Forum - View topicZom 100: Bucket List of the Dead (TV).
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Blood-
 Bargain Hunter Posts: 23800 |
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@ DuskyPredator - I honestly don't think slut shaming is at work here. The reality is that the survival rate for speaking part characters is very low, regardless of whether they are male or female. Sure, his hot co-worker got zombified, but so did his boss. The couple he met on the way to his beer run got munched. And it wasn't just the boozer flight attendant who got turned it was the "good" one as well.
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smurky turkey
Posts: 1955 |
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Yeah, I am not seeing it either. As I see it everybody but the 4 mc's have a high change of getting chomped. The episodes thus far have shown that basically everyone is zombie food, not just those that are slutty.
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smurky turkey
Posts: 1955 |
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Sigh, I expected a delay to happen for this at some point, but I did not expect one this soon. Hopefully the rest of the season will not be filled with delayed Zom 100 episodes.
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Tony K.
 SubscriberModerator  Posts: 11303 Location: Frisco, TX |
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I see a majority of zombie-themed media as ultimately being reflective about interpersonal values and such. Since everything is dystopian or gone to crap, there are less superficial things to worry about (for example, their crappy jobs), and it gives the main core characters various chances to (re-)discover some of the more taken-for-granted aspects of their lives.
You could assume the core characters are a little smarter, since they have to survive (or at least, long enough) to reveal the discovery of whatever life aspect. But there are also some unfortunate dumb characters who end up becoming cannon fodder examples of the occasional "don't be this stupid and/or irresponsible during a zombie apocalypse" scenario which obviously results in their deaths. In the case of this show, I think the sex (and drinking) stuff is being used more so to highlight the shallowness of those characters and how said shallowness led to their downfalls, but also to make a point to Akira that there's more to life than just getting with someone specifically to get laid. And I think that moment he had with the one flight attendant about trying to find/re-discover his dream was a step in the right direction of where he needs to go in life. This is a really great show I've been watching since it aired. But I'll probably wait for the season to finish before I actually try to review individual episodes. I'm trying to have less things to keep up with this season. |
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Edjwald
 Posts: 1143 |
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Dusky - I edited to add a bit cos some of this is complicated
Smurky and Blood talked about the flight attendants, and I don't have much to add about it. You brought up Saori too. I personally took Saori's situation with the manager to be one more aspect of how Akira's romanticized ideals of his work place were corrupted and turned into something repulsive. I don't think the fact that Saori was having sex was the issue - I think the fact that she was having sex (reluctantly so in the office scene) with someone who was her direct supervisor and who didn’t seem to be treating her all that respectfully was the issue. I think she was a nice person and a victim, just like Akira was a victim though in a different way, obviously, and that might have been part of why Akira felt a connection. . Saori was eroticized in her last scene, naked and outlined by light from the window while Akira was earnestly confessing to her. Then she turned and revealed that she was a repulsive zombie. Again, I took that as a metaphor that something that should have been natural and beautiful was infected. I'm not saying that in a dirty slut sense. I think the manager (workplace) was evil and turned their lives into something that they shouldn't have been. Whatever Saori's goodness or faults it wasn't about being chaste since Saori was naked and in bed while being highlighted like an angel, and Akira confessed to her knowing her situation. Again, I related it directly to how Akira's romanticized version of the workplace was destroyed and why his mind snapped. As to the two upcoming (no pun intended) female leads who probably will be survivors , I seriously doubt they’ll be having sex anytime soon, but I don’t know that this will be a sign of slut shaming. From what we know, it would be out of character for Shizuku to be incautious about anything. As to the blonde, I thought she was going to be a flight attendant, but now I think she’s going to be "the hero" a foreigner who romanticizes Japanese culture. If that’s true, I doubt her idealized version of the way of the samurai will include dropping trou. Besides if the blonde immediately started having sex with Akiru or Kenchiru (and again, I think Shizuku is off the table for at least awhile) it might raise different concerns from posters who felt like the women were being treated like objects by the author instead of the author having them take charge of their own sexual decisions. That's a weird potential landmine of an area too. Then you get into why Kenchiru can have casual sex with a flight attendant but no one's worried about Kenchiru being a slut (or worried about him being objectified by a toxic flight attendant taking advantage of his vulnerability) and so on. The only other women who have survived that I can think of are the women customers in the host bar, but I don't know if that has any bearing or not. |
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Gina Szanboti
Posts: 11378 |
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Zombies crave brains, right? So naturally when they had a choice of first chomp, they went after the women instead of our heroes.
