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NEWS: Maryland School Library to Remove Dragon Ball Manga


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Ktimene's Lover



Joined: 23 Apr 2005
Posts: 2242
Location: Glendale, AZ (Proudly living in the desert)
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 12:35 pm Reply with quote
Sheesh! These parents need to learn there is a difference in the standards of what is allowed in Japanese children's series and American children's series. Hypocrisy this is because cable cartoons will often have sexual innuendo or nudity.
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Odd_shapeshifter



Joined: 23 Aug 2008
Posts: 15
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 12:44 pm Reply with quote
Ctimene's Lover wrote:
Sheesh! These parents need to learn there is a difference in the standards of what is allowed in Japanese children's series and American children's series. Hypocrisy this is because cable cartoons will often have sexual innuendo or nudity.


I totally agree and then of course there's this: (taken from wikipedia)

Quote:

The initial issue of Shonen Jump sold over 300,000 copies, far exceeding Viz's expected 100,000 copies and making it one of the top comic titles in 2002. The first printing of 250,000 copies was sold out before the issue was released, and two additional printings were necessary to fully meet the demand.[8] After the initial launch, the magazine had an average monthly circulation of 190,000, but it quickly grew to 205,000 by its first anniversary. The August 2003 issue, which included a demo version of an upcoming Yu-Gi-Oh! PC game, was the top issue with 540,000 copies sold.[31] As of 2008, the magazine has a circulation of 215,000, with subscriptions constituting 54% of the copies distributed.[15]

Though targeted towards "tween & teen male consumers", according to Viz Media the magazine enjoys a relatively high number of female and adult readers as well, comprising 36% and 37% of its readership, respectively. The Shonen Jump reader has a median age of 16 years, and over half of the audience is between the ages of 13 and 17. Official measurements by Simmons notes that among minor age readers the female readership is slightly lower and the median age is 12.[15]


The 9 year old is not within their target-group as in the parent should have never allowed her 9 year old to bring home the book in the first place, I'm pretty sure she didn't check it out herself before she took it home.

Parents, it's the same with other media like games for example, they have no clue what kind of games their children are playing and usually ignore the age restriction on the box.

It should not be banned, those stupid parents should be banned from the library.
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kokuryu



Joined: 07 Apr 2007
Posts: 915
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 12:44 pm Reply with quote
Mighty Mouse was worse than Dragonball ever was.
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bwcbwc



Joined: 30 Apr 2008
Posts: 59
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 12:48 pm Reply with quote
It's not like older kids and adults are going to be denied access. For an elementary school library in the US, I can kind of see where the majority would probably not want Japanese levels of sexual content in the graphic novels. If they were pulling this material from a public library or a high school library, I'd have much greater concern.

I can also agree that the school district was stupid to buy the manga for an elementary library without being aware of the cultural differences, But I can easily see a situation where someone had seen the (edited) anime on US TV and thought they knew what the content was about. Or the librarian just took a list of books the kids voted for and ordered them without understanding what they were getting into.

"Sheesh, these otaku need to learn that the culture in the US is different from in Japan."
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RogueJedi86



Joined: 18 Aug 2006
Posts: 501
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:00 pm Reply with quote
I feel bad for all those kids at that school who will be confused reading all the volumes after the first volume without having read the first. Surely the parents' description in the article is hyperbole right? I've never heard of Dragonball having any depictions of "sexual innuendo or sexual contact".
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Sheleigha



Joined: 09 May 2008
Posts: 1674
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:00 pm Reply with quote
I love how in Canadian Chapters bookstores, manga are split up into three different sections: graphic novel, teen, and childrens. Why? I don't know, it's stupid to have to go to several sections. But can you guess which section DB and DBZ is in? That's right! Childrens! It's just THAT kiddie, isn't it?
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atunderdogk



Joined: 23 Aug 2009
Posts: 74
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:04 pm Reply with quote
I used to live in Wicomico County. There's not much that ever happens there so it's no surprise that they would make a big deal out of something like this. If I remember correctly, some of the characters are naked and theres some crude humor. I don't remember anything that was THAT big of a deal. I mean I guess I can understand if some parents don't want their children reading it. That's all well and fine. But why don't they just read/screen stuff before they their children? If they are that concerned, they seem like they'd research stuff before buying it for their children and then making a fuss about it later (to the man in Dallas).
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TatsuGero23



Joined: 18 Nov 2008
Posts: 1277
Location: Sniper Island, USA (It's in your heart!)
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:06 pm Reply with quote
bwcbwc wrote:
It's not like older kids and adults are going to be denied access. For an elementary school library in the US, I can kind of see where the majority would probably not want Japanese levels of sexual content in the graphic novels. If they were pulling this material from a public library or a high school library, I'd have much greater concern.

