Forum - View topicAnswerman - What Does Darker Than Black's License Withdrawal Mean?
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DmonHiro
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OK, seriously? Can't you people read? FMA BELONGS to Aniplex. They're not stealing anything, it's their property. They "loaned it" to Funi, and now Funi has to give it back. There's no fight to be had. There's nothing Funi can do if Aniplex does not renew their license.
Yes, it kind of would, because it would cause discontent among the Japanese buyers. Reverse importation fears are high, so there are three ways Japanese companies can go about it: 1. Sell inferior quality copies, but cheaper, for the R1 so that the Japanese buyers buy the higher quality R2. There are numerous way to do this: dub only for R1, locking subtitles, DVD only, etc. They might still lose some sales though. 2. Sell the same quality in R1 as in R2, but at a much slower turnaround. Risky, because Japanese fans have started to wait. 3. Sell the same quality at the same price for both R1 and R2. They don't lose any Japanese sales, and they get a few extra sales from the R1 people. Which do you think is more profitable? |
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Mohawk52
 Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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This begs another question; if this can happen to DTB, and someone established like Funimation, why can't the same thing happen to the forever running waste of license of Macross (aka Robo Tech") that seems to be set in concrete by the tw@s at Harmony Gold?
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DmonHiro
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Because, Mohawk52, the tw@ts at Harmony Gold didn't exactly license Macross. It's a complete mess, but I'll try and explain. HG licensed the footage from Macross and others and remade it into Robotech. They then applied for trademark on Robotech. And they got it. Because Macross is part of Robotech, the actual creators of the Macros anime can't release outside Japan without HGs permission. Also, get this: HG actually tried to get the trademark for Macross IN JAPAN. The nerve of those tw@ts is amazing.
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Mohawk52
Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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Wasn't there also a long running lawsuit in Japan between the two co-creators of the original Macross that HG had licensed and therefore the plaintifs were to busy fighting amongst themselves to also notice the overseas mess and sorting that out as well? Basically HG got away with it for so long, but now that lawsuit has finally been sorted in Japan surely they could say to HG "Right, enough is enough. You lose." with an injunction prohibiting HG from ever distributing Robotech, which in actuality is just a butchered version of Macross, ever again? I'm sure they could if they put some effort towards it.
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Alan45
 Village Elder Posts: 9844 Location: Virginia |
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@Mohawk52
Apparently the license holders of Macross don't care about the rights outside Japan. Or rather they don't care enough to spend the time and money to settle the issue in a US court. Harmony Gold has shown a willingness to go to court over any and all rights pertaining to this show. Also keep in mind that the rights were obtained long enough ago that we don't know what the terms were. It is possible that the Japanese rights holders have been informed that the case is not winnable. We won't know unless they actually try it in court. |
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Lynx Amali
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The Macross thing is a completely different ballpark than something like DtB's issues.
Basically, HG didn't license the series off of Big West/Studio Nue, the original holders. They licensed it off of Tatsunoko instead because Tatsunoko had helped with the original series and pretty much just the original series. Whether or not they were in the right, that's another discussion. Studio Nue and Big West are the ones that control the Macross trademark in Japan, according to Japanese courts. Basically, it's a case of a contract being misinterpreted and never reconciled. If I recall correctly, there's been a few interviews with Kawamori where he's upset about it; the big one being the live action movie. Nobody actually approached him about it. Tokyopop was going to release the Macross 7 Trash manga (they even have it listed as one of their coming soon titles in the back of a few of their manga releases) but didn't, probably because of HG getting a little nervy because this was during the time they were REALLY uptight about it. Last edited by Lynx Amali on Tue Jan 26, 2016 12:55 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Mohawk52
Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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leafy sea dragon
 Posts: 7163 Location: Another Kingdom |
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Because most businesses do not work that way. Most businesses have upstream markets and downstream markets, but in Japan, anime only exists in the upstream market, and Aniplex is strictly an upstream company. It'd be as if every car manufacturer prices their cars like a Ferrari, or a Mercedes, or a Porche, or a Lamborghini.
That actually illustrates a problem there: The anime business is not catering to a wide enough audience. For the amount of product they put out, their audience is incredibly narrow. If anime studios can afford to put out the quantity they do now, they can afford to try something aimed at the mainstream every now and then. (Well, I guess we got it in Mr. Osomatsu.)
What I meant was that the early Peanuts specials were purposefully simple-looking and meant for very low-definition TVs, and their animation was limited. Outside of a few theatrical features here and there, like Race for Your Life, Charlie Brown or Bon Voyage, Charlie Brown, Peanuts animation is normally extremely straightforward. Come Home, Snoopy has a lot of solid-color backgrounds, for instance. In these cases, I don't really see the big deal in having to watch them in HD, at least without drastic levels of restoration beyond the original broadcast's quality. |
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DmonHiro
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Agreed, but that's a result, not a cause. There used to be a greater variety, but the audience for it gradually shrunk until it was no longer profitable. I believe the reason the industry doesn't try to widen the audience is because they've already seen that there is no audience outside of what they have right now. I'm not 100% convinced it's true, but anime is a niece in Japan, so they might be right. |
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relyat08
 Posts: 4125 Location: Northern Virginia |
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I understand the argument that the core people who are paying for anime should and will get the content that they want, but having a larger paying audience is rarely a bad thing. Right now the audience is pretty niche. And that's okay to an extent, but I think everyone should want the anime industry and community to grow. A larger audience provides more opportunities for the industry to try original things and to target different groups. I like Otaku-centric stuff, but animation has the potential to make a lot more than just those shows. If there is enough paying interest in different kinds of content, it will get made.
