Forum - View topicEP. REVIEW: Kiznaiver
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killjoy_the
 Posts: 2460 |
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If they actually meant to get the "it wouldn't be a story about dumb teenagers if it wasn't annoying" tone down, props, because goddamn this episode was annoying.
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sinfonia
 Posts: 23 |
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I really liked this episode. Not gonna lie; I teared up a little at the end. ( Though, honestly I could have done without Katsuhira's awkward wail. ???? But that's my opinion. ) This episode made Nico my favorite character of the bunch so far--poor girl just wants to be friends, man.
While before, Nori-chan's attitude was kind of annoying me because she was being so secretive and stoic, now that we know why she is like that, I am liking her character more. I feel bad for what she's had to endure...though, the whole "oops I fainted before I jumped to my death" thing was a cop-out in my opinion. The writers wanted the drama of her attempting to jump, but they didn't want to deal with the logistics of it, so they had her faint. Cue slightly annoyed eye roll. But regardless! I'm indeed more accepting of Nori-chan now. Also, I like that they took the time to explain more about the Kizna system and what happens when it backfires, and what happened to the previous kids. |
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FilthyCasual
Posts: 2204 |
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Man, Sonozaki's and Kacchon's situations are heart-wrenching. That wail of his at the end made my eyes water, and that cute smiling little girl being driven to attempted suicide... oof.
I wonder if the experiments can be related to adults not taking proper consideration and care of their children's feelings, and thus stunting/hurting them, or if it's all just science after all. |
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Gina Szanboti
Posts: 11378 |
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Episode 10
I don't know if you're just not explaining yourself very well, or if you're really this emotionally dead inside, but between your reviews of this and Lost Village, I'm starting to think you missing an empathy circuit or something.  It's like if there's any fantastical component to a character's tragedy it bounces off your intellectual armor and you dismiss it as unrealistic.
The above quote is an extremely utilitarian way of looking at the story. Emotions aren't tangible things? Were you expecting otherwise? As far as relating to the characters' plights, I don't see "Because science did it," to be substantially different than, say, "Because her parents sold her off to be tortured by perverts" or "Because she was forced to watch all the other children in her orphanage die from a plague one by one," or some other "not-science" source of trauma. If the resulting outcome is the same, and it fits within the framework of the story, how does the root of it being impersonal or unintentional make it less relatable and distressing? I mean, sure, it'd be off-putting if it turned out that they lost their emotions because a herd of escaped circus elephants traumatized them or something equally ludicrous, but including "science" totally severs your emotional connection to them? (btw, "science" doesn't do anything. People did that to those children) Or are you saying you can't put yourself in the shoes of people who don't feel anything, so you can't generate any emotions of your own toward them? If so, I submit that your inability to empathize is not the series' fault.
It also seems really odd to fault a show for explaining its framework. What would you have had them do, leave us all wondering how it was supposed to work or what happened to all the kids, in favor of present day character development? I honestly don't understand what you wanted that would have satisfied you, aside from an exclusively human, non-sciencey source of suffering. It sounds like the very existence of the Kiznaiver system was a deal-breaker for you from the get-go, since aside from the actual scars it's not a real, tangible thing. I really liked this episode, and that raw, strangled wail at the end sold the whole thing. The scream itself was like some tiny animal clawing its way out of him trying to get free. Kudos, Yuuki Kaji. |
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#Immie93
Posts: 54 |
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I agree with this because although this show is based on character relationships and emotions why trade out explanation of the whole system? If the explanation of the Kizna system hadn't happened I would have got to the end of the series asking the question of what happened to the other children in the previous experiment? And this explanation really helped me to understand why Katsuhira is so emotionally discharged. He's practically the main character in the show so we need some explanation of his past or else how can we be emotionally invested in his character? It's the same as getting to know a new friend, in order to bond with them, you share past experiences so your relationship and connection to their emotions is stronger. |
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vonPeterhof
Posts: 729 |
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AksaraKishou
Posts: 1411 Location: End of the World |
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I imagine that the kizna system was still experimental at the time and sonozaki's scar(?) might have some property that acted as a beacon for all other scars.