I can also agree that the school district was stupid to buy the manga for an elementary library without being aware of the cultural differences, But I can easily see a situation where someone had seen the (edited) anime on US TV and thought they knew what the content was about. Or the librarian just took a list of books the kids voted for and ordered them without understanding what they were getting into.

"Sheesh, these otaku need to learn that the culture in the US is different from in Japan."


I agree, I can understand the reaction with it being an elementary and middle school since generally its felt thats a bit too soon to deal with issues like that. Also later in the series it gets into a kind of casual dismemberment, things like missing limbs and holes in body parts, violence, guns, and death so it might not be appropriate in general for kids too young or mentally immature. Of course odds are we are totally okay with all that cartoony violence and the parents and school felt that was fine. It is the US after all.

And outside of Bulma's name, I don't think the series goes into any innuendos. It's all pretty straight forward with the ecchy jokes. And like RogueJedi86 jokes about, its really only in the early part of the series.


Last edited by TatsuGero23 on Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:09 pm; edited 1 time in total
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KanonAirHaruhiShuffle



Joined: 18 Jul 2008
Posts: 199
Location: California
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:07 pm Reply with quote
Odd_shapeshifter wrote:
Ctimene's Lover wrote:
Sheesh! These parents need to learn there is a difference in the standards of what is allowed in Japanese children's series and American children's series. Hypocrisy this is because cable cartoons will often have sexual innuendo or nudity.


I totally agree and then of course there's this: (taken from wikipedia)

Quote:

The initial issue of Shonen Jump sold over 300,000 copies, far exceeding Viz's expected 100,000 copies and making it one of the top comic titles in 2002. The first printing of 250,000 copies was sold out before the issue was released, and two additional printings were necessary to fully meet the demand.[8] After the initial launch, the magazine had an average monthly circulation of 190,000, but it quickly grew to 205,000 by its first anniversary. The August 2003 issue, which included a demo version of an upcoming Yu-Gi-Oh! PC game, was the top issue with 540,000 copies sold.[31] As of 2008, the magazine has a circulation of 215,000, with subscriptions constituting 54% of the copies distributed.[15]

Though targeted towards "tween & teen male consumers", according to Viz Media the magazine enjoys a relatively high number of female and adult readers as well, comprising 36% and 37% of its readership, respectively. The Shonen Jump reader has a median age of 16 years, and over half of the audience is between the ages of 13 and 17. Official measurements by Simmons notes that among minor age readers the female readership is slightly lower and the median age is 12.[15]


The 9 year old is not within their target-group as in the parent should have never allowed her 9 year old to bring home the book in the first place, I'm pretty sure she didn't check it out herself before she took it home.

Parents, it's the same with other media like games for example, they have no clue what kind of games their children are playing and usually ignore the age restriction on the box.

It should not be banned, those stupid parents should be banned from the library.


Totally agree like for instance where I work I always see parents buying their kids games like Grand Theft Auto, Halo, Gears of War, and so on because their kids beg for them. The parent with their kid come home start playing the game and then you see like hookers, strong swearing, blood, shooting, and so on and then the parent gets mad that the store sold them a non-kid friendly game. And with manga it's almost the same thing they have an age rating for a reason and if people ignore it it's their own fault for not looking at the warning that hey Dragon Ball manga is not meant for little kids, Grand Theft Auto video games is for young adults, porn is for people over the age of 18, and so on.

This might sound a little mean but sometimes you just can't be sorry for people.
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VegettoEX



Joined: 22 Aug 2003
Posts: 107
Location: New Jersey
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:10 pm Reply with quote
bwcbwc wrote:
But I can easily see a situation where someone had seen the (edited) anime on US TV and thought they knew what the content was about.

This is something we have talked about endlessly over at Daizenshuu EX, and was brought up yet again in our own discussion thread on the news story.

Both FUNimation and Viz can be seen at least partially at fault. Both companies (since 1995 for FUNimation and 1998 for Viz, beginning their respective productions of the series in different formats) have endlessly flip-flopped on their marketing and presentation of the series.

Is it kid-friendly or is it super-bloody-hardcore-uncut, FUNimation? The manga is rated for "Teens", but it's heavily censored. The video games are also rated "T" but have censored name changes from the edited dub. Viz releases a new "Chapter Book" version of the story under their "Viz Kids" label right alongside endless reprints of the standard manga.

