Forum - View topicTo observe without the prism of nostalgia.
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DomonX2
Posts: 232 Location: Neo Toronto, Neo Canada |
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Here's the charts Gen I Poison beats Bug Bug Beats Poison Ice does normal damage to Fire Ghost has no effect on Psychic Pokemon If one type resists something, but the other doesn't, then the one that takes 2X the damage, takes 2X the damage Gen II Ice attacks do less against Fire types Bug does less damage to Poison, but Poison does normal damage to Bug Thunder(Zapdos) takes normal damage from Electric attacks Ghost does super effective damage to Psychic types(too bad they all sucked till Juppeta(Banette) can along anyway) There was NO set standard at the time, I suppose. Generation II/the show didn't fix anything. It was supposed to be like that. You also realize, by the time Satoshi beat Natsume(Sabrina), that Gold, Silver and Crystal were still in development right? So, yes they made it inaccurate. Also, Pokemon and Colosseum has good animation and fluid battle scenes, more so than the show, because it's more realistic. |
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DomonX2
Posts: 232 Location: Neo Toronto, Neo Canada |
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No, that was before my time. Besides, I have little interest in Macross or anything like that(I may check it out). I'm a mecha fan(Sunrise), when it comes to Japanese anime, hence my name, Domon X2, which is a combination of the Victory 2, the Gundam X and Domon Kasshu. When it comes to American/Canadian anime, I'm a fan of Fairly Odd Parents(yeah it's stupid I know), Spider Man(1960s and 1990s), X-Men(1990s) and many more. |
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DomonX2
Posts: 232 Location: Neo Toronto, Neo Canada |
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Also Titan, I ain't a purist. I've heard Death Note was one of the few good inaccurate adaptations of a comic, cause most Shonen Jump animated adaptations are terrible. I prefer subs, but I won't bash tolerable-great dubs. I only bash the DBZ dubs, the One Piece dubs, the G Gundam dub, the 00 dub, the Naruto and Bleach dubs and other bad, overrated dubs. I also complain about good, but overrated dubs like Gundam W. Pokemon could have been good, because it's source material is arguably made up of one the greatest game franchises of all time, but there are too many liberties, taken with the animated project. If you're not going to follow the source material, either make up something else or don't call yourself 'Pocket Monsters'. Death Note's animated series is made up, but the characters are the same and are still as great as before, or so I've heard. In the case where you can't improvise, you NEED to be as close as possible to the original source. It's like me making a Shrek movie, but having as little to do with Shrek as possible. Sorry, I've been a fan of Pokemon since 1996 and it's just not fair that other shows are closer to the original, but not Pokemon.
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EricJ
Posts: 876 |
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Like I said, coming from a Robotech non-fan, Macross is really the go-to "If you had to watch ONE mecha series". In that it's not really a mecha series (although the Valkyries did predate the Transformers), so much as a gently semi-parodic soap-opera of several very, very diverse characters--the Ace Pilot and the Idol Singer--translated into a "sweeping epic" over time. Less of a pure mecha/fleet show like Gundam, and more the kind of alternate-reality Trek series fans like to keep timelines of the events. That may be true for Gundam as well, but Macross has the lighter, less generic feel. |
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Animegomaniac
Posts: 4101 |
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I grew up during that time so naturally I first saw Robotech this year.
Yeah, I'm not sure what happened exactly. Battle of the Planets, yeah. Transformers and Voltron, certainly but I have no idea how I missed Robotech or how Robotech missed me. What did I think about it? I liked it a lot. I had no problems with the animation {except for that fight scene...} and the localization was more acceptable to me than the Zentradi {"They don't look the same so they're from different shows, right? No? Really? You sure? But look, those two evil leaders are seperate from the action and commenting on it, a sure sign of lifted footage somewhere as I've seen bad movies that were more convincingly spliced. Still no? Huh."}. So with either Macross or Robotech part 1; If you can accept the Zentradi then you can accept anything. As for Super Dimensional Fortress Macross {because just calling it Macross would be the easy way out}, I watched about five minutes of ADV's dubbed version and I immediately missed the opening narration; This show does not start well or efficiently. So I figured that watching either would be a waste of time. Also, while I liked the show, I hated the ending and while Macross just ends {and then continues with more of the same in a forced franchise} Robotech ends but continues with something different, something that pretends the last five minutes doesn't matter, if it happened at all. spoiler[ In case you wondering what my problem is, it's sickening to watch the love triangle resolve itself while their friends burn to death. Ok, most likely they were blown to bits but if the captain had enough time to throw Rick's main love interest into an escape pod... No, wait, why didn't he just jump in with her? Or if it's based on "captain goes down with his ship" then why just her? Why write the ending that way in the first place, it just doesn't work because who cares about those three when the show just killed half the cast in a throwaway scene, including Lisa' best friend who lost her fiance, Rick's best friend, earlier in the series? It's all just "Really? We got to do this now?" Good show, lousy ending.] |
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Rick Dom
Posts: 18 |
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I saw Robotech (at least the first two parts) on Cartoon Network's Toonami circa 1998 and liked it (I can't remember if I watched Macross Plus before or after; of course it may have been during since I was broke and had to buy VHS tapes). Years later I decided to watch Macross proper and when you do that you really see the stitching necessary to turn Macross, Southern Cross, and Mospaeda into Robotech, and it all sort of falls apart. Robotech manages to keep most of the soap-opera character drama but loses the big deal about the Protoculture by turning an ancient civilization into an energy source (insert fossil fuel joke here). Its a small mercy that Robotech didn't expand to some of the series Carl Macek wanted like Gundam, because that would have been a real mess.
