Forum - View topicThe List - 8 Shocking Betrayals Out of Left Field
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Zetabag
 Posts: 205 |
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uh, I don't see how Vicious betraying Spike or even how far he took it are considered out of left field. Quite frankly I wasn't really suprised by how far he took it.
As for Gendo, I'm pretty sure it was made blatantly clear that he had ulterior motives around 1/3 of the way through the series. Anyway, one of my favorite betrayals out of left field was in Mobile Suit Gundam Movie I, spoiler[where Char betrayed Garma ] (assuming you didn't see the TV series first). Now if you saw the TV series then it was not really out of left field since he did make a previous attempt in one of the episodes that got cut out of the movie. |
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CrownKlown
 Posts: 1762 |
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I kind of dont agree with Berserk on this list either. I watched the show a long time ago. But prior to his betrayal, he basically seduced/raped the King's daughter , was tortured and imprisoned, and basically just spiraling out of control. Plus he seemed to always view himself as entitled for greatness, as if the universe owed him something.
But truthfully as 90 percent of the stuff I watch is harem, betrayal just really odes not come up that much, so it was really hard to come up with anything more than what you listed. |
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Fencedude5609
 Posts: 5088 |
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Since when is "for shame" considered rude in this context? |
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Etrien
 Posts: 525 Location: Tokyo, Japan |
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Berserk is an amazing series and one of my all time favorites, too, but it really is pretty extreme in the gore category, largely because it's well written. Watching mooks get butchered is one thing, but it's far more psychologically disturbing when it happens to characters you actually care about. As much as I love the series, it really isn't for everyone and I certainly wouldn't recommend it to anyone who has serious issues with gore or violence. |
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Optitron
 Posts: 46 |
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Ouch. Slayers NEXT! is actually my favorite season of the show for that very reason. I'd agree that Gaav and Martina are pretty useless, throwaway characters, but Hellmaster Phibrizzo... oh, he is such an awesome, sadistic villain. I've often thought that if I ever wrote out a list of my favorite villains he'd have to go on it simply because he's such a spectacular b@$!@^d. I mean, spoiler[he literally holds his enemy's lives in his hands in the form of gold beads that kill the person they are connected to when broken]... that is just too cool. And of course NEXT! also introduced us to off-again, on-again villain Xellos, my favorite Slayers character. He's the only character in the series that rivals Lina in terms of power, but he's just so cool and collected all the time. He's also the kind of character that draws you further into the story because you always wonder what he's up to. Come to think of it, Phibrizzo would actually make a decent candidate for the betrayal list, since he spoiler[tricks Lina's group into believing that he's just a (mostly) innocent pickpocket] As for Berserk, I just want to add one more thought before I'm done talking about it. It's not just the gore that bugs me, its the way that it seems to sensationalize the gore. I remember at one point looking at volumes of Berserk in my local comic shop and noticing that every other cover seemed to feature a guy in armor, covered in blood or carrying a bloody sword. That's the way someone decided that the series would be marketed, and that doesn't sit right with me. I have not, and will not, suggest that this series is bad in any way. I just have no intention of ever reading it, which was all I was trying to say in the first place. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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When it isn't shameful at all, and yet you're asserting it is. The fact that you don't know why "for shame" can be viewed as being rude is pretty sad. The list is finite, there's only so many examples that could be put on. Of course Lynzee is not going to be able to keep everyone happy by including every title that her readers think should be on there. heck, she's only seen so many titles, she can't watch everything. Now sure, I think many entries on her list weren't shocking at all, and that she could have made way for some much better ones. However, saying "for shame" just because she didn't think of the exact title you wanted is pretty rude. You're not the centre of the universe, there will be times when the title that you think should be on the list is not there. How about, instead of mocking Lynzee by saying that she should be ashamed about missing an Idolmaster Xenoglossia character, you word it so you're not insulting her? Just say that you would have liked to have seen spoiler[Yukiho] on the list and leave it at that. Other people who have seen the series agree with you, you get a feeling of "hey, I was right, spoiler[Yukiho] should have been on there", and you manage to spend time in the thread without insulting Lynzee for not kow-towing to your demands and asking your opinion first before making her list. |
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jymmy
 Posts: 1244 |