Not every human is the same, so him and the others that were released might have had a bit more emotional fortitude as children than the brain dead ones. |
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vonPeterhof
Posts: 729 |
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@AksaraKishou Speculating about in-universe reasons for stuff happening in the show can be fun and all, but as long as the show itself hasn't demonstrated thematically relevant reasons for stuff happening a certain way all those speculative reasons end up sounding a bit like excuses to cover up the true reason, i.e. "because the plot needed it to happen that way". Of course, that isn't to suggest that there is One True Way for judging thematic relevance, or even that a show's themes and how it explores them should be the main metric for judging whether a show "works" or not (I personally have enjoyed countless shows while having their themes fly right over my head until I read up on them later). It's just that Kiznaiver always appeared to position itself as "a show with something to say", so it seems like fair game for some thematic scrutiny.
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GlassesMan
Posts: 217 |
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This was quite the incredible episode. I expected many of the ex-Kiznaivers to be falling apart, but Nico and Tenga especially display a lot of emotional maturity. I'm also in agreement with others that the exposition on the former experiment was actually a good thing. I'm glad they've saved it for later as the flashback has far more weight now, since we're so invested in the present and the characters now. Behind Re:zero, this is totally my favorite anime of the season. Reminds me a lot of Oregairu Zoku.
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Gan_HOPE326
Posts: 31 |
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Yeah, I think an explanation was due and this was as good as anything at this point. The Kizna experiment was always a plot device anyway, but that's how science fiction stories often work: implementing a miraculous exception, something different, and drawing the logical consequences from it. In this case the exception is the Kizna experiment and all that comes with it, meaning that Katsuhira and Sonozaki's unusual characters were part of it - plot drivers like the experiment itself. After all they are what they are not just because the experiment did it to them but because of how they shaped themselves, living with their condition, through the years after it. If we're talking about blue haired emotionless girls, it isn't like Rei Ayaname's legendary stoicism had far more realistic reasons.
Plus the final scene with the catatonic kids was great, so all is forgiven for me. |
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Gina Szanboti
Posts: 11378 |
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Well, these two series are very different, in that the world of Death Parade doesn't need a lot of explanation (or rather we can accept it without detailed answers), being the work of the divine (which, as the familiar aphorism assures us, works in mysterious ways), and not the device of humans. That said, as much as I loved Death Parade and was wowed by its finale, it still felt a bit rushed in that many plot points were set up without resolution, as if preparing for another season or they ran out of time or something. I would not have considered it a fault had they filled in some of those blanks. Even Zach noted that they were "ragged edges" on the storytelling.
Since the Kiznaiver system itself is the foundation of the story and not its setting, it's natural to want an explanation of it and how it broke these children, and not getting one is actually a distraction from the themes the show wants to explore. And what we're now free to be waiting to find out is how these kids will or won't be able to heal each other. As for why these two kids? Bad luck? It's a moot point, really, since if not them, we'd either be following someone else, the entire group of 19, or none of the group. I suppose it could turn out that their affection for each other had something to do with it, but I don't need or expect any further explanation other than this is what happened to them that brought them to where they are now. But ymmv.
Up to now I've just thought teacher dude was merely a voyeuristic jerk who liked pushing and needling these kids, but in view of what went down in the previous experiment, which he was a part of, he now looks like a genuine, sadistic monster. Not only no remorse whatsoever, but downright glee in making more lives miserable. Btw, while I'm still not clear on what happened in Episode 8, it now looks like the statue was built on top of the exit, and her opening the hatch is what toppled it. I think... >_> |
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MarshalBanana
 Posts: 5331 |
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How come reviews for this show are out so fast?
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GlassesMan
Posts: 217 |
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Thank you for the review. I also felt like the dialogue at the end did come off as a but artificial, although I love how Katsuhira is trying to be genuine with his friends. I also wondered at the beginning as well on the train, whether Nico's actions or Hisomu's actions were correct. Nico can be invasive, but she's correct in that there needs to be communication. The morality of friendship dynamics is tough to understand. Also it looks like our protagonists are going to have to stop Nori-chan from implementing a city wide Kiznaiver before the show ends. Onwards to the end.
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sunflower
 Posts: 1080 |
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Nick always posts his reviews within hours of the shows airing. |
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Yreva
 Posts: 23 |
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I don't agree that the dialogue from Katsuhira is stilted. Well, that's not entirely true, I agree that the words when not attached to Katsuhira himself are stilted, but within the context of this show where Katsuhira has been emotionally void for several years at this point it comes off more natural and true to his character. For a good chunk of his life he's basically been a doll, and now after all that's happened in the show he's only just now having these small bursts of feeling. To me it just seems natural that a character such as him would have trouble expressing himself in any way other than a stilted manner because he has this unique experience of being completely emotionless.
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