I'm with you on not being entirely sure that's the case anymore. I think there is a lot of potential for growth. |
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AbZeroNow
Posts: 519 |
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In case anyone wants to know, Darker Than Black Season 2 expires on Hulu Feb. 2nd
https://twitter.com/WTK/status/692103947323117568 |
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Dfens
Posts: 459 |
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The thing is that the Japanese are stuck in the mindset of how they do things and refuse to try new things and will only make changes only when the market forces them to do so.
Right now it seems as of late the people buying media at the Japanese level of pricing domestically in Japan are keeping things stable enough that the studios aren't worried about the market crashing anytime soon. Could the bubble burst who knows, when or if it happens don't expect cheaper prices on Anime outside Japan. Even if Japan decided tomorrow to slash the price of a Blu-Ray disc in half it wouldn't make them anymore more money so their is no incentive to do so. Basically they would have to sell twice as many discs to make the same amount of money vs the current pricing model. So if they fall short of double the units sold guess what they just lost money. People seem to think that hey slash the price and you'll sale 4 times or 6 or 8 times as many units and the bottom line will be more profit overall. Thing is when they did cut prices they didn't even come close to those numbers in fact they didn't even hit double the units sold and lost money and went back to the old model that worked. Don't you find it strange you never see a shelf life edition anywhere online of people with massive collections as we do here on ANN or in other countries? Price is part of the problem for those who live in Japan as well available space due to their homes/apartments being much smaller. Also they don't want to own dozens of shows like some of us so even if they could buy more shows and even if they were more affordable their is no guarantee that they just wouldn't spend their extra money on other things besides more Anime. I'm still scratching my head on how the small group of Otaku who actually pay the money that keeps these companies afloat are some how part of the problem. Every thing now a days is based off a light novel or a manga series their is hardly any original content that much at all anymore. The mega fans will support and more importantly buy the shows they like even if it's double or more than what we pay and the others that flop in sales ain't their problem. Maybe the people who liked those shows should have came out and supported their failed series more instead of blaming others. It's not a question of oh well the failed shows are better quality but the latest rehash of a old idea or ecchi show is still being made like clock work and is ruining the industry. At the end of the day the industry is a business and will continue to make what sells discs. If you aren't happy than well too bad who are we tell a foreign market what to make and cater to us when are dollars are a drop in the bucket to their primary domestic market. Anime may be more mainstream in Japan than in over seas markets but that doesn't mean that they want to buy and own every show they watch. Some fans may only watch a handful of shows or maybe just 1 or 2 a season if that. And that's just the way things are even myself personally after some soul searching have realized I buy too much Anime and have stopped buying like crazy like I use to. Even with the much cheaper pricing and me being financially able, it's just not worth it for me anymore with all the hours I'm now working and the little free time I have left. Be as it may I don't see myself as some sort of elite Anime Fan that only those like myself can afford a Aniplex title that is just preposterous. I've said it before you can save and earn enough in a lifetime to own a single Aniplex title while you might not be able to buy a home or something expensive of that nature. Yes I could buy every Aniplex of America title right now, but do I want to own every single one of them like some people nope. So buy what you love and can afford, if not save or just move on Aniplex isn't the only studio in town. I'm tired of hearing well I want that particular Aniplex show and another show from another studio isn't good enough I should only have to pay what I think it's worth. The way things are looking now if you've been putting off buying a Aniplex show that has been licensed out you may want to pick it up as soon as you can or risk it going out of print. Then you'll really be crying when it's on Ebay or Amazon for some outrageous price. Last edited by Dfens on Tue Jan 26, 2016 8:35 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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sunflower
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I found, when I got rid of cable and switched to 100% streaming, that there were shows and networks that wanted to make it difficult for me to watch them legally via streaming. I also found that after a couple of weeks with all the other options available that I didn't even miss them. That's how it is for me when a show gets taken down from CR or Funi. For every one, there are ten other shows I've been meaning to watch and still can.
So my reaction to this is: You want to take it down? Whatever. I'll watch the anime from companies bright enough to leave their works legally accessible on Funi and CR. |
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HdE
Posts: 50 |
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I want to quote more from this, because it's all kind of relevant to how I feel - but I don't want to post a massive essay! I have to agree that the the asking prices for anime we're seeing now are certainly not affordable for everybody. I am AMAZED when I see the hauls some of the folks post on UK anime websites. I'm talking about deliveries of multiple hundreds of pounds worth of anime. I just couldn't spend that amount of money on a regular basis, thanks to my individual circumstances. I'm already simply priced out of the CE market. Standard editions are becoming fairly pricey as well - certainly more so than they were 5 or 6 years back when I started building up my DVD collection again. On the one hand, I'm very grateful for a sizeable stash of anime that I can go back to and rewatch whenever I want. On the other... I feel kind of sad that rising rices and entities like Aniplex are effectively prohibiting me from buying some newer product. It does bug me when I see dicussions on these kinds of topics where folks seem to argue about whether anime is too cheap / too expensive rather than focusing on the issue of availability. I do sincerely believe we're seeing anime become a rich man's pasttime if we're talking about the physical media market. And I absolutely hate that. |
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Polycell
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