Then there's the licensing mess with Harmony Gold that prevents other Macross series from being brought to the US (even though the music licensing costs for 7 and Frontier would likely prevent them from coming over) that jades a lot of people against Robotech. And frankly, which would you rather have: Robotech the Shadow Chronicles or Macross Frontier? { This thread is continued here. ~nobahn} |
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TitanXL
Posts: 4036 |
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That's kind of what a purist is; disliking changes. A good adaption, however, will have no problem changing the original material if it better suits the medium. Video game to anime is one of those that people often complain about, but don't seem to realize how different they are; especially RPGs which have random battle and other game mechanics which just do not work in animated form; like turn-based fighting and grinding through dungeons and levels. Personally I'm glad they can do things like this without someone on the writing staff saying "But wait, Kenji, there's no move in the game that lets you do that, we can't do that. Also they can't do two attacks in a row, that breaks the game rules." The show is good, that's why it's one of the most popular anime out there to this day and people enjoy it all over the world. A few needless nitpicks on bad programming (Ghost was supposed to be effective against Psychic, the original game said so as did the anime, but the programming messed up and it wasn't) seems hardly the reason to dislike it. Not to mention, last I checked, each game was about getting 8 badges and having adventures, and the anime still does that. Last edited by TitanXL on Mon Sep 17, 2012 6:25 am; edited 1 time in total |
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DomonX2
Posts: 232 Location: Neo Toronto, Neo Canada |
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Never said it has to be turn based. It's the inconsistencies, which piss me off mostly. How can 'Volt Tackle' do recoil sometimes, but not all the time? That's INACCURATE and retarded. Unless you have 'Rock Head', you take damage for recoil attack. No exceptions. 2. The animation is inconsistent and can look choppy at times. At least Digimon had good animation for the time. Pokemon looked stupid. Also, you can't have more than 5 moves. The sizes are inconsistent and everyone is a mess. 3. The characters are silly and do dumb things. Why would you NOT have Fushigidane(Bulbasaur) and Zenigame(Squirtle) evolve? Who DOES that? Evolving(unless you're a 'Shedninja') makes you SUPERIOR, not inferior. But NO, stupid Satoshi believes in dumb crap, instead of being the best! Dumbass. I like the Pokemon animated cartoon for nostalgia, but as a WHOLE is SUCKS. I hate how Pokemon is some series that gets 6-7% ratings in Japan and at times, it got 26.5 million HOUSEHOLDS watching. Same with Canada and the USA. I don't see how the first movie could make over 83 MILLION US dollars in North America(fun fact, it made more money in the USA+Canada, than in Japan). Also, Pokemon may be popular(the cartoon), but so what? Justine Bieber is popular, but he is still terrible. The games are legendary, but Ash or Satoshi or whatever and the animated cartoon are a joke. I've spied on you and you like a lot of kiddy stuff, but I can't talk because I like G Gundam, but that ain't the point. The point and FACT is that Pokemon's animated adaptation is terrible and a spit in the fans faces. |
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Keonyn
Subscriber
Posts: 5567 Location: Coon Rapids, MN |
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Your problem is that you're looking at the show the wrong way. The game is a game; concrete rules and specific tasks towards a specific end game. The show is a story, taking in to account things that would be nearly impossible to implement in the game environment. Plus, the story and the audience is what they're aiming towards with the show, and so they're going to make storyline decisions based on what is best for the story and what they believe the audience wants to see. Sometimes that flies in the face of what the logically defined strategic decision in the game would be, but they're two very different things.
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