Forum

Catsplay wrote:

Whoa whoa whoa, Prisma Illya IS legitimately good. Have you seen/read 3rei!? It has some of the best spins on the classic Type Moon story telling I've seen in awhile, with the current arc being absolutely amazing.

First two parts are only a typical magical show though (the 2nd one less so). I'm a bit mixed on the third part. On one hand, it is what you say, on the other hand, the pacing is all off, and the genre shift is nothing short of extreme. I'll probably marathon it when all is said and done to form a better opinion of it.

I will say that even if you aren't too keen on Illya as a whole, I'd still recommend the movie (which has nothing to do with Illya ironically enough). It's basically Heaven's Feel Shiro condensed down into a neat entertaining package.

Overall worst entry for me would be the original Fate/Extra. Nero and Tamamo are great, but the battle system is trash, and the enemy masters and servants are mostly only passable at best. Fate/Extella has a good story at least, if only because of the third route.

Stevangelion wrote:

Since when did people start disliking UBW? It's incredible. Fate/Apocrypha was a fun watch as well. Do anime viewers need to be shaken to their core in order to say they kind of liked a series? Just sit back and enjoy it, not everything has to change your philosophy on life.

Well, to be fair, UBW does have more than a few issues. Most of them stem from it being (Al way too Nasu and (b) the middle part of a story most people don't know how ends. No route of Fate can be completely understood without the others. That's just not how the narrative was structured. There's a reason you have to go through Fate then UBW and then HF.
As for point A, Nasu does have a pretty peculiar style. A very literary style. You gotta be invested in the ideas presented there in order to fully enjoy what's going on. That's easier to achieve them you're seeing the world from the eyes of Shirou like in the novels but not so much in an anime. And when we do get an experience similar to the novels... It gets wordy. And then we have people saying Shirou's dilemma is about his gender role or something like that.
All that to say, Nasu is hard to adapt and his works are harder to digest than most so people thinking UBW is bad and Apocrypha is good is bound to happen. The latter just makes for a better entertainment. Even Fate Zero us dumbed down from FSN if only because Urobuchi was writing a tragedy (an excellent one, mind you) and not what amounts to a long winded urban fantasy rumination on date and the nature of human evil. Nasu is graduated in human studies and, oh boy, does it show. When he's not writing stupid scenarios about aliens from the future trying to get revenge on Saber faces, he's going full dissertation mode.

jr240483 wrote:

getumbuck wrote:

Truly my least favorite entry into the Fate series. I mean the animation in the final few episodes was all over the place. I literally was getting sick as styles started changing left and right. I read the first two books, but found the story beyond confusing in anime form. I'm shocked people could even understand what was happening, considering so much was cut out of the story. Vlad's transformation though hurt, the anime really did bastardize one of my favorite moments from the novel and made Dracula look so dam stupid. I mean if you like crap just blowing up, I suppose this is the show for you, but I really got little more than that out of this story, at least in anime form.

i dont think they had a choice in that. if they had really tried to make vlad's transformation exactly like the novel, it more or less would have backfired on them big time.

also i had a feeling despite his last name, they weren't going to have him or his ambitions as dark as kirei. basically they have both of them as carbon copies of shiro emiya. though at least persona wise cause basically both of their personalities are the exact same as emiya. especially in the visual novels. specifically during the unlimited blade works route and the beginning of hollow ataraxia.

How would turning Vlad into a terrifying vampire of doom of backfired on them. It's literally my favorite part of the novels. Also Shiro was way more badass when he kills Dracula, in the books. In the anime Dracula looks unbelievably stupid, in his vampire form and Shiro kills him almost like it's an afterthought. Truly the worst moment of the show for me, but there were several others that angered me as well. They really did rush Avicebron and Jack's story arcs, to the point that they almost felt silly in anime form. Maybe this wouldn't have been an issue if they were more focused on telling a story and a little less focused on action, action and more action, each week.

killjoy_the wrote:

Stevangelion wrote:

Since when did people start disliking UBW?

From about when it started airing to the triple episodes about Shirou v Archer.

It's funny, I can totally understand why people would begin to dislike it at that point, but for me it was just the opposite. I found the first half of UBW to be pretty boring, but I thought it picked up quite a bit once the Shirou/Archer stuff began.

Of course this might also be because that's where it diverges the most from the original FSN anime, so if you've seen that series you're just kind of waiting for FSN to get to the new stuff.

I like UBW, I think it works quite well as a companion/conclusion to Zero's story, even if it's not nearly as good. But its flaws put it below Apocrypha and Zero.

