angel's Egg, and Serial Experiments Lain to a lesser extent). It's an important storytelling element which I feel is undervalued/underappreciated by many fans, especially when considering that anime is a visually symbolic medium first and foremost. In light of that, I ask myself: is Hamazaki the right guy to do Shigurui? I don't know the source material (the original novel that the manga and anime are based on), so I don't know how the story is supposed to flow. I've also kept myself from reading the first three chapters of the manga that are available via scanlations, so I can't say one way or another there. Hamazaki's direction, which is about as polarizing as they come, suited Texhnolyze because of the atmospheric, visually symbolic approach fit with the type of unconventional storytelling that one would sooner find in an art film than an anime. But Shigurui? Well, it doesn't come across as that type of story to me, for obvious reasons, so I'm wondering if having him in this position is "the right thing to do." Guess we'll have to wait and see. It's one of the anime that I've definitely been looking forward to this summer season (which has the potential to have as many quality series as 2006 did as a whole, which makes me believe that last year was just an overall stinker in spite of the excellent works that managed to surface through the muck). And hey, it's Madhouse, so I'm definitely in.
Taken from a place I'm not allowed to link to:
Edit: Clarified a certain point. |
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DKL
Posts: 1951 Location: California, USA |
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Well, given that it's violent, it could be that they went with Hamasaki since his stuff in Texhnolyze
(and, I'm assuming Highlander *which he storyboarded with Kawajiri... uhh... I have a feeling that one of his is specifically the scenes with Marcus and Moya in it*... though, it says "Hiroshi Hamasaki" there *hence my confusion, since this is what it also says on the Texhnolyze DVDs... in fact, there was no reference to Texhnolyze when reports of this first came out and I was kinda posting about why that was... however, after having seen the actual product, I'm pretty sure it's him*) had this tendency to make an "impact" mainly because of the excellent and atmospheric use of perspective and detailed facial reactions that properly conveys grimmace or whatever; when people got hurt, it was violent, but there was this emphasis on potraying it and the reactions pretty realistically. Well, moreso in Texhnolyze, but if you've seen that sequence in Highlander where Moya and Marcus meet, it was kinda like that (though, I could be wrong altogether with my assumption on that one... it's purely speculation). (though, I was still fond of Ichise's initial reaction when he lost his arm where it's not quite "my s*** has been ruined", but more of "my livelyhood has been ruined") Also, whoever was putting the production together probably thought that the original subject matter was kinda bizzare and surreal (or that its "filmmaking" should be as such *meaning the staging and whatever in animation would be more appropriate if it was done in a way that you would normally see in live-action film*), so maybe Hamasaki was the one up to task. But yeah, the trailer was awesome (individual pebble animations = awesome). That said, I was under the impression that the two characters (a blind guy and a one-arm guy) were actually fighting in the finals... and that we see a flashback of their violent lives and how that lead up to their duel. I must've been wrong. |
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darkchibi07
 Posts: 5470 |
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Is it just me, or does the Age Rating in the entry says "Adults Only"?
This is a TV series, right? |
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DKL
Posts: 1951 Location: California, USA |
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Yeah... I think it's 12 episodes...
But I'm not sure since info is all over the place. I sure hope someone subs this... Or, you know, some one brings it over (preferred). That said... for something that seems like it's kinda niche, I'm still wondering where they get the money to produce stuff like this; the... DVDs sell well? |
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HellKorn
Posts: 1669 Location: Columbus, OH |
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Well, I just finished the first episode of Shigurui. It'll be a rather interesting watch considering I'm going to be re-watching Texhnolyze come the 24th. It'll be a back and forth viewing of ultra-super detail with cinematic shots and all sorts of hyper-violence, rivalries and old men composed of a color palette that is only rivaled by the greatness of Masaaki Yuasa (Kemonozume, Mind Game).
Frankly, I can think of very, very few things that could bring me anywhere near as much joy in anime as the above.
