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NEWS: Netflix to Co-Produce Anime With Production I.G, Bones, WIT Studio


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0nsen



Joined: 01 Nov 2014
Posts: 256
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 5:28 am Reply with quote
People saying Devilman has no censorship because there is gore and nudity do not understand the Japanese aspect of anime. There's plenty of American movies with nudity and violence. That's not the part I'm afraid we will lose to Netflix.

I'm afraid due to Netflix' shift away from what makes anime uniquely Japanese we will lose an entire generation of non-Japanese fans to those anime Netflix funds. It will be like talking to people that claim to like anime and then say they really like Naruto or some such thing. You immediately know they are not really into anime and worse, you know they have no opportunity to really get into anime anymore.

It would be unreasonable to lay the blame on Netflix for this, but in the past 10 years, there has been pressure to remove the far end of the spectrum even from Japanese shows. There was a real crack down through legislation that affects anime and manga and I'm afraid this will only get worse with Netflix throwing their weight around. We've already lost the lolicon anime like Kodomo no Jikan and we stand to lose even more.
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zrnzle500



Joined: 04 Oct 2014
Posts: 3767
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 8:51 am Reply with quote
0nsen wrote:
People saying Devilman has no censorship because there is gore and nudity do not understand the Japanese aspect of anime. There's plenty of American movies with nudity and violence. That's not the part I'm afraid we will lose to Netflix.

I'm afraid due to Netflix' shift away from what makes anime uniquely Japanese we will lose an entire generation of non-Japanese fans to those anime Netflix funds. It will be like talking to people that claim to like anime and then say they really like Naruto or some such thing. You immediately know they are not really into anime and worse, you know they have no opportunity to really get into anime anymore.

It would be unreasonable to lay the blame on Netflix for this, but in the past 10 years, there has been pressure to remove the far end of the spectrum even from Japanese shows. There was a real crack down through legislation that affects anime and manga and I'm afraid this will only get worse with Netflix throwing their weight around. We've already lost the lolicon anime like Kodomo no Jikan and we stand to lose even more.


I hope you understand that when you say that you worry that Netflix's involvement could make anime lose what makes it uniquely Japanese and then define that as lolicon and lucky sukebe, a) many don't find that concerning and b) many don't even agree that that is what makes anime uniquely Japanese. It's fine if you like those kinds of shows, but for many, those are not aspects that got them interested in the medium or keep them interested in the medium. If anything, more anime like Netflix is making is more likely to gain more non-Japanese fans, and Netflix just making the kind of anime you fear will be lost is what would likely lose an entire generation of anime fans. I don't support legislating against those kinds of shows, but they don't exactly give anime a good name, outside or even inside Japan.

Even putting aside my own opinion of such shows, I'm not worried that they will go away anytime soon if shows like Eromanga-sensei and Ryuo's Work still get produced and sell very well - in the case of the former at least.
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Stuart Smith



Joined: 13 Jan 2013
Posts: 1298
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 9:43 am Reply with quote
0nsen wrote:
I'm afraid due to Netflix' shift away from what makes anime uniquely Japanese we will lose an entire generation of non-Japanese fans to those anime Netflix funds. It will be like talking to people that claim to like anime and then say they really like Naruto or some such thing. You immediately know they are not really into anime and worse, you know they have no opportunity to really get into anime anymore.


Are you saying Naruto isn't Japanese, or people who like Naruto aren't real fans?

Quote:
We've already lost the lolicon anime like Kodomo no Jikan and we stand to lose even more.


That's just plain false. There has still been loli focused anime every year. Even in non-lolicon focused shows like Fate/kaleid liner there's lolicon fanservice. That hasn't gone anywhere.

