Forum - View topicHey, Answerman! - The Legend(s) Reborn
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agila61
 Posts: 3213 Location: NE Ohio |
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Ergo Proxy, while certainly standing within that list, does not stand head and shoulders above it. And, yes, 'NOYT-an-i-ma' is far from hard to pronounce ~ it is indeed quite clever that you can turn animation around and get an actually pronounceable word. |
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Anymouse
 Posts: 685 |
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agila61
Posts: 3213 Location: NE Ohio |
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Yowza, talk about "old schooling" one-upmanship. 
But for that more recent wave of television anime, which got started in the 1960's, the Lost Decade of the 90's were a boom time for anime in Japan, so now that the US and much of Europe have elected to enter our own Lost Decade, its time to work out how we can get a Lost Decade anime boom going over here. |
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marklungo
 Posts: 80 Location: Berea, Ohio |
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This article pushed a lot of my buttons, so I had to respond.
1. When it comes to webcomics being adapted into anime: I'd love to see an animated version of Phil and Kaja Foglio's wonderful Girl Genius. If it were a manga, it would have had 200 episodes by now. In fact, it even has enough superficial similarities to Fullmetal Alchemist (1890s/1900s setting + characters with special abilities) that I'm surprised someone hasn't tried. 2. I agree with Brian about the brilliance of Wings of Honneamise, both the story and the alt-world art direction. (I want one of those yellow and black telephones!) As for Shenl742's objection: I wouldn't have included the rape scene--they could have given the people involved character development with a less drastic method--but it wasn't enough to ruin the movie for me. 3. On unfinished projects: Does something that was canceled before the animation began count? If so, let me nominate Blue Uru, the never-completed semi-sequel to... Wings of Honneamise. Gainax posted some excellent pre-production artwork, and that was pretty much it. I'd love to see them revisit the world of Honneamise somehow, someday. |
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enurtsol
 Posts: 14772 |
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Nah, they'd moe-ize her 'cause she's fugly. 
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Shale
Posts: 337 Location: The Middle of Nowhere, DE |
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On the other hand, can you imagine a filler-ized version of the Castle Heterodyne arc? They'd be there for decades!
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Echo_City
Posts: 1236 |
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Believe it or not, I try to keep an open mind to find new shows, which has spared me from the fate of those who rail against all post Y2k anime. Shoot, I despise Ghost in the Shell, yet I deigned to watch Ergo Proxy. That should corroborate my claim
On your list I see a beaucoup of shows which take the same tired old ideas and hash them together in a backwards manner (apropos), and proclaim them as high art, and "original" to boot ....okay, I'm just having some fun with that as it wouldn't be fair to state that as I haven't seen all of those shows. Who knows, maybe I'll find that one of them will be the next Solty Rei, a show that started off crappily but became a modern classic by the end.
Though I can rule out C-Control from that potential transcendence, at least not without a miraculous change in its progression, as it literally is patterned akin to my tongue-in-cheek statement above. They took the basic shounen formula, tried to make it more "profound" & new by immersing it in a completely illogical setting dealing with nonsensical economics (So much so that I've seen links on ANN referring one to where he can learn "the rules" of the economics district, which IMO represents a failing of the show.). To make the show more "adult" and "contemporary", or whatever buzzword you use for "pandering to the zeitgeist", they decided to showcase the "evil" of money and how from money stems all power....a concept that was already done, better done, in Speed Grapher. I've heard that there's no such thing as a truly original story, but that only holds true so far. That saying does not exempt C's thus-far poor attempt of "originality" consisting of trying to sew together simplified scraps of Yugioh and Speed Grapher. Eden of the East has similar problems. Besides sacrificing the integrity of the show to ram home its blatant allegory about society, its principle plot device is a heinous deus ex machina; even the characters in the show refer to it as a "magic cellphone". As for what shows are in the block, mea culpa. My knowledge of the intricacies of the Japanese TV schedule is abysmal; I don't have the patience for such trivia. That said, I did ask if the shows I mentioned were in that block, as I knew the limits of my show knowledge. Regardless, I've seen shows in the Noitamina block, and I'm sticking to my guns on my opinion of the block. |
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Shenl742
Posts: 1524 |
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Well then I guess you and me have extremely differant standards Echo and we should just leave it at that.
For the record, I did like Ergo Proxy as well. |
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agila61
Posts: 3213 Location: NE Ohio |
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the question is execution ~ for instance, GitS:SAC does not invent Cyberpunk, but is the best execution of cyberpunk in anime since the genre was invented, and someone who enjoys cyberpunk will love it. |
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Echo_City
Posts: 1236 |
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Your assessment of GITS:SAC is ridiculously subjective, and begs the question. It's also incorrect, as your generalization does not apply to me. I enjoy Cyberpunk, but I loathed GITS:SAC. About half of the episodes weren't even relevant to the plot, but thankfully they had their title screens color-coded so you could skip them if you wanted to. Except for occasional one-liners referencing the filler eps, the "plot" eps were completely independent of the filler or "Stand Alone" eps. I guess the show had to be composed of filler, which allegedly bolstered character development, as the plot (such as it was) is paper thin. I suffered through 26 episodes only for the final revelation to ultimately be about how "corporations are evil". Now I've read a fair bit of science fiction, mostly classic scifi (big 3), and I've yet to see how what you posted with the spoiler tags is a scifi stereotype. Regardless, the point is rather moot as it isn't the central focus of Ergo Proxy. All of the characters know, or at least suspect, the relationship between man and monster. Thanks to dramatic irony, so does the viewer. Ergo Proxy could have followed the tried-and-true route with dramatic irony, where the whole show centers around finding out who the monster is, while the viewer finds the irony in the actions of the characters as he already knows. That's the cheap suspense tactic that so many shows fall back on (Fox's 24 was practically made of it), and why I'm leery of dramatic irony. However, Ergo Proxy did something original with this in that they told the viewers the identity of the monster not so they could delight in watching the cast bumble about chasing dead ends to solve that mystery on their own, but so the viewers' thoughts on the show could advance beyond that trite point of "who" and start to ponder the more important "why", starting with "why is there a monster?". The show drops clues about the answer to these "why" questions, and by allowing the viewer to focus on them, allows a coherent story to be told without the classic 5+ minutes of exposition that is necessary to explain the convoluted machinations of the plot which has become an anime cliche. (eg: Gasaraki, Chrono Crusade, Naruto) Having the viewer have to think while watching, what a novel concept! 
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gwern
 Posts: 67 |
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So I guess you liked Honneamise, eh, Hanson?
But seriously, that's one of the better descriptions/defenses of WoH I've seen. I've taken the liberty of excerpting part for the Wikipedia article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Space_Force:_The_Wings_of_Honnêamise#Reception Hope you don't mind such a long quote. |
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oishi_47
 Posts: 35 |
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I'd just like to congratulate you on getting on SOS and say; F*ck Casablanca, I have Grown Ups. That is all. |
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agila61
Posts: 3213 Location: NE Ohio |
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While the Stand Alone episodes were not advancing the main plot arc in the way that the Complex episodes were, they were of course advancing character development and character interaction and resulted in deeper world building than would have occurred with all Complex episodes. |
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