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Rahxephon91
Joined: 08 Jun 2003
Posts: 1859
Location: Park Forest IL.
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 Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 4:20 pm
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He seems to be able to deliver shows of all kinds of genres, so I'm not sure why he wouldn't be able to do a good kids show. One that's without all his usual dark themes.
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TitanXL
Joined: 08 Jun 2010
Posts: 4036
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 4:35 pm
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| dtm42 wrote: | | If I showed a six-year-old girl PMMM and she saw Mami get decapitated and then eaten, she'd be pretty traumatised too. |
I doubt it, Japanese kids see worse in their shows already. Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't remember any blood in that scene and it actually happens off screen. Madoka was pretty tame all things considered. I think the average fight scene in One Piece or Naruto is more violent.
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Juno016
Joined: 09 Jan 2012
Posts: 2387
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 5:28 pm
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A ton of kids (though mostly their mothers) recognized my Kyuubey costume when I was in Japan. That's gotta be worth something, right?
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zeo1fan
Joined: 02 Sep 2011
Posts: 1016
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 5:29 pm
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| Polycell wrote: |
| zeo1fan wrote: | | I hate that people act like Madoka was dark for the sake of a twist. It was a tragedy from start to finish. People who didn't notice the more ominous points at the start were just ignorant. |
They're also extremely easy to overlook until the show latches on with its teeth and chows down on any contrary impressions(though I wouldn't call it a tragedy - it's very much a dark-as-hell magical girl show, happy ending included). The twist is there, but as zendervai said the work doesn't rely on it. |
Um, no. It's a tragedy.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Tragedy
Madoka fits the requirements. Like Hope Chapman said, Tragedies don't always have to mean sad endings. Often times, fans give the impression that the story is dark for its own sake when darkness just naturally rises from the story. I'm sure with time it'll be recognized as such by more and more people. Tragedy is a genre like any other (incidentally, 'Magical Girl' and 'Tragedy' aren't mutually exclusive from each other, just as the 'Magical Girl' genre isn't mutually exclusive from any other larger genre such as 'Mystery' or 'Adventure').
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zeo1fan
Joined: 02 Sep 2011
Posts: 1016
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 5:34 pm
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| TitanXL wrote: |
| dtm42 wrote: | | If I showed a six-year-old girl PMMM and she saw Mami get decapitated and then eaten, she'd be pretty traumatised too. |
I doubt it, Japanese kids see worse in their shows already. Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't remember any blood in that scene and it actually happens off screen. Madoka was pretty tame all things considered. I think the average fight scene in One Piece or Naruto is more violent. |
Can we just get something out of the way? Madoka is a seinen, meaning it's aimed at adults. It may not be particularly violent, but it is disturbing. And I don't think many children would understand why it's disturbing or meaningful until they were a bit older (possibly Madoka's age, as that would be a time when they could understand being broken into moral grayness as the characters were).
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Shay Guy
Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2123
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 5:59 pm
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Can we not cite TV Tropes for a term this well-established?
My take is that Sayaka's character arc is a tragedy; the rest, not so much.
| zeo1fan wrote: | | Can we just get something out of the way? Madoka is a seinen, meaning it's aimed at adults. |
Seinen is an adjective in an English context, but yes, though that doesn't mean kids don't watch it.
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TitanXL
Joined: 08 Jun 2010
Posts: 4036
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:04 pm
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| Juno016 wrote: | | A ton of kids (though mostly their mothers) recognized my Kyuubey costume when I was in Japan. That's gotta be worth something, right? |
Madoka was pretty popular with younger audiences. It's not really uncommon for a seinen anime to be popular with kids. K-ON was another series huge with kids.
| zeo1fan wrote: | | Can we just get something out of the way? Madoka is a seinen, meaning it's aimed at adults. It may not be particularly violent, but it is disturbing. And I don't think many children would understand why it's disturbing or meaningful until they were a bit older (possibly Madoka's age, as that would be a time when they could understand being broken into moral grayness as the characters were). |
I think you greatly underestimate children. There's plenty of kid shows that already delve into that moral gray territory just fine.
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zeo1fan
Joined: 02 Sep 2011
Posts: 1016
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:17 pm
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| Shay Guy wrote: |
Can we not cite TV Tropes for a term this well-established?