-Stuart Smith
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Cardcaptor Takato



Joined: 27 Jan 2018
Posts: 4881
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 10:57 am Reply with quote
Maybe it's just me but it seems kind of racist to me for Western anime fans to stereotype Japanese culture by equating lolicon with Japanese culture.
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Beatdigga



Joined: 26 Oct 2003
Posts: 4401
Location: New York
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:04 am Reply with quote
This has to be a parody of some sort. It just has to be.
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Chrono1000





PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 1:57 pm Reply with quote
0nsen wrote:
It would be unreasonable to lay the blame on Netflix for this, but in the past 10 years, there has been pressure to remove the far end of the spectrum even from Japanese shows. There was a real crack down through legislation that affects anime and manga and I'm afraid this will only get worse with Netflix throwing their weight around. We've already lost the lolicon anime like Kodomo no Jikan and we stand to lose even more.
Of all the things I could see being lost in anime due to western companies I would say that loli fans probably don't have to worry since there is a small but dedicated fan base in Japan for that type of show. This season they released the loli shogi show. Granted western companies getting into the anime production market will result in changes in the overall market since I am sure that Netflix does have rules about the type of content that is allowed in the shows that they finance.

Cardcaptor Takato wrote:
Maybe it's just me but it seems kind of racist to me for Western anime fans to stereotype Japanese culture by equating lolicon with Japanese culture.
It was somewhat tone deaf since BL and loli are made for small niche markets in Japan.
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Cardcaptor Takato



Joined: 27 Jan 2018
Posts: 4881
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 2:02 pm Reply with quote
At the end of the day, with Netflix losing both Disney and now likely all their 20th Century Fox content, Netflix needs more original content if they want to survive as a successful streaming service. Co-funding popular mainstream anime hits is an easy sure fire way for success for Netflix and results in an overall net benefit for anime fandom.
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Nacirema



Joined: 21 Mar 2015
Posts: 58
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 3:35 pm Reply with quote
Chrono1000 wrote:
Granted western companies getting into the anime production market will result in changes in the overall market since I am sure that Netflix does have rules about the type of content that is allowed in the shows that they finance.


Not all western companies are Saban/4kids. The reason why people are going to Netflix because it bypassing the content restrictions of the networks and offered more creative freedom. With Devilman, the TV networks in Japan has stricter restrictions than Netflix.

Quote:
“I love the creative freedom that’s available there,” Rhimes said. “There’s no restrictions. There’s no broadcast standards and practices. There’s no. ‘It has to be this long’ — I can make something that’s an hour and a half long, I can make something that’s 15 minutes long. There’s no, ‘We want to see more of this because that’s what you’ve done before.’”

https://www.recode.net/2017/10/9/16444674/shonda-rhimes-netflix-abc-shondaland-scandal-kara-swisher-recode-decode-podcast

Quote:
“With broadcast, when you’re going into people’s homes, you have to be a little more polite,” Fey told Reuters. On the streaming service Netflix, however, “you can get into more dangerous topics.”

In two years, Netflix Inc and online streaming platform Amazon Studios have drawn top names across film and television, enticing them with creative liberty, freedom from time constraints and no fears of offending advertisers.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-awards-emmys-streaming/nazis-cults-creative-freedom-draws-hollywood-to-netflix-amazon-tv-idUSKCN0RF1ZX20150915

Quote:
“The traditional studios were a bit skeptical or a bit overly conscious about the radicalness of the script, and they weren’t on board,” he said. “From the get-go, it was guaranteed creative freedom [with Netflix]. They weren’t meddling with any part of the filmmaking whatsoever.”

http://www.indiewire.com/2017/05/okja-snowpiercer-bong-joon-ho-netflix-1201829695/

relyat08 wrote:
Really gotta wonder what possible reasons they could have to ban Slow Start. I've been watching it weekly and can't think of anything remotely offensive even to the most ridiculous people.


Some people are speculating that it could be yuri undertones. Another person said it was removed due to it being child pornography.This should be what the lolicon defense task force should be worried about.
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Shadowrun20XX



Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 1935
Location: Vegas
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 4:00 pm Reply with quote
Yes its more shovelware anime for the majority to forget about but I'm tired of the loud ones rambling on about Cowboy bebop and other ancient anime that is irrelevant in 2018.

Let them press forward to see what they can achieve. People should be excited that this avenue is different from the otaku bait nonsense, the very definition of insanity.

