Forum - View topicNEWS: 2 Aki Sora Manga Books to No Longer Be Printed After July
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configspace
Posts: 3717 |
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Well, not yet unless it includes virtual / drawn stuff. I doubt that would happen. That was already attempted a couple years ago with pressure from agnes chan/unicef, etc and it didn't work out.
Unlike our system which is purely advisory, this is an actual legal ban that would prohibit access at all for those under 18 in Tokyo. Retailers and publishers are punished for doing otherwise. It's why young adults (teens in high school) are also upset:
However the bill doesn't cover doujins, digital goods or online retailers though. I also wonder how would they handle it if the authors themselves were under 18?
No, that's actually wrong. I also live in the US and am very familiar with laws concerning free speech. Movie theaters enforce their own rules, but like the examples I gave anyone can legally access those works on their own (how would you even be able to decide with Unrated works if that were the case? And why would no retailer have checks or restrictions whatsoever?). Case in point: Oregon attempted to do exactly what this kind of bill does (though with much harsher punishment) and that got rejected by federal courts: animenewsnetwork.com/news/2010-09-21/oregon-laws-to-limit-adult-content-from-minors-rejected
Yes it would get an MA rating, and guess what? That would in NO WAY restrict audience. The ratings are not legally enforceable
Anyone can legally buy and watch any anime for mature audiences. Hetalia is rated TV-MA. Nana is rated TV-MA. Where's Amazon ID check for these? In fact these are labeled "unrated" by Amazon since they use only official MPAA ratings, and all ratings are self-ratings anyways. For example, Funimation rates Ikkitousen as TV-MA. But Media Blasters rates Ikkitousen Dragon Destiny (which is more raunchy esp with the OVAs) age 16+, likewise for Kanokon, Queen's Blade. They reserve "18+" only for their hentai titles which makes much more rational sense.
err... I really don't think you believe in free speech. Truly free speech (which we still do not fully have here) protects all speech, including unpopular and "immoral" speech as well. That's why a federal judge overturned a guilty conviction decided by a jury against a neo-Nazi: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2011/04/online-speech-protected/ for example
Sadly even OYAPS (the Tokyo board responsible) has now warned the industry about adaptations of the 1000+ year old classic... which, also happens to be written by a woman 
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leoval
Posts: 11 |
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Well so much discussion just to agree with my basic premise that Aki-Sora deserved an Adult rating. I never mentioned anything about the legal implications of the rating, I only discussed the nature of the content. |
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enurtsol
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What are the legal implications again? |
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zaeris
Posts: 102 |
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Well I can somewhat agree to some of your points and accept your opinion as they are, however the part bold seems to be a bit extreme since this is still a fictional story. I can agree with a label because the core audience won't change but we shouldn't condemn fictional work because it could be/is controversial. Koi Kaze is a good manga/ anime adaptation, although fiction it was done well and praise by many. Having a label and warning and letting people choose knowing what is tag under such series would be ideal. You can also choose not to read them knowing the content. Banning would still be going to far in opinion however there maybe one of two circumstance where a fictional story would be harmful... but that would be debatable. |
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jtstellar
Posts: 94 |
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the point is EVERYONE has a slightly different opinion on what is appropriate and add up these minor differences over the years in legislative work and YOU WILL GET A LOT so it's either a principle stance of freedom of speech once and for all or no freedom of speech OVER A LONG COURSE OF TIME chipped away bit by bit.. NEITHER SITUATION IS PERFECT but you must choose which is worse and OVER A LONG PERIOD OF TIME it will always end up in one extreme.. there is no middle ground. government is always busy on the most current event and they seldom have the time or will to go back and visit or repeal old rules even if they are obsolete so things just get piled on until something goes horribly wrong.. which is a LONG time.. ever wonder why there is so much waste in government for so long? forget it, what you idiots don't get, you just never will.
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BassKuroi
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First of all: I think Aki Sora is a really, awfully, bad manga.
Second: Is this mangaka crazy or just under the influence of very hard drugs? What "she did not intend for them to be adults-only and that this manga would have been a completely different work creatively had she drawn it for an adults-only audience" does mean? Is about incest, for FSM's sake! I mean, What the hell? |
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egoist
 Posts: 7762 |
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It meant we'd have penis, vagina, and far more sex. If I recall correctly, Aki Sora only involves the more basic intercourse actions. That's softcore hentai, and it's fairly light compared to most Japanese hentai. You really know nothing about hentai if you think Aki Sora is disgusting. Rather, that's just your bloody religious view, and it disgusts me as much as this fictional work disgusts you. If you think incest should be rated adult only for being incest, then you're some dense hypocrite. Are you a bunch of ignorant blind kids or something? Or something like foreigners applying your bs to another country's culture? Keep the arguments coming. I've yet to hear anything besides a "I'm disgusted by fictional incest because I can't discern between reality and fiction lol rofl I'm dumb". |
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Nayu
Posts: 676 |
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egoist keeps thinking that hentai in Japan is uncensored/unmosaiced.
Its almost funny if it wasn't so sad. |
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ayashe
 Posts: 122 |
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Nayu seems to believe they can read peoples minds. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad (and a little worrying...
 ). Nowhere does egoist say or imply in that post that hentai in Japan is uncensored. Anyone who's seen a Japanese AV of any kind knows that it's censored. And why is it censored? Because of the backwards, conservative, censorship loving society and government. Which is why this is even happening.
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Moomintroll
 Posts: 1600 Location: Nottingham (UK) |
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Right, because softcore porn is never rated 18 in your country (which also happens to be my country)? Oh, wait: it is. If the same content were released in the UK on DVD or as software, you know full well it would get an 18 certificate (and unlike the US, that 18 certificate would be legally binding rather than recommendatory). When was the last time you saw a porn movie being sold with a 12 certificate on the basis that it wasn't as explicit as some other porn? Answer: you never have.
