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NEWS: Vic Mignogna Replaced in Morose Mononokean English Dub Cast (Update)

I’m not sure why ANN hasn’t talked about it yet, but Todd Haberkorn has been accused of a singular, but far more serious, instance of sexual assault:
/

Vanadise wrote:

Obviously ANN wields a huge amount of influence, and them reporting on it was enough to make the industry finally do something about Vic. Did you not know you had so much influence? If you had known, would you have done something earlier? Now that you know, what has to happen in order for you to take seriously other allegations of misconduct?

If this is true, and provable, then Vic can sue them for damages and defamation.

To bring up a similar case known to me. In 2007 a Mr. Donal Kinsella sleepwalked naked into the bedroom of a female colleague. This occurred during a company assignment in Africa. Kenmare put out a press release that could be counted as defamation of character. Their release implied, without giving details of the sleepwalking issue, that Mr. Kinsella was guilty of making inappropriate and uninvited sexual advances onto his colleague. The jury awarded Mr. Kinsella 10 million euros (12.5 million dollars), for slander.

I've warned ANN about this, and if they continue these types of stories it'll be at their own peril. They may think it's profitable for shock clicks in the short run perhaps, but I'm afraid they'll misstep eventually, and some of these articles would not hold the standards I find ethical acceptable for covering accusations of criminal behavior and is thus an annoyance at best.

Gemnist wrote:

I’m not sure why ANN hasn’t talked about it yet, but Todd Haberkorn has been accused of a singular, but far more serious, instance of sexual assault: /

They stated in the forum of the main article that it may be the subject of separate reporting that would take time to investigate and that discussions were to stay on the topic of Vic.

Greed1914 wrote:

Gemnist wrote: I’m not sure why ANN hasn’t talked about it yet, but Todd Haberkorn has been accused of a singular, but far more serious, instance of sexual assault: / They stated in the forum of the main article that it may be the subject of separate reporting that would take time to investigate and that discussions were to stay on the topic of Vic.

Bingo. Tempest already said any further articles on other VA's would come out in due time if they were being worked on. They took weeks of work and investigation before doing the initial article on Vic. This allegation IS more serious so I would expect the news staff to take at least as much, if not more, time investigating it before reporting on it. When/if that news article appears then everyone can discuss that matter, and probably rehash many of the same arguments we're already seeing now in regards to Vic.

I want to reiterate what Mad Scientist already said:

- Victim blame
- Try to downplay sexually or physically inappropriate conduct by implying that since it's not violent rape it doesn't matter, or by referring to victims of it as "victims" in air quotes, or through any similar method really. Something bad does not become good because there are worse things\
- Flood this thread with your off topic conspiracy or complaints about Twitter
- Personally attack people
- Ignore moderator warnings to stop any of the above or other rule breaking conduct

I had to remove some more posts who ignored this. I want to also make it clear that stopping such behavior in one thread and simply going into a different one to make the same posts is not ok. Several users are about to wind up on moderation for continuing to post the same things in every thread on Vic while ignoring our warnings.

But what I really want to know is, why did ANN decide to report on this now? ANN has existed since before any of this started going on, and surely you've had people on staff who have heard about it. Obviously ANN wields a huge amount of influence, and them reporting on it was enough to make the industry finally do something about Vic. Did you not know you had so much influence? If you had known, would you have done something earlier? Now that you know, what has to happen in order for you to take seriously other allegations of misconduct?

My mistake. I was unaware you had already looked into it, and meant no ill will towards anyone.

Vanadise wrote:

But what I really want to know is, why did ANN decide to report on this now? ANN has existed since before any of this started going on, and surely you've had people on staff who have heard about it. Obviously ANN wields a huge amount of influence, and them reporting on it was enough to make the industry finally do something about Vic. Did you not know you had so much influence? If you had known, would you have done something earlier? Now that you know, what has to happen in order for you to take seriously other allegations of misconduct?

This is coming up in the original article that ANN posted, and I think it comes down to money and motivations for reporting and clicks.

animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3091940&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=315

https://boundingintocomics.com/2019/02/06/anime-news-network-editor-at-large-mike-toole-calls-youtube-channels-clownfish-tv-and-lost-pause-nazis-over-vic-mignogna-videos/

Might get removed for off topic, but the owner of ANN actually seems to have his own interests in fair reporting on the matter. I don't like Vic at all, but the way this is handled is kind of... untrustworthy? Like the actual matter at hand (victims of sexual harrassment and assault) is getting lost in politics, when the victims need to be listened to and not lost in the money-grab that the companies that are only now speaking up have been making over it.

I am starting to get more upset with the companies - conventions, news outlets, not so sure about fellow voice actors since the entire voice acting inter-community seems to be toxic to those who want to keep their jobs - but those in power had the chance to speak up before now. They really should have sooner, and I hope that there are future powers that be that can learn from this.

Vanadise wrote:

But what I really want to know is, why did ANN decide to report on this now? ANN has existed since before any of this started going on, and surely you've had people on staff who have heard about it. Obviously ANN wields a huge amount of influence, and them reporting on it was enough to make the industry finally do something about Vic. Did you not know you had so much influence? If you had known, would you have done something earlier? Now that you know, what has to happen in order for you to take seriously other allegations of misconduct?