Although Neo Yokio is not my idea of the future, there were 30 shows the netflix commissioned, something out of that has got to be good.

Devilman Crybaby was excellent addition to the ongoing remakes and hopefully brought forth new fans. Its something different with a touch of old. If you were upset with it, the depressing part has been around for a long time. Crybaby got you up to speed with WTF Anime!

I'm happy to see more in the style from the group behind mindgame. More collaborations are welcome.
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BadNewsBlues



Joined: 21 Sep 2014
Posts: 5987
PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 10:17 pm Reply with quote
0nsen wrote:


I'm afraid due to Netflix' shift away from what makes anime uniquely Japanese we will lose an entire generation of non-Japanese fans to those anime Netflix funds. It will be like talking to people that claim to like anime and then say they really like Naruto or some such thing.


So when people in the 90's/00's said they liked DragonBall Z, Pokemon, Gundam Wing (or G), Digimon, Voltron, Big O, Speed Racer, Sailor Moon, Cowboy Bebop, or Lupin 3rd etc,

Those people would not either be anime fans or become fans by watching any of those shows?

This is such a bad bad take.
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Cardcaptor Takato



Joined: 27 Jan 2018
Posts: 4881
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:13 am Reply with quote
Nacirema wrote:
[
Not all western companies are Saban/4kids. The reason why people are going to Netflix because it bypassing the content restrictions of the networks and offered more creative freedom. With Devilman, the TV networks in Japan has stricter restrictions than Netflix.
It's not like Production IG, Wit, and Bones are especially known for making lots of lolicon anime to begin with. The majority of the tittles they make are already mainstream Bebop-esque action type of shows that would be popular and successful with or without Netflix.


Quote:
Some people are speculating that it could be yuri undertones. Another person said it was removed due to it being child pornography.This should be what the lolicon defense task force should be worried about.
I wonder if it's less because of the actual content of the shows themselves and more because of historical relationship issues between Japan and China and the content reasons are just an excuse.
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TheAnimeRevolutionizer



Joined: 03 Nov 2017
Posts: 329
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 2:22 am Reply with quote
0nsen wrote:
I'm afraid due to Netflix' shift away from what makes anime uniquely Japanese we will lose an entire generation of non-Japanese fans to those anime Netflix funds. It will be like talking to people that claim to like anime and then say they really like Naruto or some such thing. You immediately know they are not really into anime and worse, you know they have no opportunity to really get into anime anymore.

It would be unreasonable to lay the blame on Netflix for this, but in the past 10 years, there has been pressure to remove the far end of the spectrum even from Japanese shows.


Japanese anime will always will be Japanese. Japan's trends are their trends, and to those whom don't like what Japan has to offer in anime, I only have one thing to say: tough $#*%. Even then, America's issues with anime is strictly their problem. If the anime market in the States went kaput, the world would only be able to look on and move ahead. Japan on the other hand would be at little loss. And that's a major issue right there.

As my brain works this time of day, I admit, I don't like Netflix doing this for the reason that could mean "losing Japanese-ness", but my issue spans on both sides of the world.

Where the hell is the overseas anime and manga industry? That's the major question I'll bring out because there is absolutely no excuse for there not being a workforce of anime and manga content creators in the states. Over here, sushi, karaoke, and Karate for examples have grown into an overseas market and shown how it can adapt into other tastes and needs. For a more direct approach, Power Rangers shows how it can work in an overseas market and still have its core content. If they can adapt and expand into another cross cultural spectrum that goes beyond borders, then anime and manga sure as the heavens and paradise has no excuse. Again, everyone's a critic, but I hold this still strong that beggars and whiners can't be choosers. Then again, a societal infrastructure that makes everyone think a certain way and kills critical thought, tolerance, crearivity, and imagination is another issue in itself.

On the other hand, while Netflix is entering the ring of anime production, I don't believe this is a permanent solution to catering to the needs of western fans of anime. What I've said before is a looming question and situation that I've seen that day by day, is a nearing crossroads and it will come to the forefront sooner or later. Most importantly, Japan isn't going to hold your hand or play hero on this. This is an affair that only we - ie people- will be able to affect.

