Forum - View topicNEWS: "Made in Japan" to fight anime piracy
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Kazuki-san
 Posts: 2251 Location: Houston, TX |
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It's been running rampant around here to, well I don't want to label all who have spoken of high prices as people who buy boots, but there have been a few. |
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kyuu
 Posts: 16 Location: Tampere, Finland |
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Personally, I'm glad the sometimes painful transformation of the anime fandom into something more legal is slowly happening. Back in the VHS days, fansubs did have an almost official part of the fandom, but nowadays they're only eating away credibility from clubs who try to promote their ideas in newspapers, or when they try to get sponsorship for renting places to watch anime, for example. Too often there are two words that people associate with anime - porn and piracy. I wouldn't mind the other dropping off for starters.
I had a discussion with local (Finnish) antipiracy experts earlier and did some other research. Fansubs can be considered both systematic and coarse piracy. I couldn't agree more. While there are some fansub groups who actually have some sense of morals, many of them don't care about US releases and quite many make a little business out of it. Sure, they don't do it with the fansub group name, but their individual members go off selling fansub cd's and dvd's. Still, we're quite a way. Last time I checked, for example Anime Castle still sells quite questionable HK Import anime, and they're even a supporter of ANN. Over here, it's legal to make copies of audio/video media to "close friends and family", usually that's defined as a maximum of five people or so. On the downside, empty cd, dvd etc. media has a small "recording tax" attached, this money is then directed to the a/v recording industry. Most people hate this arrangement, but it works well enough. As a result, I buy some anime dvd's, a friend buys some others, and we can make copies to each other. I realize local laws in many countries differ, but I think the problem persists - it's hard to draw a line between legal and illegal anime fandom. Not because it's hard to make the distinction, but because people are still attached to the old ways. It's pretty much been seen time and again that once an industry grows, so does availability and meanwhile prices drop. I'm quite sure anime will see lower prices as well as soon as the volumes grow (okay, maybe not with viz, but then again, they're idiots). Remaining problem? The few series that just are too marginal for US release. Waiting a year or two for a release is okay, but there are still some that just won't be translated officially. Depending on piracy doesn't seem like my choice, neither does learning japanese well enough to buy R2 imports, so we clearly need a third option. |
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Sam.:
 Posts: 136 Location: ANN WebSite. |
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ya i understand now. wow!
yeah college is a bitch, but it has been fun as all hell too. sometimes i wish, I was rich. But then i think about bring rich and it pisses me off. i like it the way i am.
damn! thats cool dude. I guess you respect the industry very much. you are definatly a hardcore anime fan. but most of the people i know from the Ohio area, all buy bootleg dvds? at even anime chats majoroty of the people buy bootlege dvd. just go to any anime chat you'll know what i'm talking about.
 _^
ahhh that sucks real bad bro. i hate when that happens. thats gay, it pisses me off.
Its nice to see people out there who still have a conscious. Makes me real happy. no really it does. Unfortunately I really don’t have an conscious anymore. Somewhere during my life my heart got cold, real cold! I really don’t know when I began to change, but I did. Although I have learnt a lot from all the posts you guys made here, i still don’t think that I can change my ways. Wow I’m basically speechless. I don't really know what to say. Well I can say that both Cookie and Nagisa are 100% right. I can clearly distinguish between right and wrong now. All 3 of you Kazuki-san, Cookie and Nagisa changed the way I think, I was able to read that post Nagisa but I couldn’t quote it. Man I’v learnt a lot today from you guys today. Sorry if i offended you! Later |
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Joe Mello
 Posts: 2267 Location: Online Terminal |
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Just fans? Oh, no. Anyone who's considered "old" must complain about people who are considered "young" AND vice versa. It's what Darwin taught us. Of course, he's dead, so that shows what he knows. ^__^ Besides, Cookie, you figure with that little avatar book of yours, you'd be happier than a fly in........nevermind This is just a superficial tactic, although it is comparable to websites embedding their sitename on pictures. However, as corny as this sounds, if the Japanese entertainment industry really wanted to stop bootlegging, they'd convice the government to declare a "War on Piracy" and spend way too much that what it would be worth to flush out illegality. Or, they could just sick John Kerry on them. ^__~ |
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animaniac
 Posts: 246 Location: Idaho |
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yeah I hope it doesn't affect anything online which it shouldn't since those are off tv ah hell I dunno. Sounds good, if it works that is.
never bought a bootleg never will. As for downloads never bought anything licensed stateside at least so I'm within and plan to forever stay in the subber's code hehe |
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pcoaster
Posts: 5 |
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You guys are forgetting something quite important here: The average Japanese is able to watch all TV-anime in his regular TV-program. Sure some channels need to be paid for, and you also support the other TV channels by watching commercials, but I would gladly do so if I could therefore watch anime in its original dub (and understand anything of course
 ). But in my country no single TV-channel plays anime regularly, and even if some do play anime at all, they always show the dubbed version, which is never, i repeat, never an option if you care at all for what the original maker intended with his show. So I can only say that I find it sad how you people think of digital fansubs, which in my opinion is the only way to even the "unfairness" of not being japanese AND an animefan. And I don't think animefans are only those that have a lot of money to spend on dvds but those who, as Sam. wrote, spread the love of anime by telling or watching them together with friends. And sure, good shows should be supported by buying the dvds, whenever you got the money to do so. That's only fair. Just don't forget that not everyone who would watch the show in TV in japan would buy the dvds. And that's what fansubs are there for. Sure it would be nice if you could support the creators or TV channels just like the japanese can by paying for channels or watching commercials but there's no possibility to do so yet.