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Edjwald
Posts: 1143 |
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Heh. I have to admit, if I was a zombie with a hankering for brains, and Shizuka was running through a booby trapped building to the east wearing a football helmet, and to my west, Akira And Kenichirou (<--- think I finally got the name right) were kneeling in an open field sprinkling salt and pepper on their newly shaved skulls chanting "Here, zombie zombie zombie"...I'd run after Shizuka. |
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DuskyPredator
 Posts: 15481 Location: Brisbane, Australia |
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This is kind of my point. I hope that it doesn't look like I am going off topic of a positive discussion, but looking at these episodes there has been a surprisingly large focus on sexuality, especially as it relates to women, for having such a male main character. And so far he has been an innocent boy who almost seemed to not realise how sexual Saori was in being in an affair with their boss, and he has practically been immune to the zombie dangers as part of the narrative. The other surviving guy is obviously a very sexual guy, but apparently actually hated that whole thing? It just kind of feels like a sort of double standard that his friend would be safe from being turned zombies, but apparently by the same metric that women pretty similar to him would not. To be fair, with not really seeing more about how the female main characters will fit in, I am working on partial information. And looking at them now, the blonde woman could refute everything I am saying, she got big boobs. And I am also not saying that to be better would be female characters need to come in start having sex. Because especially the feminist discussion in a lot of media involving sexuality of women is not about women allowed to be sexy or not, it is about if it makes the character act as just an object or not. Trying shorten it down from something long, I will just reference the movie Cabin in the Woods, which cleverly deconstructed tropes where an apparently more complicated character was forced into the role of "the whore". Long story short, there is a long history in horror of the sexual female character being punished for *insert societal morals here*. I don't think I am being misguided that in our first few episodes, repeated imagery we have had has been beautiful women turned repulsive: The office slut, woman tied up in the room (sex worker?) in BDSM gear, and the (loose) flight attendants. Going by the idea that these are just good people who were corrupted by shallow things in life, that itself feels kind of bad, that there is this element of judgement. And in a story clearly where a character is either zombie food or not, concepts like the Madonna-whore complex may be apt. Again, I am not really hating on the show, and I do want to enjoy it. Some of that enjoyment might affected by trends like if it really will be a continued trend where it feels like an entire trend is punished for being dirtied in a rather conservative sense. Waiting for those two other characters to be more main stay. |
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smurky turkey
Posts: 1955 |
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Hmmm, I can only speak for myself, but looking at the series and episodes thus far as a whole I would say it is far more about humans being degenerates than anything gender specific. Be it the sleazy boss, male zombies in sailor outfits and so on, I think both genders come across as being involved in a lot of sexual activities and certain types of behavior. It also does not feel condemning to me, both men and women seem to be getting killed off in a pretty speedy fashion, the only exceptions are the mc's, which will have two women be part of the group by the looks of things.
So yeah, I think the series says a lot about society as a whole and how people in general are pretty nasty and horribly flawed in many ways, but I am not perceiving any gender being specifically addressed. |
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Animegomaniac
Posts: 4088 |
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So you're saying Akira was right that having the mixer with plenty of alcohol was more important than getting out of there alive? If all the woman were already bitten then you'd be correct but they were only doomed for certain after they met up with Akira I'm watching the live action movie right now. I think the movie's fine as it changes so many things about the premise, the lead and it even updates the backstory to account for COVID.... or at least Akira stayed in the awful job for only one year rather than 3. Every complaint I've had about the anime does not apply to the movie, it's got to be written by someone who looked at the manga and thought "What is this mess?" The movie changed the mixer into something that works, it also took out the slut shaming and the trope of death by sex if you're a woman. It did it all by using the manga's plot armored characters against the story. |
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter Posts: 23800 |
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It's interesting to me how this show is definitely having a Rorschach effect on us with different viewers seeing different things. I'm definitely not seeing the slut shaming thing. Animegomaniac is being his usual literalist self, completely insensible to any attempts at humour or satire. The mixer completely worked... if you understand that one of the things this show is trying to be is a comedy. It's funny that in the middle of a zombie apocalypse, a random group accidentally finds itself enacting a mixer. But if you have a literalist, prosaic, uh, comedy? whazzat? type of brain of course the mixer "doesn't work" because, zomg, don't these people know they are in a zombie apocalypse??? I'm so glad my mind doesn't work in that kind of humdrum banal way.