My take is that Sayaka's character arc is a tragedy; the rest, not so much.
| zeo1fan wrote: | | Can we just get something out of the way? Madoka is a seinen, meaning it's aimed at adults. |
Seinen is an adjective in an English context, but yes, though that doesn't mean kids don't watch it. |
Excuse me? Tragedy is Madoka's genre. It's characterized by pretty much all of the tropes that appear in the typical tragedy; it's a story about good people who suffer great falls as a result of their own fatal flaws and then it ends with the fall of a character of great status. Why are there so many resistant people in this forum?
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zeo1fan
Joined: 02 Sep 2011
Posts: 1016
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:18 pm
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Not to mention it features the catharsis necessary of a tragedy as well. 
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Maidenoftheredhand
Joined: 21 Jun 2007
Posts: 2633
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:36 pm
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| zeo1fan wrote: | |
I hate that people act like Madoka was dark for the sake of a twist. It was a tragedy from start to finish. People who didn't notice the more ominous points at the start were just ignorant.
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Please, I guess you didn't see comments from both sides of Pacific talking about episode 3 and joking about Gen's involvement making a sweet magical girl anime. We even got the "real ending" after that episode showing the true nature of the series. It was pretty clear they wanted to "trick" the audience. Whether people saw it or not is besides the point (and from comments I would say most people did not see it).
As for myself I started watching the series after episode 10 aired so I knew there was more to it ahead of time but for people who went in blind it is a different story.
I am not saying Madoka was just about its dark plot twists (although there were quite a few in the story). Heck I am the one arguing that there is more to Gen than that (it's certainly not like Madoka is the only series I or other people have watched of his).
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TsukasaElkKite
Joined: 22 Nov 2005
Posts: 3951
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:41 pm
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HAHAHA I predict this is gonna be a mindscrew 
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zeo1fan
Joined: 02 Sep 2011
Posts: 1016
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:53 pm
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| Maidenoftheredhand wrote: |
| zeo1fan wrote: | |
I hate that people act like Madoka was dark for the sake of a twist. It was a tragedy from start to finish. People who didn't notice the more ominous points at the start were just ignorant.
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Please, I guess you didn't see comments from both sides of Pacific talking about episode 3 and joking about Gen's involvement making a sweet magical girl anime. We even got the "real ending" after that episode showing the true nature of the series. It was pretty clear they wanted to "trick" the audience. Whether people saw it or not is besides the point (and from comments I would say most people did not see it).
As for myself I started watching the series after episode 10 aired so I knew there was more to it ahead of time but for people who went in blind it is a different story.
I am not saying Madoka was just about its dark plot twists (although there were quite a few in the story). Heck I am the one arguing that there is more to Gen than that (it's certainly not like Madoka is the only series I or other people have watched of his). |
Oh really? How about the very first scene of the series? Or Homura's prophecy to Madoka about how she'd lose everything she loved if she tried to change? Or Homura trying to kill Kyubey? or Madoka wandering into the garage and seeing Kyubey fall bloody from the ceiling? Or Mami's stipulations that death was part of the Magical Girl deal and that she hunted in the red light district as well as suicide spots? Or the opening and its lyrics? I'm not trying to say that viewers are morons, but anyone could have at least begun to have caught on to the nature of the story after all that...
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Chagen46
Joined: 27 Jun 2010
Posts: 4377
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:56 pm
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I have no idea why everyone is acting like Gen can't write anything other than horror/tragedy. A good writer is one who can write in many different genres, instead of being stuck to just one.
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zeo1fan
Joined: 02 Sep 2011
Posts: 1016
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:38 pm
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| Chagen46 wrote: | | I have no idea why everyone is acting like Gen can't write anything other than horror/tragedy. A good writer is one who can write in many different genres, instead of being stuck to just one. |
I concur. 
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Sven Viking
Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 1039
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:58 pm
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| Chagen46 wrote: | | I have no idea why everyone is acting like Gen can't write anything other than horror/tragedy. |
I'm not saying he necessarily can't or won't... but if he doesn't... well, there is already kind of a precedent in children's television. (Note: this is not a recommendation.)
I'll reserve my opinion until I've seen how many women get strangled in Gargantia.
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