On one hand, we absolutely have to applaud parent involvement. There is nothing better than a parent who keeps up with their child, encourages them, and looks out for their best interest. On the other hand, it seems like the same ol' wash-rinse-repeat. Despite the parent getting "involved", they flip out and instead of handling it on their own, alert who-knows-who (who in turn alerts the press), and the entire industry and medium is suddenly demonized. Look at the uneducated comments on the story; people are actually interpreting the phrase "graphic novel" to inherently mean "violence" and "pornography".

As I noted in the article's comments, some of the story elements are being taken completely out of context (which, of course, is no surprise). I'll be first in line to admit that there are plenty of examples of crude humor and poop-talk... but it wouldn't be DragonBall without it. Does this somehow make the series pornographic? Should it be banned from libraries?

I dunno. Nine-years-old seems about right in line for the series. After all, FUNimation says a nine-year-old is born every day. Isn't that their exact audience?
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angieness



Joined: 08 Aug 2004
Posts: 162
Location: Columbus, OH
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:12 pm Reply with quote
Well, looking through the first volume

-Goku beats up a fish naked
-Bulma offers Goku a chance to touch her butt in exchange for a dragon ball
-Bulma bathes Goku
-Bulma bathes, provided it doesn't show anything
-Goku does "pat pat" on Bulma's crotch as she sleep and lays his head down on there and proceeds to take her panties off.
-Master Roshi asks Bulma to see her panties
-Bulma lifts up her skirt to show Roshi her panties but she has nothing on
-Goku does "pat pat" on an old woman
-Bulma gives Oolong her bra size
-Oolong turns into a pair of panties
-Yamcha watches Bulma shower, you can see Bulma naked

So no, I'm not really surprised that it was removed hahahaha you can't say it's stupid for mothers to freak out over it when it does have full frontal nudity in it.
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KanonAirHaruhiShuffle



Joined: 18 Jul 2008
Posts: 199
Location: California
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:12 pm Reply with quote
atunderdogk wrote:
I used to live in Wicomico County. There's not much that ever happens there so it's no surprise that they would make a big deal out of something like this. If I remember correctly, some of the characters are naked and theres some crude humor. I don't remember anything that was THAT big of a deal. I mean I guess I can understand if some parents don't want their children reading it. That's all well and fine. But why don't they just read/screen stuff before they their children? If they are that concerned, they seem like they'd research stuff before buying it for their children and then making a fuss about it later (to the man in Dallas).


Well I know in the Dragon Ball anime in the 1st season Goku took Bulma's underwear off. She wakes up in her pajamas and helps Goku bring Master Roshi's turtle back to the sea. Bulma then flashed Master Roshi thinking she still had her underwear on.
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KanonAirHaruhiShuffle



Joined: 18 Jul 2008
Posts: 199
Location: California
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:16 pm Reply with quote
angieness wrote:
Well, looking through the first volume

-Goku beats up a fish naked
-Bulma offers Goku a chance to touch her butt in exchange for a dragon ball
-Bulma bathes Goku
-Bulma bathes, provided it doesn't show anything
-Goku does "pat pat" on Bulma's crotch as she sleep and lays his head down on there and proceeds to take her panties off.
-Master Roshi asks Bulma to see her panties
-Bulma lifts up her skirt to show Roshi her panties but she has nothing on
-Goku does "pat pat" on an old woman
-Bulma gives Oolong her bra size
-Oolong turns into a pair of panties
-Yamcha watches Bulma shower, you can see Bulma naked

So no, I'm not really surprised that it was removed hahahaha you can't say it's stupid for mothers to freak out over it when it does have full frontal nudity in it.


There was also a scene in the 2nd season I believe that Goku was naked like when that homeless kid stole all of Goku's items while swimming naked, the World Martial Arts Tournament with that girl who tried to distract Nam by taking all of her clothes off except for her bra and panties during the fight. Plus pretty much anything Master Roshi does is perverted.
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kawaiibunny3



Joined: 10 Aug 2008
Posts: 534
Location: Houston, Texas
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:20 pm Reply with quote
Isn't there even a "teens, 13+" rating on the back cover of the book? Its not like the "adult content" was a big secret :/ so it is kindof the library's fault of a public elementary school for not even checking for that.
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PetrifiedJello



Joined: 11 Mar 2009
Posts: 3782
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:23 pm Reply with quote
atunderdogk wrote:
But why don't they just read/screen stuff before they their children?

Did you not read the article? The entire banning stemmed from a parent doing just this.

I have to say, I'm a bit more curious how the book got into the library of elementary (and middle school) students to begin with.

Note that I'm not against such material, but I would suspect there would be a screening process before hand. I seriously doubt an issue of Cosmo would be in this library.

Oh well. Chuck this one up to a mother who insists alienating a child from the real world, rather than explain it to them, is the best course of action for the child.

To each their own.
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