Well, my point is: don't talk bad of fansubs. It's just not right. |
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Sword of Whedon
Posts: 683 |
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Get yourself a Netflix account or the equivalent. Then you can watch all the anime you want for $20 a month. Problem solved
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Kazuki-san
Posts: 2251 Location: Houston, TX |
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Ok, well if fansubs were all great, and without error, then I wouldn't talk bad about them, but that's just not the case. Increasingly it seems that people less and less experienced in digital editing and translating Japanese are releasing series, with some fairly bad mistakes. Don't get me wrong, I watch fansubs, and have since the good 'ole VHS days. As for getting them for free in Japan versus buying dvd's.... It's true that a lot of anime is shown on tv in Japan, but what about OVA, that's quite a large chunk of the anime market, and the only way to watch those are to buy them. So why shouldn't YOU buy them too? By the way, you can support the creators of an anime series by buying the dvd! |
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pandorina
 Posts: 43 Location: USA |
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I am a little concerned.
I love fan subs. I get to see anime as it comes out in Japan that way. I would hate to have to wait 2 to 4 years for an American company to obtain the rights and sub/dub it then release it.  All of the Japanese import goodies (stuffed toys are only available for a short time these days) are almost gone by the time I am obessed with a title enough to hunt them down. I depend on the fansub preview so I can get a hold of good anime paraphanalia that won't be available by the time it gets to the US. 
Just so you know I still by the Licenced DVD's (I happen to love extras) even if I have the series on Fansubbed VHS or VCD. 
Plus there are alot of titles that are just never picked up by American companies. It doesn't make them bad just unobtainable by normal methods. This concerns me more than anything. 
Then again I should probably just learn more Japanese. But sometime I am too tired to concentrate on what they are saying. Now I am just complaining...gomen.
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Spooky Electric
Posts: 7 |
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Hey there, first post. Hmmm.
I don't buy bootlegs. The only valid argument I can see for them is that the show has been on TV, so how is it different from videotaping it? |
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Kazuki-san
Posts: 2251 Location: Houston, TX |
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Let's see, because it violates copyright.... the TV station that broadcasted it bought the broadcast rights. You're allowed to make tapes for "your own personal use", meaning you can't make hundreds of copies and give them to people, or CHARGE for it. You're taking money away from the industry by not buying the dvds but instead buying boots. And once again not ALL anime shows are broadcast on Japanese TV (see OVA). And Japanese people also buy DVDs of anime broadcasted on TV. You're also rewarding someone who is blatantly violating the law, reaping a benefit off of other people's hard work, and most of the time buying subquality (packaging, video quality, and usually subbing) products. |
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Ren of Heavens
 Posts: 11 |
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That's a poor excuse for wanting to buy bootlegs, I'm a student with a part time job, yet I've managed to buy 130+ legal DVDs. Among them, I have 1 single HK bootleg, the Nadesico Movie which I bought after I had finished the series, and there was no announcements of when the movie might come over. Since that came out a while back, I bought a legit copy of it. At a guess 60% of my collection are R1 imports, so they're slightly more expensive. Yet, I've managed to get them all as a student. As for the Made in Japan thing, I'm sure the HK Bootleggers will just add Made in Japon or something. |
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Sam.:
Posts: 136 Location: ANN WebSite. |
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i undersatand that buying bootleg hurts the anime companies/ industry. its like stabbing yourself in the back. but i really don't know what to believe anymore. most people look-out for themselfs rather than for someone else. i mean why are you guys looking-out for someone you guys don't even know (the industry). Don't you guys have lives outside the internet? Anways i don't like arguing and i don't know what to make of all of this.. i'm still deciding. but both sides bring good arguments to the table.
anyone know how much exactly the bootleg industry makes in profits? just make an educated guess someone. thanks |
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Kazuki-san
Posts: 2251 Location: Houston, TX |
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We look out for it because we love anime, and because we wish for anime to continue to be made. We want those who create anime to receive their proper reward for creating a series that we enjoy. As for having a life outside of the internet, yup I do, a very busy one in fact, however I have today off from work 
It's impossible to guess, since there is no way to determine how much money a bootleger is making.
Actually it will probably look more like this: 日本製 |
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pcoaster
Posts: 5 |
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No, problem not solved. First, in my country, there is no such thing as netflix. Second, you still have to wait usually 2 or more years for anime to even come out translated in english by the us-companies, even more if I want them in my own language. So while the idea to rent it would be ok whenever something is finally fully available in a for me understandable language, its still a wait for about 2 years or more to be able to do just that, in comparison to the japanese tv broadcast.
Well, I know what you're talking about, but this can't count as an argument simply because the majority of fansubbers is quite adept in what they're doing, even to the point of being superior in skill to many us-companies translating anime. In my country its often even worse, and I don't even start to talk about the quaility of dubbing in another language, I talk only about the subs.
Sure, there are quite a lot OVA series out there. BUT most of them are about a max. of 3 episodes long, what you can't compare to a series of 26 eps or more being showed in TV. And if you compare the quantity TV <-> OVA, it clearly shows there are much more great anime shown in everyday television than being brought out as OVA. If you don't have to buy a set of 26 episodes on DVD because they would be shown in TV, you can buy quite many OVA-series for the thereby saved money. And as I already stated, its sure still not a favorable thing not being able to pay back the japanese TV-channels or creators by simply watching commercials, or paying a monthly fee to some TV-channels there. But these costs can't be compared to the huge amount of money one hast to pay to watch about 3 or 4 TV-anime-series currently running by buying the respective dvds. Not even to talk about the time lag between the dvd release and the broadcasting in japan. |
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