Oh, no, plenty of atheists are equally disgusted by much of what passes as entertainment in Japan. Trust me - I've not read this particular literary gem but I'm regularly revolted by Japan's cultural detritus without any input from Jehovah, Allah or the Great Spaghetti Monster.
Actually, this is the Japanese applying age limits to their own media. Surely *you're* the foreigner wanting to overturn the democratic decisions of the Japanese majority? Or maybe you thought that this law was imposed on Japan by the readers of the ANN website?
Okay, how's this: Banning fictional content you don't like is wrong but placing statutory age restrictions on media is not the same as censoring it and is something that happens in almost every country in the developed world - including your country. It's hardly the death knell for liberty, given that the Japanese people (most of whom either support the ratings or couldn't give a crap one way or the other) are perfectly free to elect politicians who advocate overturning the legislation should they wish to do so in the future. We call this "democracy". Furthermore, since most of this board's lonely, teenage, compulsive onanists steal their Japanese porn (whether soft or hard, suggestive or explicit, 2D or 3D) from the internet rather than sweatily trying to convince a Tokyo store clerk in a 7-Eleven that they're 18 in a nervous, breaking voice, they aren't going to be noticing any difference anyway. |
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Daemonblue
 Posts: 701 |
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Except it is censorship when it's being restricted only because of one small part of the plot and not the rest of the content, and it's only applied to a very limited amount of media instead of all media. If you read the article, it's not being republished because of the incestuous themes, not for all the other reasons people are bringing up. To put this in perspective, one could say that even the Bible promotes incest with the whole Adam and Eve and the proliferation of humans, and let's not forget stuff like the Tale of Genji, or Oedipus Rex. A lot of works that have been in novel form for as long as people can remember would not be able to get animated or a manga because this would effectively ban them. Something doesn't have to be completely banned for it to not be worth producing, all you have to do is limit the audiences that have access to it. All this bill does is force the morals of the few onto the many, whether they realize it or not. There's a reason why the Comic Book Code ended up failing in America, and this looks like it would do nothing better than kill the manga industry in the long term. |
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egoist
Posts: 7762 |
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You most likely didn't understand my point because you haven't read my previous posts. In the UK, tentacle rape and most hentai would be banned under the law. In Japan it's not, which means their law is lighter [in this regard] and that by their definition Aki Sora is softcore hentai, mostly known as ecchi.
Yet they watch it, which makes me wonder just how hypocrite they can get. And as others have said, sex without genitals is present in plenty of under 18 movies. In other words, this is being censored for the simple fact of having fictional siblings.
I'm not replying to a Japanese. And I never said I'm opposed to this bill. Are you blind? Although that doesn't change the fact that this is the beginning of this.
And here we go with the political crap. See, while I definitely agree that democracy is probably the best system humanity has to offer, that doesn't mean every political system, including democracy itself, isn't absolutely shit. |
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enurtsol
Posts: 14773 |
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You're kinda stretching the usual meaning of censorship there. Otherwise, a lot of things would be considered censored because a lot of things are restricted to different age groups, not just adult material. Furthermore, which film was it where the producers didn't want the PG-13 rating they got, so they appended the f-word at the end of the film just to get the R rating they wanted? The ratings system works in mysterous ways.
Also, we don't know who made that decision not to re-publish. Masahiro Itosugi did not elaborate on who decided the matter. It could be self-censorship by the publisher, but that's different from government censorship. Heck, many TV networks self-censor themselves, mainly for business reasons.
If the majority of Tokyo-ites are against it, then rest assured it will be voted out in the next election. If the majority don't say nothing, then they'll elect the government that they deserve. But if the majority isn't against it, then SOL.
As Winston Churchill put it: "Many forms of Government have been tried and will be tried in this world of sin and woe. No one pretends that democracy is perfect or all-wise. Indeed, it has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all those other forms that have been tried from time to time."
Last edited by enurtsol on Mon Apr 25, 2011 1:46 am; edited 3 times in total |
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Starsplash Taiwan
Posts: 134 Location: Taipei Taiwan |
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Here are my thoughts:
1. I never seen or read Aki Sora, but I know enough about it to say its not porn. 2. I always laugh when I hear people say that this isn't a ban and that it wont do anything. 3. @MrhatandClogs. Aki Sora is not a glorification of insest in anyway. Incest is just a theme. [We can do without the insult, thanks. - Keonyn] 4. This ban wouldn't exists if parents were competent and not so retarded as a whole about this issue. Its ur job to teach ur kid about what is right and what is wrong. If you need the governement to step in, you failed as a parent. Why does everything have to change because you can't control ur own damn kid. The only people that are affected are the ones that are legally allowed to view these matarials and its just not fair that the legal side has to suffer because some turd parent couldn't control his kid. FYI, if he really is looking at that stuff, I think he is ready for that sex talk. |
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enurtsol
Posts: 14773 |
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Well, this part can be subjective where it lacks clearly defined parameters. As the US Supreme Court put it: "I know it when I see it." But you should really check it out and decide for yourself before definitively saying what it is or isn't.
Oh, it would definitely do something - that's never been in contention. In fact, that's the whole point of it. Yet, it's still not a ban.
You should really read it first. Then you could say that. It's only fair.
Japanese society is notorious in depending a lot on the state, in the interest of keeping the "wa" harmony. They would follow rules to the "T" because the authorities said so. That's why government bureaucrats are looked up with such high regard over there.
No, legally adults are allowed to view these materials, and adults are not affected. Legality is defined by the rules. The Japanese like to follow rules. |
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