Now we're left to wonder how Extra will do once Netflx sees fit to bestow it upon us.

encrypted12345 wrote:

Catsplay wrote:

Whoa whoa whoa, Prisma Illya IS legitimately good. Have you seen/read 3rei!? It has some of the best spins on the classic Type Moon story telling I've seen in awhile, with the current arc being absolutely amazing.

First two parts are only a typical magical show though (the 2nd one less so). I'm a bit mixed on the third part. On one hand, it is what you say, on the other hand, the pacing is all off, and the genre shift is nothing short of extreme. I'll probably marathon it when all is said and done to form a better opinion of it.

I will say that even if you aren't too keen on Illya as a whole, I'd still recommend the movie (which has nothing to do with Illya ironically enough). It's basically Heaven's Feel Shiro condensed down into a neat entertaining package.

Overall worst entry for me would be the original Fate/Extra. Nero and Tamamo are great, but the battle system is trash, and the enemy masters and servants are mostly only passable at best. Fate/Extella has a good story at least, if only because of the third route.

Once again I disagree with with some things you said. Prisma Illya has always distinctly been "Fate" since even season one wasn't portrayed like a typical magical girl story. Also it never shifted genres, it was always intended to get that dark from the beginning since Miyu's backstory and plot was planned from the beginning.

The entire reason Prisma Illya exists was to give Illya her own route finally (since her route was cut from the original visual novel) and has been stated by Nasu as basically being the 4th route of F/SN for all intents and purposes. It has more slice of life stuff in it at the beginning yes but this is a series that was intended to be a long running story, and it's still going strong nearly 12 years after it's debut.

Also yeah the movie is just an adaptation of the backstory arc from the manga, Illya doesn't play a role but it's a critical piece of the puzzle of the current arc of the series (Which Illya obviously does play a part as the main character).

As for the pacing problem go read the manga since it feels far more natural, the anime adaptation is a bit rushed in 3rei since they squeezed 30 chapters in 12 episodes while earlier seasons adapted around 13 chapters in 10 episodes.

Zeino wrote:

Catsplay wrote:

Whoa whoa whoa, Prisma Illya IS legitimately good. Have you seen/read 3rei!? It has some of the best spins on the classic Type Moon story telling I've seen in awhile, with the current arc being absolutely amazing.

Oh, is that how you would describe all the creepy and terrible lolicon fanservice?

You obviously know nothing about the actual series beyond memes. It's not just "Lolicon" fanservice and it has a lot more going for it then that. Get off your moral high horse and stop being ignorant about things you know literally nothing about. 3rei is literally amazing.

Fate Apocrypha was such a pleasant surprise to me. It relishes in its campiness and never tries to pass itself off as some guide for humanity. It’s a very safe, albeit intense lens into the mechanisms that hold beings together when their existence is an enigma. And I liked that it didn’t have to do too much to answer that by the end. Sometimes simpler is better.

The animation deserved an A- at least. I’m sorry but the peaks of this series’ animation overshadows ANY oversights with consistency. And even then the animation was very consistent aside from rough character models.

I feel like I really can’t compare it to any other Fate though. This one just seems so different.

My only regret is the fact that it was on Netflix and that I wasn't able to see it before CR Awards voting ended. This show has, undoubtedly, the best action of 2017. It is absolutely breathtaking work. So well choreographed. I would've enjoyed a slightly stronger story, but the characters and the action animation was just some of the best shit I've seen in a good long while. I'm so in love with these webgen guys. Asai, Go, Sakazume, Enokido, and the rest of them are so good.

Fate/Apocrypha is my second favorite Fate show and is currently the best show for Fate newbies. It has heroic heroes, villainous villains, and lots of action. It does have some of the high school philosophy of UBW but it never goes too far with it. I think that Fate/stay night is the best introduction to the Fate universe but it has aged a bit. Fate/Apocrypha has a story that is a bit thin but overall it is a great action show.

I'm not quite sure how to quote things in the forum yet, but in response to why some people find UBW to not be all that great in my opinion, it was when they started the Shirou vs Archer fight which I felt should have only been 1 episode into 3. Those three episodes were among the worst I’ve seen in the entire Fate franchise thus far because of how dragged out everything was. However, I will say that although those were the only episodes I didn’t enjoy they really dragged the show down. Also the final scene was a giant misstep.

For Fate/Apocrypha itself, it’s more of a traditional action series than anything else. It does have a lot of thematic depth, but everything is in service of the fight scenes which I thought were always really well done. I also thought the series was animated really well. There are a few issues with consistency in the animation, which is one thing that ufotable does really well, but ultimately I loved all of the fight scenes. Episode 22 immediately jumped up to be one of my favorite anime episodes of all time due to its art style, although I will admit that I can totally understand how someone could dislike that episode due to the characters constantly going off-model, but for me it gives a feeling that’s hard for me to describe but that I absolutely love.

