Forum

Last edited by Big Hed on Mon Aug 04, 2008 2:04 pm; edited 1 time in total

Teuvan wrote:

On the other hand, many fansubbers take a more artistic approach to translating, and make an effort to maintain the original intent rather than do a direct translation.

Bull. I've seen plenty of cases among supposedly high quality groups where the provided translation is disjointed, much less effective at conveying original intent. Hell, plenty of shows don't even get the attention of better groups, so the quality of translation deteriorates further. R1 subtitles are consistent and accurate at the least (with exceptions, of course, such as the dubtitles Sony recently put out for Blood+. But hey, even then you can watch the fansubs if you so choose, and buy the DVDs to justify the viewing).

Teuvan wrote:

I don't care about dubs myself. However, I do wish companies would start making good subs. I have enough scattered knowledge of Japanese, especially of words that are difficult to translate and/or don't have good English equivalents, to know when a sub is half-assed. Most professional translators take the most literal route, leaving the dialog without feeling and stripping of it of the original intent. On the other hand, many fansubbers take a more artistic approach to translating, and make an effort to maintain the original intent rather than do a direct translation.

Another problem is DVDs. It's not so much that DVD prices are ridiculously bad. The problem is that more than 90% of anime can only be "legitimately" watched through DVDs, and that's unacceptable. If the American television industry was in the same situation, they'd be in the same situation as the anime industry. Without proper exposure to the works, people won't be willing to shell out $30 for four episodes on a blind gamble.

To me, the best solution to this is taking advantage of Internet television. This is starting to grow as a trend, but it still has a long ways to go. If distributors could offer anime on a website in the same way television works, with advertisements and all, they would increase the exposure to their product, thereby increasing DVD sales, and they would earn the extra income from advertising and subscription fees. Some channels, probably most, could be subscription based, while others could work like broadcast television, relying only on advertisements.

Either way, until both translation quality and Internet television become commonplace, I have no sympathy for the American anime industry. I'll keep expanding my 400 volume manga collection, though, because the companies in the manga industry have already taken the proper steps to ensure their success in business. But as far as anime goes, I'll keep downloading fansubs and ignoring DVDs until companies actually do something that makes them worthy of my purchase.

-original intent? Unless you've spoken to the anime creators, I can safely say you're throwing out a HUGE assumption. And good luck talking to most anime creators about fansubs, chances are they'll bite your head off. Because, you know, you are basically stabbing them in the back by leeching off their hard work. As for "literal" vs. "artistic", such subjective terms could be debated forever. Japanese is a tricky language to translate, and I fail to see how fansubbers would have any better methods than pros in the industry. At least the pros have means to contact anime creators, meaning their decisions are at least somewhat trustworthy. Trusting a fansubber, on the other hand? He's just some guy, with no connections. Color me unimpressed.

-you want to know WHY the American TV industry isn't in that situation? It's because their shows draw a larger audience than anime does. And no, that has little to nothing to do with the R1 industry's choices. Fact of the matter is, if you approached 100 random strangers, they'd be more likely to be a fan of LOST or Dancing with the Stars than they would anime. Anime has a SMALL fanbase compared to other entertainment, and the industry can only expand it so much. And really, why should they do all the work? If I love something, wouldn't I take the effort to get others to like it? A non-anime fan isn't suddenly going to think, "gee, I should check out Funimation's website!" That's up to us fans.

-so apparently Viz offering $2 episodes for download and Funimation offering FREE episodes to preview shows isn't enough? Also, anime costs quite a bit to get over here and make available. Big-name companies certainly aren't going to pay for ads to be shown in something as small as anime, and smaller companies' money won't be enough. Once again, anime does NOT bring in audiences anywhere near the number that most TV shows do.

-sympathy? Who cares if you sympathize with them? If you do not buy official anime DVDs (and guess what, if you really hate R1 that much, there's always official R2 DVDs), you are a leech. There's no getting around that. You are not supporting anime. You are giving a big "screw you" to all the Japanese anime creators, and they are mad at you for it. So you can claim to be a big fan of Miyazaki, Watanabe, Anno, etc., but they certainly aren't going to be a fan of yours.

kokuryu wrote:

Kireek wrote:

To authorites there is this thing called crunchyroll

Crunchyroll is legal. They have contracts will the majority of the studios and production houses. You can buy approved legally provided subtitled anime straight from Japan on Crunchyroll.

BOST and YouTube and Direct2Drive and a few others now provide this service as well, but Crunchyroll is lightyears ahead of all the others in content and service.

Im not falling for it this time

Teuvan wrote:

On the other hand, many fansubbers take a more artistic approach to translating, and make an effort to maintain the original intent rather than do a direct translation.

Wait, this just sounds totally backwards. Isn't the biggest complaint levelled against dubs that they take too much artistic license with the dialogue? Don't most proponants of subs toute their supiriority because subs tend to be more literal translations?

Teuvan wrote:

I have enough scattered knowledge of Japanese, especially of words that are difficult to translate and/or don't have good English equivalents, to know when a sub is half-assed.

I call BS. There is no way you can be some kind of expert on "words that are difficult to translate and/or don't have good English equivalents" with only a "scattered knowledge of Japanese". These words and phrases are difficult to translate for someone who's fluent in the language. What makes you think your scattered knowledge will allow you to better grasp the 'intent' of these words than a fluent proffesional who will contact the creator for clarification when they're confused.