Yeah, that's something I definitely want to highlight, since the only other director in anime that actually stresses for the subtle and painfully detailed expressions would be another Madhouse favorite, Satoshi Kon. Kon's sensibilities, though, are notably different from Hamasaki, so even then the comparison doesn't serve to fully illustrate how much the latter stresses importance of facial reactions that do not rely on those incredibly annoying visual and aural cues that most anime have. Such examples: Freakshow 01 Freakshow 02 Freakshow 03 And just for the hell of it, I was rather surprised when there was such detail given on this: Man Meat Seriously, I don't think I've ever seen male nipples given that much realistic attention to before in anime. Hamasaki's use of lighting is also important, as there were numerous shots that reminded me of the black, white and grey images that we also saw in Texhnolyze, such as this bad-ass image of Ichise at the end of episode twelve. The sunlight shown at the duel between Fujiki and Irako captured the boiling tension as the spectators -- which also includes us, the audience -- are aghast at these two unbelievably focused and determined cripples square off to satisfy the visceral desires of a twisted lord.
I think you got it more or less right, actually, unless the fansubbers translation of the date is just horribly off (uncertain of whether Fujiki and Irako are in the finals, which I'm doubtful they are considering the audience's reaction indicates that this is the first time bearing witness to the two monstrosities). The flashback is one thing that aggravated me a bit, though. I loved the direction, art was fantastic, serious and gruff seiyuu fitting for a bunch of old men with the lone vengeful daughter, no samurai that looked alike at all, etc. However, I wished that they had either gone on with the duel and we saw its completion, and then got an idea of what's going on through flashback, or just simply started of with the flashback. It interrupts the flow, and I find it a nuisance whenever that device is used, particularly in the first episode (oh, Berserk and Gungrave, what mistakes you've made). Overall, in spite of the gripe about the flashback, I got heaps of enjoyment out of the first episode. Madhouse and Hamasaki seem to have done it again. The direction is polarizing as hell, and I can imagine that a lot of people would flock to this story, but I really have some high hopes for this short series, and it does have the potential to be done quite well. I want this bloody baby licensed. Come on, Geneon!
Considering that Shigurui is a novel turned manga turned anime, and is apparently twelve episodes, I don't have much of a doubt that this thing was fed a good, healthy budget. But yeah, how the hell does Madhouse manage to produce such a high rate of unconventional material along with so many mainstream hits that do not cut back on quality and consistency? |
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DKL
Posts: 1951 Location: California, USA |
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Wow... I actually remember that one; that's after: spoiler[Ichise found those guys who trapped his father, right?] (I mean... I'm pretty sure it is... you don't just forget images like that) Ha... he totally ruined their s***. That said, I'm actually about to see Kemonozume as well (which mainly got sparked since Osamu Kobayashi did an episode... well, and it's yet another Madhouse show I haven't seen yet)... I've seen Mind Game, but I'll play it completely honest here: Masaaki Yuasa is too unconventional for me; I don't know if it's the style of his art or if it's the fact that the storytelling style is a little too niche... In the end, I'm still the kinda guy who likes very mainstream and simple entertainment; so in that way, he's not really for me... Hamasaki I can take since he has that beautiful art to accompany his different storytelling style; it holds my attention since there's a lot to look at outside of the focal point of conveying emotion (and he actually gets the surreal "feeling" down, unlike Ryutaro Nakamura, who couldn't quite grip me in Lain... Kino's Journey was a lot better though, but it took a while for the ideas and the storytelling to meld together). Yuasa does come across as respectable though (and, unlike a lot of directors, has a visual style of his own... I mean, it's distinctive as hell, for serious) and I won't really take away from people who enjoy his stuff; I'm just saying that I'm not "hardcore" enough... or something. I actually talked about Mind Game before on the other board... I should probably post it here. But yeah: I dunno... what I like is all over the place. |
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angel_lover
 Posts: 645 Location: UK |
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I watched episode 1 earlier today and was completely at a loss as to what to make of it. I found it stunningly beautiful, yet also quite repulsive. It also looked as though it had an animation budget of approximately zero, as there was very little actual animation in it. Maybe the fansubs weren't helping, but I found it totally confusing too. And when it got to the bit where spoiler[the blind guy stabs himself in the foot and then someone says something about this is his ultimate victory technique] I really began to wonder if it was supposed to be a comedy. Maybe the whole thing is going over my head? I have to admit that I couldn't stand Texhnolyze, so maybe that has something to do with it.