Just a thought.

DamianSalazar wrote:
Hope I didn't put too many emoticons there, but seriously you're afraid of Netflix not following the crowd by producing moe/isekai/incest/imouto series that would turn off a Westerner who has never understood/watched anime.


I hope you have a solution other than begging for Japan at their feet to create what you want to see.
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CR85747



Joined: 13 Oct 2014
Posts: 114
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 4:41 am Reply with quote
TheAnimeRevolutionizer wrote:


Where the hell is the overseas anime and manga industry? That's the major question I'll bring out because there is absolutely no excuse for there not being a workforce of anime and manga content creators in the states. Over here, sushi, karaoke, and Karate for examples have grown into an overseas market and shown how it can adapt into other tastes and needs. For a more direct approach, Power Rangers shows how it can work in an overseas market and still have its core content. If they can adapt and expand into another cross cultural spectrum that goes beyond borders, then anime and manga sure as the heavens and paradise has no excuse. Again, everyone's a critic, but I hold this still strong that beggars and whiners can't be choosers. Then again, a societal infrastructure that makes everyone think a certain way and kills critical thought, tolerance, crearivity, and imagination is another issue in itself.

On the other hand, while Netflix is entering the ring of anime production, I don't believe this is a permanent solution to catering to the needs of western fans of anime. What I've said before is a looming question and situation that I've seen that day by day, is a nearing crossroads and it will come to the forefront sooner or later. Most importantly, Japan isn't going to hold your hand or play hero on this. This is an affair that only we - ie people- will be able to affect.



I would say that the "overseas anime" are being made at Cartoon Network. As for the manga, did you notice that Yen Press is launching a YA imprint based on the success of Svetlana Chmakova's grade-school OEM dyad?
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TheAnimeRevolutionizer



Joined: 03 Nov 2017
Posts: 329
PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 5:54 pm Reply with quote
CR85747 wrote:
I would say that the "overseas anime" are being made at Cartoon Network. As for the manga, did you notice that Yen Press is launching a YA imprint based on the success of Svetlana Chmakova's grade-school OEM dyad?


Not big enough. Not potent enough. Has the spirit of what anime had and presented itself when it came into the mainstream years ago but holds itself back or isn't tapping into its potential further enough.

Overseas, there are animators and artists who have come from all over the globe to Japan and have even started their own animation studios at this point in time. That's saying something.

When it comes to stories of OEL creators, they lack the idealism and even the daring will to change the world, the kinds of themes and elements that anime has presented. They lack the drive to dare to stand in the face of life's harshness, oppression and prominent issues and present that in their own way. This even goes for facing one's own nation's issues at large, throwing all fears to the wind and going into the fray against all odds.

Another thing, we aren't talking about western animation. That will always be around. What I'm talking about is pure bona fide anime created with the same spirit, regardless of technique and method, and taken full force with sincerity.

Go the distance.
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belvadeer





PostPosted: Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:08 pm Reply with quote
0nsen wrote:
People saying Devilman has no censorship because there is gore and nudity do not understand the Japanese aspect of anime. There's plenty of American movies with nudity and violence. That's not the part I'm afraid we will lose to Netflix.

I'm afraid due to Netflix' shift away from what makes anime uniquely Japanese we will lose an entire generation of non-Japanese fans to those anime Netflix funds. It will be like talking to people that claim to like anime and then say they really like Naruto or some such thing. You immediately know they are not really into anime and worse, you know they have no opportunity to really get into anime anymore.

It would be unreasonable to lay the blame on Netflix for this, but in the past 10 years, there has been pressure to remove the far end of the spectrum even from Japanese shows. There was a real crack down through legislation that affects anime and manga and I'm afraid this will only get worse with Netflix throwing their weight around. We've already lost the lolicon anime like Kodomo no Jikan and we stand to lose even more.


No offense, but your post comes across as dreadfully paranoid and quite an overreaction to this article.
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