I'm sorry for the rant (if I've crossed some kind of line for offensiveness, please just delete it), but when people who are not fluent in Japanese complain about the accuracy of the translation (and this person isn't the only one), it pisses me off. If the translation is disjointed and doesn't make sense, that's one thing, but complaining about nuances and intent when you don't speak the language is idiotic.

Back on topic, my understanding of legal and judicial proceedings is extremely limited, so could someone explain was a suspended sentence means?

Daimao Raki wrote:

Official releases are always better than loosely translated fansubs in which the only real purpose is to get out the episode fast.

I would definitely not say always... Smile

-Tofu

kokuryu wrote:

Crunchyroll is legal. They have contracts will the majority of the studios and production houses. You can buy approved legally provided subtitled anime straight from Japan on Crunchyroll.

BOST and YouTube and Direct2Drive and a few others now provide this service as well, but Crunchyroll is lightyears ahead of all the others in content and service.

That is Crunchyroll's eventual hope, but it is not true today. Of the major anime studios, only Gonzo (and by proxy, ADV for a single Gonzo title) have ever authorized their work to appear on that site. Other "indie" anime have been authorized, but the vast majority of content on Crunchyroll is still there illegally.

crunchyroll sucks nowadays though.
they removed the best anime recently claiming that it got licensed.

Tofusensei wrote:

Daimao Raki wrote:

Official releases are always better than loosely translated fansubs in which the only real purpose is to get out the episode fast.

I would definitely not say always... Smile

-Tofu

Fact remains what you are doing Tofu is illegal. When the FBI gets a hold of these groups, it won't be a pretty sight.

johjohz wrote:

crunchyroll sucks nowadays though.
they removed the best anime recently claiming that it got licensed.

What do you expect them to do? Leave it up and risk being sued out of existence?

My biggest problem is that far too often I find the Official subs hard to read on the screen. I also kind of like it when fansubs use different colors and fonts for the subs. So yes I download fansubs, but I also buy the DVDs when/if they become available.

Daimao Raki wrote:

Tofusensei wrote:

Daimao Raki wrote:

Official releases are always better than loosely translated fansubs in which the only real purpose is to get out the episode fast.

I would definitely not say always... Smile

-Tofu

Fact remains what you are doing Tofu is illegal. When the FBI gets a hold of these groups, it won't be a pretty sight.

I don't believe I ever said it wasn't...

Tofusensei wrote:

Daimao Raki wrote:

Tofusensei wrote:

Daimao Raki wrote:

Official releases are always better than loosely translated fansubs in which the only real purpose is to get out the episode fast.

I would definitely not say always... Smile

-Tofu

Fact remains what you are doing Tofu is illegal. When the FBI gets a hold of these groups, it won't be a pretty sight.

I don't believe I ever said it wasn't...

If you know it's illegal, why waste your time doing it? For all you know the authorities could be building a case against you.

I also jaywalked this morning Sad

Tofusensei wrote:

I also jaywalked this morning Sad

Does that loosen the tension enough, I wonder?

xD I'm not really going to pick on you, Tofu.

As far as the FBI is concerned...I'm still waiting for them to get Narutofan.

Just want to see the results, if it happens, anyway. I'll start believing once the US does something. *shrugs.*

tygerchickchibi wrote:

Tofusensei wrote:

I also jaywalked this morning Sad

Does that loosen the tension enough, I wonder?

xD I'm not really going to pick on you, Tofu.

As far as the FBI is concerned...I'm still waiting for them to get Narutofan.

Just want to see the results, if it happens, anyway. I'll start believing once the US does something. *shrugs.*

It will be fairly easy when they do start taking action. Nearly all the top fansubbing groups and communities are in plain sight.

Tofusensei wrote:

I also jaywalked this morning Sad

Shame, shame shame. In a huge metropolitan area, that's almost like commiting suicide. Your health should always come first. Smile

Forum - View topic
NEWS: 3rd Man Sentenced for Anime Sharing with Share Program

My Hero Academia Enters 'Epilogue;' Author States Manga Will Continue for 'A While' as it 'Returns to its Title'

A Returner's Magic Should Be Special Season 1 Anime Review

Ghibli Park's Newest Area Brings Howl's Moving Castle and Kiki's Delivery Service to Life

Lupin III's 1st Fujiko Voice Actress Eiko Masuyama Dies at 89

T・P BON Season 1 Anime Series Review

Mizuho Kusanagi: Yona of the Dawn Manga is in its Final Arc

Turns Out Shōhei Ohtani Can Pitch, Hit, AND Draw Manga Art Shockingly Well

Kengan Ashura Season 1 Part 1 Anime Series Review

This Week in Games - Sony And Marvelous Woke Up And Chose The Same Day To Showcase, And I'm Paying For It

My Picture Diary Manga Review

My Oni Girl Director Asks Viewers To Be True to Themselves

Forum - View topicNEWS: 3rd Man Sentenced for Anime Sharing with Share Program

Forum

Forum - View topic
NEWS: 3rd Man Sentenced for Anime Sharing with Share Program