It also seems to borrow a ton of elements from other series and works better if you’ve seen at least Fate/Zero and Studio Deen Fate/Stay Night, which unlike the majority of the fandom I thought was a legitimately good series. Another thing is that it is also the complete antithesis to Fate/Zero. Where Zero was a tragedy Apocrypha was probably the most upbeat and optimistic show in the franchise. That makes it kind of odd that both Zero and Apocrypha are my two favorite shows in the Fate franchise and nothing else, other than Heaven’s Feel which admittedly isn’t complete yet, even come close.

db999 wrote:

I'm not quite sure how to quote things in the forum yet

At the top right corner of each comment box, there is a small button that says "quote". You can also use the html code to make them yourself if you just want to copy and paste the comment of someone else into your post. The HTML code is [quote] to open the quote, and then the same thing with / just before the "q" to close it.

getumbuck wrote:

How would turning Vlad into a terrifying vampire of doom of backfired on them. It's literally my favorite part of the novels. Also Shiro was way more badass when he kills Dracula, in the books. In the anime Dracula looks unbelievably stupid, in his vampire form and Shiro kills him almost like it's an afterthought. Truly the worst moment of the show for me, but there were several others that angered me as well. They really did rush Avicebron and Jack's story arcs, to the point that they almost felt silly in anime form. Maybe this wouldn't have been an issue if they were more focused on telling a story and a little less focused on action, action and more action, each week.

i dont think you get. what i mean is by if they had made ufotable made the transformation of vlad 100% FAITHFUL TO THE NOVELS!, the animation would probably suffer and will definitely have those hard core type moon elitists and fate elitists is a massive tizzy fit. if you ever get to read the novels, you'll understand cause his transformation on the novels is far more graphic than in the anime.

ThatMoonGuy wrote:

Stevangelion wrote:

Since when did people start disliking UBW? It's incredible. Fate/Apocrypha was a fun watch as well. Do anime viewers need to be shaken to their core in order to say they kind of liked a series? Just sit back and enjoy it, not everything has to change your philosophy on life.

Well, to be fair, UBW does have more than a few issues. Most of them stem from it being (Al way too Nasu and (b) the middle part of a story most people don't know how ends. No route of Fate can be completely understood without the others. That's just not how the narrative was structured. There's a reason you have to go through Fate then UBW and then HF.
As for point A, Nasu does have a pretty peculiar style. A very literary style. You gotta be invested in the ideas presented there in order to fully enjoy what's going on. That's easier to achieve them you're seeing the world from the eyes of Shirou like in the novels but not so much in an anime. And when we do get an experience similar to the novels... It gets wordy. And then we have people saying Shirou's dilemma is about his gender role or something like that.
All that to say, Nasu is hard to adapt and his works are harder to digest than most so people thinking UBW is bad and Apocrypha is good is bound to happen. The latter just makes for a better entertainment. Even Fate Zero us dumbed down from FSN if only because Urobuchi was writing a tragedy (an excellent one, mind you) and not what amounts to a long winded urban fantasy rumination on date and the nature of human evil. Nasu is graduated in human studies and, oh boy, does it show. When he's not writing stupid scenarios about aliens from the future trying to get revenge on Saber faces, he's going full dissertation mode.

actually there are a lot more reasons why people disliked UBW and for different reasons other than those. though it mainly depends on what fan you are of the series. its one of the reasons why i prefer the DEEN version as the gateway for those that are new to the series. especially since it ended via with the fate/avalon route which along with heavens feel is well liked in the western world while in japan whereas for die hard fate / type-moon junkies, its only heaven's feel or bust.

Forum - View topic
REVIEW: Fate/Apocrypha (Episodes 13-25)

SAND LAND Video Game Review

This Week in Games - Atlus With the Old, In With the New

The Story of Suikoden

This Week in Anime - What's Weekly Shonen Jump's Next Big Manga?

Voice Actor Takaaki Seki Dies at 54

The ANN Aftershow - Will You Watch Solo Leveling Season 2?

Dark Moon: The Blood Altar Volumes 1-2 Manhwa Review

Interview: Voice Actors Rika Hayashi and Hiroki Tōchi Talk About Their New Golf Anime, Tonbo!

Japanese TV Special Ranks Top Anime Songs, as Chosen by Foreign Fans

This Week in Anime - So, Is Sound Euphonium Queerbaiting or Not?

Wonderful Precure! Episodes 1-12 Anime Review

Forum - View topicREVIEW: Fate/Apocrypha (Episodes 13-25)

Forum

Forum - View topic
REVIEW: Fate/Apocrypha (Episodes 13-25)