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NEWS: UN Human Rights Committee's New Guidelines for Child Pornography Express 'Deep Concerns' About


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ATastySub



Joined: 19 Jan 2012
Posts: 147
PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:54 pm Reply with quote
DavetheUsher wrote:
That's kinda why people are against it even if they don't like loli and shota stuff. Vague definitions and weasel words are kinda dangerous

The reason vague definitions exist are to prevent weasel wording not encourage it. It’s also the reason we have juries and judges instead of law robot checklists because there is always a degree of interpretation. When people are given a hard definite line they tend to attempt to find ways to cross it, so the softer language is used to avoid anyone committing a terrible act and then using technicalities to avoid justice. And that’s not even getting into the problems with hard line laws and mandatory sentencing without considering circumstance for much less heinous crimes.
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Chrono1000



Joined: 05 Oct 2013
Posts: 1321
PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:20 pm Reply with quote
DavetheUsher wrote:
That's kinda why people are against it even if they don't like loli and shota stuff. Vague definitions and weasel words are kinda dangerous

Agreed, and this UN report doesn't see a problem with child drag queen shows or child marriage but reserves these vague definitions for drawings of fictional characters. That is logically backwards but is typical of communist ideology where thought crimes are treated as the worst type of crime. This UN report allows for a 12-year-old to be married but could make a serious crime out of panty flashes with fictional high school students in anime.

ATastySub wrote:
When people are given a hard definite line they tend to attempt to find ways to cross it, so the softer language is used to avoid anyone committing a terrible act and then using technicalities to avoid justice.

How are drawings of a fictional character equivalent to a terrible act? We aren't talking about robbery and murder we are talking about manga and anime. If you say that some drawings should be illegal because it offends people that would be true for much of what the porn industry makes which offends a majority of people on this planet and should that content be made illegal as well?
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Tuor_of_Gondolin



Joined: 20 Apr 2009
Posts: 3329
Location: Bellevue, WA
PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:16 am Reply with quote
Just FYI: governments use vague wording so that they can make laws mean whatever they want them to mean. They're the ones that decide what the words mean. If you ever get into legal trouble, you'll find that out very quickly.
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Crispy45



Joined: 23 Sep 2012
Posts: 314
PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 3:19 am Reply with quote
ATastySub wrote:
The reason vague definitions exist are to prevent weasel wording not encourage it. It’s also the reason we have juries and judges instead of law robot checklists because there is always a degree of interpretation. When people are given a hard definite line they tend to attempt to find ways to cross it, so the softer language is used to avoid anyone committing a terrible act and then using technicalities to avoid justice. And that’s not even getting into the problems with hard line laws and mandatory sentencing without considering circumstance for much less heinous crimes.


That loose interpretation was why Christopher Handley was advised to take a plea deal when he was ready to take his case to trial. His fate would be left up to the jury, and if the jury had people like the OP that says drawings are just as bad as real people, he was looking at 10-25 years in prison and would be treated no different than a real child molester.

So it's either too strict and smart people can maybe find loopholes in the system, or too lose and innocent people get caught up in the wide net being cast. Personally, I don't trust Americans courts or the average juror to know about anime to make an educated judgement on obscenity tests like "Does the work have a literary or artistic merit?" Given the stigma animation has in the west as always being for kids, that answer will probably always be no.
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EleutheroMaster



Joined: 15 Aug 2011
Posts: 82
PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 3:25 pm Reply with quote
Given the way the UN is acting now, why can't Japan just simply withdraw from the Convention? All treaties should have withdrawal clauses installed.
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Errinundra
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Joined: 14 Jun 2008
Posts: 5357
Location: Melbourne, Oz
PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 6:17 pm Reply with quote
Posts deleted. Keep it nice, people. No one deserves to be shot on sight.
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nDroae



Joined: 26 May 2017
Posts: 251
PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 6:25 pm Reply with quote
I think this part of my deleted reply should be okay to repost:

I'd be interested to see a large study of whether access to 2D lolicon material is more likely to increase or decrease the threat to real children, as it seems both are possible outcomes. Of course, it's difficult to recruit test subjects for such a study, due to extreme social stigma.

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/06/opinion/pedophilia-a-disorder-not-a-crime.html

I'm glad to see some progress is being made in the general field of treating pedophilia:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/paedophile-brains-difference-child-sex-abusers-those-who-dont-study-a7378911.html
https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/mbzj5q/pedophiles-cant-be-cured-and-its-dangerous-to-suggest-they-can (This is more constructive than it sounds from the article title)
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