Forum - View topicAnswerman - How Expensive Is Housing In Japan?
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NeverConvex
 Subscriber Posts: 2341 |
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Huh -- this is not as expensive as I had expected. Maybe I'm just to accustomed to DC pricing, but in the city here $1800/mo gets you about 700 sq ft (though it would probably get you twice that if you went outside of the city a little bit, to Crystal City or any of the other areas surrounding the city's periphery). EDIT: Hm, on the other hand, maybe that's within the margin of uncertainty for a piece like this, given it's unsourced and doesn't have a clear methodology. This article claims DC and Tokyo were almost identically priced last year, and the DC price it gives is very close to what I observed when apartment hunting around here. |
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Ashley Hakker
Posts: 115 |
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Thankfully, the law doesn't work like that here. For a purpose built apartment complex, evicting non-problematic tenants is nearly impossible. Unless the building is to be demolished ot the unit requires such extensive renovations that it must be rendered unlivable for months at a time until complete, you basically can't evict someone. (There are more options for say, 'houses with an apartment in the basement', I'm speaking purely of dedicated apartment complexes) So... Yeah, unless someone decides to buy the entire property and knock it down or unless the kitchen starts falling through the floor, I can stay here as long as I want. |
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#hiros7039
Posts: 31 |
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Friends Rent Control even gets involved here.
Considering the housing bubble burst in the early 1990s plummeting the prices and never recovered from former peaks. With loose zoning laws allowing mixed zoning building whatever little space there is with dealing with NIMBYs. It's not usual to see two pencil homes built on a lot where there was one home. 20 story condominiums get mixed with single detached homes. And along with abundance of social housing projects make Tokyo and urban Japan affordable in comparison. Many underemployed who can't afford rent end up sleeping in internet cafes. |
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Tempest
 I Run this place.ANN Publisher  Posts: 10430 Location: Do not message me for support. |
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The place I'm looking at near Ebisu station, a somewhat, but not extremely, expensive neighborhood is 170,000 yen per month for 40 square meters (1LDK).
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relyat08
 Posts: 4125 Location: Northern Virginia |
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Vacationing in Japan can be expensive, but I wouldn't say it has to be. A lot of people just don't spend the time to do the research. I'm staying right off the JR circuit in downtown Tokyo next Spring for a full week and my airbnb is costing me $87 total. Taking advantage of capsule hotels and airbnb/hostels can save you a ton, if you're not too picky. I'll be in the country for 3 weeks and my total expenses are going to be just slightly over $2k for a pretty dang lavish holiday as far as I'm concerned, excluding airfare, which I don't have to pay for anyway. My vacation will end up costing me about what it costs me to live and work here in the US. Now I just need a way to replace my income with something passive so I can do this full time.
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Key
Moderator
 Posts: 18238 Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley) |
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Damn, all of this is why I'll never move anywhere other than where I am (the outskirts of Indianapolis) if I have a practical choice about it. 1,150 square foot home with attached garage on a 1/3 acre lot cost me $116k back in 2005 (and I probably overpaid for it then), which is currently translating to mortgage payments under $700 a month - and that includes pro-rated shares of property tax and homeowner's insurance. Granted, the house is nearly 60 years old and has needed some expensive improvements over time, but I still think I'm coming out ahead on that.
(Of course, Indianapolis did rank #2 in the nation last year on one survey of major cities with a combination of available jobs and affordable housing.) |
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crosswithyou
 Posts: 2892 Location: California |
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I'm from San Jose and am living in Tokyo.
Umm...... Yeah, don't know if I'll be able to go back to San Jose if I ever move back to the States. Sure, I could stay at my parents' house, but I've accumulated quite a lot of... stuff... while living in Japan and there's no way I could fit everything in my room back home. |
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Compelled to Reply
 Posts: 358 |
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Japanese zoning laws are quite strict, but are based on intensity and building form instead of single use. Amendments and relaxations of the law have been employed to facilitate redeveloping dense fire-prone low-rise areas in the event of an earthquake, usually with a condo tower using acquired air rights from elsewhere and open space. The "Euclidean" separation of uses you see in suburbia is more of a New World phenomenon and associated with sprawl. Alas, that has changed within the past thirty years or so, with people moving back to city centers and facilitating redevelopment. Justin didn't really talk about homelessness in the answer, but there's more to it than a lack of affordable housing. Often it is even a choice. |
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Sakagami Tomoyo
 Posts: 940 Location: Melbourne, VIC, Australia |
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That may depend on where in the world you are. But even when it is the case, I think it's worth it, for reasons I'll elaborate on below.
Which is nice, but most people view the house they buy as their home, not a financial investment they happen to live inside of.
Except for how the landlord can increase the rent on you. Or neglect to maintain the property properly. Or impose unreasonable restrictions on things like pet ownership or how you furnish the place. Or just stop renting to you because they feel like it. And even if you've got a good landlord who would never do any of those things, they might at some point sell the place to one that does. And to even get that far, a landlord has to approve renting to you to begin with; these days that's as much of an ordeal as applying for jobs. Sure, most of that stuff is illegal in many places, but if you think that actually stops every bad landlord, I've got a bridge to sell you. There's stress in home ownership, but less so than in renting. The number one advantage to owning over renting is having a secure place to live. Not absolutely secure, of course, but more secure than renting. |
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amperedo
Posts: 1 |
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I'm calling "not exactly" on Answermans answer. A large Western styled 1 bdrm may indeed start at 200,000 if you want to live in a "nice" as in mostly white expat area, surrounded by modern offices and other condos and some chain restaurants from the US.