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Tony K.
Subscriber Moderator Posts: 11303 Location: Frisco, TX |
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I see Kencho as being a sort of grounding element for Akira. I'm assuming they're really close, if not best friends, so if they decide to eventually take the tragic route and kill off Kencho, then they'll need to build him up a little, first, hence his survival. Otherwise, I feel his character also represents the qualities that Akira lacks. So in a way, they're two sides of the same coin, and maybe this is the story's way of illustrating the ups and downs of being a guy? I understand how you can interpret the sexuality in all the other female characters as a negative, though. But that's the greatness of media: people can interpret and discuss stuff like this all day. And it's ironic you referenced (The) Cabin in the Woods (2011), because I was initially going to reference another film, Don Jon (2013), but already used it in the (The) Dangers in My Heart thread and didn't wanna' overuse the reference. But for those who might've not read the reference or just forgot about it, the movie is about a guy named Jon (Joseph Gordin-Levitt) who has these preconceived notions of treating women as objects because he's a porn addict. He sleeps around solely for the goal of sexual conquest, then decides to go steady with a girl named Barbara (Scarlett Johansson). However, it turns out she has preconceived notions thinking all men need to be head-over-heels lovey-dovey because she's gaga for romance movies like (The) Notebook (2004). The film basically deconstructs the tropes of objectifying both, men and women, with Jon eventually falling for an older woman (Julianne Moore), who helps him discover how emotional connection can elevate a relationship, thus breaking Jon out of the shallow mindset of sex being everything. I don't think Zom 100 is trying to be quite that heavy-handed for the sexuality in this show. But like I mentioned with Akira's little self-discovery moment with the one attendant, I feel he made some headway in terms of becoming less superficial (looking to get laid) and becoming more aware of the finer things (emotional connection and re-ignited pursuit of his dream). I also think that since two of the main characters, so far, are male. This is probably the narrative's version of exploring/developing them. I guess sexuality is also an easier thing to pay attention to? But once the two ladies join the group, it'll be interesting to see how the writing treats their goals and/or backstories. Maybe one of them will have a similar self-discovery moment or some kind of revelation like Akira did. |
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Beltane70
 Posts: 3892 |
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Were we even watching the same episode of the same show? Akira didn't even start or suggest the mixer. When he and Kencho entered into the store. the three women and the already infected man were already huddled in fear. Kencho pointed out that the zombies would be probably leave after awhile and since they were in a department store basement and that they wouldn't run out of food for awhile and suggested that they stay positive. It was at that point were Reika, the tall woman with long hair, started drinking on her own, with one of the other two women, Maki, following suit. If Akira and Kencho hadn't shown up, the three women would probably still been cowering in fear until the infected man had fully turned into a zombie and killed them. |
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter Posts: 23800 |
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Oh Beltane70, Beltane70, Beltane70... you just don't get it, do you? See, when there is something as realistic as a zombie apocalypse depicted in a work of fiction, the characters in it should behave in extremely realistic and common sense ways at all times. Akira's FIRST ACT upon meeting the three new people SHOULD have been to strip them naked and perform a close examination of every inch of skin. Had he performed this simple and logical action, he would have detected the infected man, taken immediate steps to neutralize him, and then spent the rest of the time carefully strategizing how to escape from the basement. By failing to do so, he effectively killed those two shameful sluts and the "good" girl. Man, how can you not get that???
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DuskyPredator
Posts: 15481 Location: Brisbane, Australia |
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Pretty sure that it was him that recognised that it was a mixer, which felt like an "OMG, I might get laid" sort of scene. This being a story that is written by a human, not actually happened, suggests possibly some underlying belief of who wrote it. And the easy parallel for contrasting was his previous run in with a woman that he too was having feelings about. The one with only survival on her mind, and said something like alcohol was a bad idea. The secret infected of the group I guess would probably be described stereotypically as a salaryman, the number one critique this show has against the culture of, the abusive boss and the overworked and stressed employees. It seems pretty apt to identify what the similarities of his workplace crush and the flight attendants might be for what might also be criticisms. Could it be about women who try to use their sexuality in society and might shallow? That is a worst case scenario, because there could arguably be an equal condemnation of the roles women are put in to survive, the sex and drinking, that are similar to the salaryman role. But with our centre character being from the salaryman world, I would say we need the representation of a character so that female characters don't just feel like objects in his story. |
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