Forum - View topicViz Media Comments on Digital Piracy After Manga Uploader Arrests
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Touma
Posts: 2651 Location: Colorado, USA |
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@Lili-Hime
I have no idea what you are trying to say with that animated GIF. I do not know who that person is or what he is doing. |
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Alan45
Village Elder
Posts: 9875 Location: Virginia |
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@Touma
Not that it matters, but the character in the gif is Seinfeld from the show of the same name. I didn't watch that show, but his gesture is fairly clear. My interpretation is "that's enough, I'm out of here" or words to the same effect. I think Lili-Hime decided there was no point in responding to mar24364E8 any further. |
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Crisha
Moderator
Posts: 4290 |
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@Touma - She's backing out of an argument that clearly is not worth having.
@mar24364E8 & @dark13 Buddy, why'd you go make a second account when your first isn't even banned? Trying to find a short cut around moderation? I'm mod-erately amused. |
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CrowLia
Posts: 5505 Location: Mexico |
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To be fair, and while I think most of dark13's argument is absolutely ludicrous, I find it equally ridiculous to tell someone "Stop watching illegal rips of legal streams on illegal sites, use this illegal method to watch the legal sites instead" :/
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GrayArchon
Posts: 393 |
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No, it will not. You seem to be under the impression that the various publishers are helpless to do anything to the various sites directly, and if the TPP would just criminalize what they're doing, sites like Mangapanda would just vanish with a poof. That's not how it works. Viz, Shueisha, and all the other various anime/manga companies have always had the option to go after such sites with lawsuits. One of the first aggregator sites closed it's doors due legal threats. Others made some series unavailable in the parts of the world that Viz operates in an attempt to reduce the legal threats. The only reason the publishers haven't gone after such sites more is that it simply isn't worth the time and effort. The TPP won't make the time and effort go away, it'll just increase the amount they can do to those they do decide to go after, while expanding definitions to let them crack down on a lot of harmless stuff fans do.
I wouldn't recommend taking the Bell Media CEO's word on the subject as gospel. He's more or less the opposite of an unbiased commentator on the subject. VPNs aren't illegal. They're routinely used by business for connecting different sites as though they were on the same network, or letting people work from home as though they were on their work network. VPN services which are what is being suggested aren't illegal either. They're commonly used by more privacy minded people who don't want every site they visit to know their real IP address and the approximate physical location that comes with it. Naturally this makes them useful to people who which to get around geo-blocking. Which is where it finally gets into a gray area. Here's a bit more a balanced article on the subject. |
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CrowLia
Posts: 5505 Location: Mexico |
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^The use of VPN may not be illegal, but streaming sites certainly do not allow their use and will ban your account if they catch you using one, so same difference *shrug*
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Hyperdrve
Posts: 276 |
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The agreement hasn't even been ratified and already you act like you know how it will or won't be used. If the TPP gets ratified, what's to stop a small publishing company in Japan from suing any illegitimate website within TPP jurisdiction that infringes on their copyrights? The TPP is supposed to help stimulate small and medium businesses to enforce their IPs and make it easier for them. Also what makes you think that with the TPP, Shueisha wouldn't pursue sites like mangapanda? At one point mangapanda might have indirectly helped Shueisha's sales but since 2013, Shonen Jump is online-only in the US, therefore mangapanda is a direct competitor. I'm under the impression that you have to be reasonably quick when making copyright related lawsuits. So if Viz could've taken mangapanda to court back in 2013 then mangapanda in its defense could've made the case that Viz took too long to enforce its copyrights. And frankly, I'm not sure if this hypothetical argument would be able to save mangapanda from the TPP. So on the same topic, below are some excerpts from the TPP with the parts I find relevant bolded.