But what is your definition of "nice?" All of Japan is safe. Some areas older than others. Some still more old-style than others. some full of quirky izakayas and others are mostly stores. Some are residential with super narrow streets on a hill. Most of them are not white expat areas... You can easily find a 1K (1 room, plus small separate kitchen area) for 50,000. Average is about 65,000 within Tokyo. You can find a 1 LDK (like a US 1 bedroom apt) for 85,000 - 100,000 in most areas (that aren't heavily expat or tourist-oriented). These are neighborhoods with cute bars, indie coffee shops, small farmers markets, and chock in the middle of actual Japan-life. |
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dormcat
Encyclopedia Editor
 Posts: 9902 Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan, ROC |
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Seconded. Typical residences of middle-class families and single young adults can be found in Whisper of the Heart and Egao, respectively (picked those two because of their popularity and easy-to-access). IMHO most North Americans would not call those residences "nice." |
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Ashley Hakker
Posts: 115 |
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Some of you live in some places with some pretty garbage rental laws. Here in Ontario, any lease that forbids pet ownership within the rental is legally void. As in, it could be in one page of the lease, in huge black and red letters, you can sign it, and you could move your pets in right after. Also there are legal restrictions on how much a landlord can increase the rent year over year on existing tenants. Usually 1.5-2.5% or so. |
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leafy sea dragon
 Posts: 7163 Location: Another Kingdom |
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I live in the same general metropolitan area as Mr. Sevakis, so I'm pretty accustomed to sky-high prices on land. As it happened, I was looking at housing prices in other parts of the country during the housing bubbles (though I didn't move out nor did I intend to), and I discovered that they vary tremendously between regions of the United States. The housing bubbles, and there were multiple ones, affected certain places and not others depending on where people intended to move.
And there's no doubt they're being price-gouged by these landowners who know people go to the Bay Area for those high-income tech jobs. Don't forget that this land is similarly pricey for businesses, not just residential properties, meaning prices tend to be higher than normal for basic goods too like fuel, groceries, and home goods. That, in turn, means they're paying more for EVERYTHING all around, not just housing. I went to university just south of the immediate Bay Area (but is considered part of it), and I had a roommate from San Francisco who told me about the cheap fuel in that city...whereas I was annoyed at how they cost a great deal more than in southern California (which is already infamous among tourists for the high price).
My goodness, it was that bad there? I knew it was terrible when I lived there, but I didn't know that the city easily one-tenth the population of much of the others on this list was 4th in the world. I also find it amusing that Honolulu is the only US city in that list not in California. I guess the reputation is true.
Sometimes it is here too. Not sure how it compares to Japan, but I did find it interesting when I was doing the 2010 census and assigned to count up the homeless (as they obviously wouldn't be receiving the census forms in the mail), and one person we interviewed was homeless by choice due to a dispute with someone else he lived with.
One of my previous jobs was at a property management company. I can definitely say from the other side that this was true with the properties the company owned. There was NEVER a shortage of people who wanted to live in these places, and there would always be so many people to go through once a location became vacant. Any location with incredibly high rates is because there is an insatiable demand from outsiders to live there, and I think that goes for Tokyo too.
The most common reason pets are not allowed in certain places here is because of potential proximity-based allergies and certain pets causing nuisances. Based on my experiences, nearly all places that prohibit pets are apartments, townhouses, condos, and other places with multiple residences in the same building, where both of those issues would be frequent if pets were allowed. How do places in Ontario deal with tenants with cats and dogs living near people who are allergic to them, or, in particular, undisciplined dogs who bark noisily and their owners don't care? We've had some dogs in my neighborhood (of houses) that were nuisances from across the neighborhood because they were so noisy (or, in one egregious case, intentionally raised to be very aggressive and try to attack anyone who comes near, then tied to a loose fencepost that DID eventually come loose because the boys found it funny if the dog would maim someone). Or are there restrictions and rules on pet owners to take care of their pets responsibly? |
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relyat08
Posts: 4125 Location: Northern Virginia |
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Count me among the people who have actually made that choice. Not currently, but I have lived for a couple of months in my car just because I wanted to save money and have an adventure. I wouldn't say it was great, but I did save a lot of money! Kind of moving back toward minimalist living again, honestly. So maybe I'll do it again. But yeah, you can listen to podcasts or read blogs by a lot of people who have made the choice not to have a residence. One fairly famous guy made the news for living in a van in San Francisco even though he makes well over $100k. He just wanted to save money and his office provided everything he needed, including showers and a kitchen, so no real downside. Apparently there is a bit of a movement in SF, specifically where many people are doing that same. |
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Ashley Hakker
Posts: 115 |
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They don't. Like I said, in a standard apartment complex you can't forbid animals. But it's not like the pets are in THOSE units, they are in their own units.
The noise coming from a unit is very much the responsibility of a tenant and if they continue to produce noise that interferes with the reasonable enjoyment of other tenants then you can be evicted through normal procedures. But that has nothing to do with a pet. Be it a loud dog or a loud stereo system, the tenant has a responsibility to resolve noise issues. But the key thing is that you're not evicting someone based on the animal, it's based on the noise from the unit, the tenant is free to find any way to resolve the noise issue and can keep the animal in their apartment. |
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