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DKL
Posts: 1951 Location: California, USA |
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I'll have to disagree with you on the animation budget; all the little subtle nuances of movement were there... it was quite stunning and had exactly what I really like from good animation: aesthetically-pleasing movement. Talk about this later... just finished episode one, but I'm too lazy to type something up. |
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HellKorn
Posts: 1669 Location: Columbus, OH |
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Yeah, it's from that scene. There's actually some really excellent examples of facial in Shigurui that reminded me of a lot of desperate, shocked, and downright furious faces. (In addition to that memorable scene I linked to above, in the final episode where spoiler[Ichise arrives at the opera house, realizing a rooted Kano was the one that ultimately killed Ran. I have never seen a character in an anime looked so royally pissed off without some sort of really goofy "emo" facial contortions that you get in, say, a Sunrise show.]) One touch that really unnerved me successfully towards the end of the first episode of Shigurui was spoiler[Fujiki's two broken fingers. Really, I don't get bothered by most violence in entertainment, but it's those small things, like broken fingers, which are presented realistically that can really creep into your mind and send shivers up your spine.] And glad to know that you're going to check out Kemonozume at some point. It's a real treat, and while not a masterpiece, it's still an excellent example of what anime can accomplish. I'd also somewhat disagree on your thoughts about Nakamura, though I would agree on that he doesn't capture surrealism as well as Hamasaki (or Kon, for that matter). There's a level of atmosphere present in his two most prominent works (Lain, Kino's Journey), but I also get the impression of a disconnect between the viewer and the world itself, whereas Kon and Hamasaki allow a more personal connection with their settings (much like I noted above with the audience -- both in the show and the viewer(s) -- being shocked at Irako and Fujiki's oddities).
I'll second DKL's statement on the level of animation. Hamasaki's style doesn't demand for constant movement (and really, outside of something like Denno Coil, another Madhouse production, you just don't see that in anime), but when there is movement there is a lot of detail given to it. Take the three "freakshow" pictures I gave above, and you'll see a lot of realistic movement to the man's facial expressions; with any other director you'd have some lip flaps with maybe some narrowed eyes to show his pain, but with Hamasaki you are damn guaranteed to see all of those little details brought to light. Cloe said it in another thread (not exact quote, but I think it holds the same implication): the best animation is one that goes largely unnoticed by the audience (I think this was said in regards to Kyoko's pigtails in Denno Coil, and how wonderful they're handled). Perhaps she'll come by and clarify?
In what way? Just curious.
I want to see you gushing about the gorgeous Madhouse visuals, damn it. |
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DKL
Posts: 1951 Location: California, USA |
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Actually, the script for the subs were kinda weird, to be honest; I need to go back and revisit this as in some scenes, I was under the impression that something else was being said given that it didn't flow with what was going on.