Also I was convinced by Donald Trump's rhetoric that the Japanese were trying to take advantage of the US through the TPP but after looking a bit more into it, I'm not as convinced. EDIT: Corrections and change of tone. Last edited by Hyperdrve on Thu Nov 26, 2015 6:18 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Lili-Hime
Posts: 569 |
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Lol I was just laughing like crazy because this guy's logic is basically: "Everyone can piss off! I'll watch free streaming because hey I can and paying my internet bill entitles to me to all free entertainment. But I'm not going to VPN to legal sites; that's where I cross the line I mean guy's gotta have morals somewhere right?" lmao
It's literally like someone defending downloading jpop & anime soundtracks but when someone suggests they buy Japanese itunes cards and get cheap downloads they THEN get on the moral high horse because you'd hae to make a japanese itunes acct with a fake address. IDK if VPNS are legal, I mean hey at least Hulu/Netflix are getting their money right? Idk if someone wants to cuff me for watching BBC shows using Hola I guess I better prepare myself for lady prison. Can't be that bad I've seen Orange is the New Black.
Ok nevermind, this is now the funniest thing in the thread (the first part about believing anything Trump says) |
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Hyperdrve
Posts: 276 |
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Donald Trump was perfect until he went full crazy. I'm hypothesizing that he might be suffering from Alzheimer's. IMO, he's the strongest on foreign policy. Hopefully he swings the Trump train back on track. |
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Blanchimont
Posts: 3461 Location: Finland |
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First, Hyperdrve, you're delusional.
Just because TPP exists doesn't mean sites like Mangapanda are going to disappear. It might go down, but there will always be others, and others will appear. It's not like piracy and bootlegs have been illegal before. Besides the provisions you mention are mainly aimed at commercial scales... For example, just because RHS went down, doesn't mean the exact same series weren't picked by another almost immediately. I'm myself following the latest Hayate and Nisekoi chapters. As long as restrictions hamper global availability of legal services, even TPP will have only a marginal effect when it comes to piracy. Second, Lili-Hime, it's not reasonable to expect someone to go through such loops as VPNs just to use legal services, especially if such methods are banned by those services. Sane people just use 'other' methods... |
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar Posts: 16941 |
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Alright folks too many of you are taking some shots at each other so that needs to stop. Either disagree without insults towards each other or move on please. Thank you.
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CrowLia
Posts: 5505 Location: Mexico |
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I'm 50% a shameless pirate and 50% "pirate because of unavailability". For instance, of the 13 shows I'm watching this season, only 3 are available in CR and 2 in Daisuki, the rest are in Funimation, which is not available in my region, (plus the Lupin III that's not being streamed at all). My gripe with Funi is particularly bad because they get exclusive streaming rights for the entire American continent but their stuff is region-blocked for Latin America. So they aren't just region-blocking their stuff, they also deprive me of any chance to get it legally, since Funi getting the license means CR won't have it for my region. If you go to Latam CR you'll see people praying that Funi doesn't get many licenses because they screw us when they do it. Even some Daisuki shows like Concrete Revolution are delaycast in Latam because Funi has the exclusive simulcast rights. So why should I go out of my way to give them my money and support the company (and using a method that they explicitly prohibit) when they are intentionally keeping the stuff I want locked away from me? They've been promising to expand into the Latam market for two years at least and I'm still waiting. The bottomline is I find it absurd to tell someone to stop pirating for free and instead use a method that costs money and yet is frowned upon/explicitly forbidden by the companies that would receive your money if they, you know, didn't region lock their stuff. |
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Hyperdrve
Posts: 276 |
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Here's an expansion on what commercial scale refers to: In respect of wilful copyright or related rights piracy, “on a commercial scale” includes at least: (a) acts carried out for commercial advantage or financial gain; and (b) significant acts, not carried out for commercial advantage or financial gain, that have a substantial prejudicial impact on the interests of the copyright or related rights holder in relation to the marketplace. So in other words, commercial scale covers almost anything you can think of.
I disagree. At least history shows that piracy can be controlled and that's enough for me. |
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Lili-Hime
Posts: 569 |
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Ok everyone I was never suggesting VPNs were more moral or anything than just straight up pirating I don't really wanna get into moral arguments because people gonna rage. I was just saying its an option I found myself useful for watching certain stuff like BBC that locks me out because I'm a filthy American. It's worked out better for me than torrenting or using questionable pirate stream sites though as far as keeping my darling computer nice and virus / adware free so I was just giving a suggestion for something that might work better.
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yaki-udon
Posts: 83 |
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I had no idea who Donald Trump was, so I just looked him up. There is something about his smile and hair that creeps me out. It looks like he is a candidate for president of the United States. I wonder if he likes Japan.
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