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This is of course the only logical view on this, but I think the writer means more about how it comes across to the viewer. But yeah, the character never lied, and they didn't even deliberately conceal the truth - as they say, they legitimately don't understand what they're so upset about. Regarding the whole spoiler[Soul Gem] thing, I sure as hell don't get what they were so freaked out about. |
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Fencedude5609
Posts: 5088 |
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*sigh* I was more referring to the entirety of the thread thus far, and the joke is that no one but me and about three other people give a flying fudge about Idolmaster Xenoglossia. |
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Etrien
Posts: 525 Location: Tokyo, Japan |
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Er, maybe you're just kidding around and I'm misreading your tone, but if you're seriously accusing him of being rude, I can't help but wonder if this is a consequence of linguistic differences between American and New Zealand English...? Because in modern American English, the phrase "for shame" is rarely used seriously. It's frequently just used for joking or sarcastic disappointment, especially when the speaker didn't actually expect anything other than the statement. "You mean they don't serve pizza at this mexican restaurant? For shame!" |
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Fencedude5609
Posts: 5088 |
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Exactly this. I don't think I have ever heard the phrase "for shame!" used in a serious manner. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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@Fence:
Yeah, I wonder how many people got that so-called "joke". Especially considering that saying "for shame" is completely within your usual caustic posting behaviour. Posts like your original one are good examples of when emoticons or "just kidding" postscripts are useful in avoiding people getting the wrong idea. You seem to like posting one or two-line comments which are deliberately vague, cryptic or misleading. I mean, you do it frequently, maybe even a couple hundred times. This gets people annoyed with you and they tell you off, whereupon you can then correct them on what you actually meant. But despite your obvious enjoyment at watching people get confused and irritated*, if you were upfront about your opinion in the first place and stopped baiting people then you wouldn't have half the problems on this Forum that you do have. TL;DR - we don't have crystal balls and we aren't mind readers, so stop acting like we should know what you're thinking. * I don't think you would repeatedly and frequently do it if it wasn't fun for you.
No, I'm not kidding around. In New Zealand at least, "for shame" is not exclusive to younger people (I've heard people in their early fifties use it). It's use is rude or not depending on the speaker's relationship to the target. Amongst friends it would be joking and/or good-natured ribbing. "For shame. You said you'd get a five-wicket bag but only got 3/28." "That's far too much deodorant, all the chicks will run away with you reeking like that. For shame." However, aimed at someone who is not a friend it would indeed come off as an insult, often deserved but not always. "Oh my gosh, a South African fan has just run out onto the pitch and punched the referee. For shame. What has the great sport of rugby come to?" "You just insulted every pensioner with that ageist rant. For shame." Anyway, since I doubt Fence and Lynzee are close friends, I saw his post as not being a joke. Last edited by dtm42 on Sun Jan 27, 2013 8:24 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Fencedude5609
Posts: 5088 |
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You impart a level of personal animus to my posts that does not exist. |
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jymmy
Posts: 1244 |
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I got that the original post was sarcastic/ironic/a joke/whatever, but really, an "Oh, I didn't mean that seriously" would have been much more helpful than "Since when is "for shame" considered rude in this context?". It was clear where dtm42's misinterpretation lay and the response was obviously baiting.
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Etrien
Posts: 525 Location: Tokyo, Japan |
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I had a feeling that might be the case. Honestly, at first glance it just looked like you were giving him a hard time for the hell of it, but that didn't mesh with the impression I have of you from your other posts. So, then I thought it might just be the old language barrier acting up again, which is why I made that (and this) post. One thing living abroad has made me very aware of is the fact that the same phrases can have seriously different levels of impact or meaning between the various English-speaking countries. In modern American English, "for shame" is frequently used, but almost always in a non-serious manner. It's inclusion with a statement is already akin to a verbal emoticon or declaration of sarcasm, much like "oh noes" or "gee golly". "No Xenoglossia, WTF" <-- Possibly genuine surprise or dissatisfaction "No Xenoglossia, for shame" <-- Joking disappointment |
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Fencedude5609
Posts: 5088 |
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Precisely. That phrase is essentially a sarcasm tag. I'm not going to toss in emoticons or sarcasm tags or explain the goddamn joke to people who can't grasp an incredibly common colloquialism and then go on multi-paragraph tirades against me. Naganna happen. Context. How does it work?! |
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