This is coming up in the original article that ANN posted, and I think it comes down to money and motivations for reporting and clicks.

animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3091940&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=315

https://boundingintocomics.com/2019/02/06/anime-news-network-editor-at-large-mike-toole-calls-youtube-channels-clownfish-tv-and-lost-pause-nazis-over-vic-mignogna-videos/

Might get removed for off topic, but the owner of ANN actually seems to have his own interests in fair reporting on the matter. I don't like Vic at all, but the way this is handled is kind of... untrustworthy? Like the actual matter at hand (victims of sexual harrassment and assault) is getting lost in politics, when the victims need to be listened to and not lost in the money-grab that the companies that are only now speaking up have been making over it.

I am starting to get more upset with the companies - conventions, news outlets, not so sure about fellow voice actors since the entire voice acting inter-community seems to be toxic to those who want to keep their jobs - but those in power had the chance to speak up before now. They really should have sooner, and I hope that there are future powers that be that can learn from this.

The actual malice standard requires that a plaintiff alleging defamation who is a public official or public figure prove that the publisher of the statement in question knew that the statement was false or acted in reckless disregard of its truth or falsity. Because of the extremely high burden of proof on the plaintiff, and the difficulty of proving the defendant's knowledge and intentions, such claims by public figures rarely prevail.

Everyone spouting off about libel here could probably do to look up the "actual malice" standard that is required of public figures (which Vic is considered, at least in a limited sense within the North American anime community and thus, associated publications) to prove libel in the United States.

From the Wikipedia article on the U.S. Supreme Court case New York Times Co. v. Sullivan (1964) which set this guideline (emphasis mine):

Quote:

The actual malice standard requires that a plaintiff alleging defamation who is a public official or public figure prove that the publisher of the statement in question knew that the statement was false or acted in reckless disregard of its truth or falsity. Because of the extremely high burden of proof on the plaintiff, and the difficulty of proving the defendant's knowledge and intentions, such claims by public figures rarely prevail.

The later case Hustler v. Falwell (dramatized in the movie The People v. Larry Flynt) also established that for a public figure to prove libel the intention needs to be to cause emotional distress or harm to one's body/career/reputation, which would also be hard to prove of articles that are merely reporting that allegations exist. Whatever you guys might be reading into these articles, it would be really really hard to prove in a court of law beyond a reasonable doubt that they were written intentionally to make Vic feel bad or ruin his career... as opposed to because these kinds of allegations against a public figure are newsworthy and fans might be interested in learning about it.

If the standard y'all are seemingly using here in the forums of "uh it just like, seems like it might be wrong? like I'm not sure? and it's kinda mean too?" were the standard used to prove libel, think about how different our media landscape would look. The entire industry of celebrity gossip rags wouldn't exist, for starters. For all you guys seem to claim to care about "innocent until proven guilty" or "the burden of proof" you don't seem to understand how this works at all in a real-world legal situation, and especially how that applies in the case of libel. In that case, Vic would be the plaintiff, not the defendant, and the burden to prove that a) the statements are recklessly false and b) were made with the intent of harming him are on him, not ANN or any other sites reporting this.

Vanadise wrote:

But what I really want to know is, why did ANN decide to report on this now? ANN has existed since before any of this started going on, and surely you've had people on staff who have heard about it. Obviously ANN wields a huge amount of influence, and them reporting on it was enough to make the industry finally do something about Vic. Did you not know you had so much influence? If you had known, would you have done something earlier? Now that you know, what has to happen in order for you to take seriously other allegations of misconduct?

This is coming up in the original article that ANN posted, and I think it comes down to money and motivations for reporting and clicks.

animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3091940&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=315

https://boundingintocomics.com/2019/02/06/anime-news-network-editor-at-large-mike-toole-calls-youtube-channels-clownfish-tv-and-lost-pause-nazis-over-vic-mignogna-videos/

Might get removed for off topic, but the owner of ANN actually seems to have his own interests in fair reporting on the matter. I don't like Vic at all, but the way this is handled is kind of... untrustworthy? Like the actual matter at hand (victims of sexual harrassment and assault) is getting lost in politics, when the victims need to be listened to and not lost in the money-grab that the companies that are only now speaking up have been making over it.

I am starting to get more upset with the companies - conventions, news outlets, not so sure about fellow voice actors since the entire voice acting inter-community seems to be toxic to those who want to keep their jobs - but those in power had the chance to speak up before now. They really should have sooner, and I hope that there are future powers that be that can learn from this.

The catalyst for this was Dylan Keilman. We've been talking about this publicly on Twitter for 2 weeks.

We know about a lot of other terrible people in the industry. We've known about them for years. The whisper network has kept some of our staff from going beyond locked doors with the wrong people. But that whisper network doesn't reach the fans, the 14-year-olds that idolize people in the industry.

I am starting to get more upset with the companies - conventions, news outlets, not so sure about fellow voice actors since the entire voice acting inter-community seems to be toxic to those who want to keep their jobs - but those in power had the chance to speak up before now. They really should have sooner, and I hope that there are future powers that be that can learn from this.