But damn, I had a great time watching; the part with that dude in your picture shocked the hell out of me. Like: spoiler[At first, thanks to the animation, I was under the impression that he was friggin' scared of that leader dude as hell (because he was presenting an opposing view point about the tourny thingy)... but it turns out to be something more than that: his guts are all... uhh... how do I put this? ... Having a hard time being kept in.] And yes: it all looks PAINFUL as hell, but not grossly exaggerated; I was pretty impressed. Also, I wasn't too disoriented by the flashbacks... If you think of it as flashbacks in "portions" (where a sequence is played out before moving backwards again), it's not really all that disorienting... But then, my explanation doesn't make sense. As for animation... yeah, there's a lot of SUBTLE details; little things like cloth movements, coherent hand movements, facial expressions, etc. It's friggin' amazing for TV anime. Just because the movement isn't all bombastic doesn't mean it's cheap. |
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Jedi General
 Posts: 2485 Location: Tucson, AZ |
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Shigurui: Death Frenzy (note the resurrection time of this post as the U.S. release on DVD and Blu-ray)
The new Shigurui skin reminded me that I wanted to start a thread about the series once FUNimation's complete box set was out. Technically the set isn't due out for a couple of days, not that it really matters much. I got my copy of the Blu-ray version in the mail over a week ago and it's probably already on store shelves by now anyway. Besides, what better time to start a discussion than when ANN features a Shigurui skin? WARNING: Long-winded raving forthcoming. -------------------------------------- I watched the fansubs of this one last year, not long after FUNimation announced the license, in fact. I fell in love with it immediately. So much so, I had to tear myself away from the experience each and every time I sat down to watch or I wouldn't have been able to stop. Yes, it's a series that is unflinchingly violent and disgusting, but it's just so awe-inspiring. It's as if Madhouse set out to challenge viewers to find such a grotesque series to be beautiful, even though it may seem at first glance to be the polar opposite. Mission accomplished, Madhouse. It's superbly atmospheric, thanks to the skilled and methodical direction, the deliberate voice work (in both languages), the detailed, yet bleak art, the subtle and also incredibly stylish animation, the eerie sound production, and one cannot forget the fantastic music. Granted, it's not perfect, but the amount of effort put into this production is astounding, as the attention to detail is highly notable. FUNimation's tagline is spot-on as well. "The beauty is in the kill" sums up Shigurui's unique visual atheistic quite nicely. Just need to couple all this with a compelling storyline, and you've got a winner on your hands. I'll say it again: Mission accomplished. Basically, the story revolves around Gennosuke Fujiki and Seigen Irako and their quests to become the successor to Kogan Iwamoto and his prized style of swordsmanship. <--- Sounds rather generic, I know, as samurai epics have been done plenty of times before and all the gag-worthy graphic violence and squirm-inducing sexual content could have easily brought the whole series crashing down were it in the wrong hands. HOWEVER! This show succeeds due to its nigh impeccable sense of style, its rhythmic pacing, the nonlinear narrative, its palpable atmosphere, and the fact that there aren't any true heroes in the story. Not a single character in the series has any real sense of ideals - all they truly care about are either themselves, the dojo, or both. They'll do just about anything if it is in the best interest of one or both of those things, making headway for some highly disturbing imagery and the like. A simply delicious work of art, Shigurui is. I sincerely hope more of the manga is adapted by the same staff in the future, since only a portion of the story is covered in the anime. Also, I've watched 8 episodes in English, and I can honestly say that we've got another solid FUNimation dub on our hands. Not to mention Shigurui looks amazing in high-definition. -------------------------------------- Anyway, that's enough of my long-winded raving about how great the show is. Check it out for yourself if I've managed to interest you. If you have already seen or are currently watching Shigurui for the first time, then this thread is now officially open for discussion. |
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Mistypearl
 Posts: 517 |
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I'm really suprised I haven't heard of this before, today is the first time I've heard of it. I really would like to see the series, but theres only so much gruesomeness I can take personally, though the artwork seems very nice :/ Hmm. I'll still have to see.
Very curious though. |
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S.Canton
 Posts: 26 |
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I hadn't heard of this either to be honest. I've seen the advertisements posted, and starting looking into it, and now I want to check it out; looks interesting.
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Ausdoerrt
 Posts: 481 |
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I watched most of it when it just came out - it's a show with a great setting, and great style. It's nice to see something grotesque as this once in a while.
On the other hand, I did feel like the substance was lacking a bit - the story was pretty simple - and the violence was at times overdone (although it did get the point across). I'd give this show an A+ for the athmosphere and setting, and a C for substance. |
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