Forum - View topicBest World-Building Tournament: Concluded!
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Ghost_Wheel
 Posts: 203 |
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Throwing in my hat in support of Best Fight Scene. I think if we want a more fun and laid back tournament, discussing the visual merits, circumstantial importance, and nostalgic cool factor of each fight scene could hit the spot in just the right way.
This was the first tournament I participated in, but I really enjoyed it because worldbuilding and setting based themes are really what I look for in a great show. After LoGH was nominated, I slowly watched to be able to have a real opinion on it as the later rounds dawned. It became my last big title to defend, and I was happy to see it survive so many close calls. A lot of my favorite worlds got killed quickly, like the ones in Birdy, Noein, From the New World, Honneamise and Geneshaft. Geneshaft's loss, while disappointing, was entirely expected due its obscurity and reputation. I wish I had seen Simoun then so I could have made a proper comparison (because in many ways it is an apt one). All I'll say now is that anyone who enjoyed Simoun should check it out because Geneshaft's worldbuilding is better in just about every way. It shares the same motif of putting the characters under stress in a specific wartime situation on a battleship, but the actions and dialogue that result from this stress reveal volumes about the new and completely different human race and the culture and societal structure that arises from it. My voting got kind of spotty after most of the big ones died because I felt that my lending a comparatively uninformed perspective on some titles wasn't really justified by my desire to push a title I only thought was marginally better in some other part of the bracket. As for what I'll watch afterwards, nothing here really jumped out at me yet, but that's because I wasn't really in a place to look. You can bet I'll be looking over old arguments to scout for something really cool and inventive to watch in the future. Edit: Yes! That's twice in a row that my post got us out of the range of that annoying bug. |
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One-Eye
 Posts: 2261 |
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I'm not against it, just bringing up some of the comments from last time. There was also concern that some of the longer fights (multi-episode ones) would be too long to watch.
In the past we tried to keep it to a minimum, use spoiler tags, or speak in generalities. Too many spoilers might keep people away from tournaments.
I think a shorter tournament might help with burnout for some of the regulars. Fewer entries is one way to go or if its a really light topic that doesn't require too much discussion we might be able to get away with voting twice a week and finish sooner. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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Well, it would essentially be a moe thread, which means discussion and debate would run to several thousand pages like such threads normally do.[/joking] But seriously, after perusing the original moe tournament thread and looking at what people said when they voted, I think we should leave it up to voters as to whether they want to provide justifications or not. After all, justifications were optional in the first tournament and many people still provided them. They weren't always good reasons that made sense, true, but a lot were. And hey, policing the voting with strict and mandatory justifications is counter to what a fun and non-serious tourney is about.
With a knock-out tournament structure the end-date is always easy to figure out. It isn't the length of the tournament that is the problem, as previous tournaments have run for nearly six months and still kept up respectable participation levels. The problem is in fact waning enthusiasm for serious tournaments in general.
There is no way we could have a shortened tournament with Most Moe Redux, as there have been so many strong moe characters in the past few years that the number of potential participants in such a tournament would be huge. However, you seem to have the wrong idea that you have to vote every week. Although that is of course preferable, no-one is demanding that you or anyone else commit to voting every week for months on end. Just vote when you have time. And unless you're working sixteen-hour days then I can assure you that you will have time to vote in Most Moe Redux. Voting would only take five-to-ten minutes, if that, so it's not like you have to give up an entire evening each week.
Nah, I've put a lot of thought into this and decided it wouldn't work for the following reasons: 1): a lot of people are not on ANN frequently-enough, so if voting window is only just a few days they might miss it. 2): if guys like Unicorn_Blade struggle to find the time to vote once per week then there's no way they could vote twice per week. 3): If voting window is less than a week then the end of voting is changing all the time, making it extremely difficult for people to know when the window closes. A regular day is far easier to remember than if it is two days that constantly change from week to week. |
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Vaisaga
 Posts: 13230 |
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I agree that the next tournament should be something lighter. The last two were heavy on the analysis and I stopped following this tourney because it got pretty dry.
I'd be cool with moe, but something I was thinking of was best mascot character. Your Haros and your PenPens and such. Not only can we look at cuteness, but how they contributed to the show as well (did you know some Haros have actually piloted Gundams and saved the hero?). |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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^
I like the idea of Best Mascot Character. It is fun and light but also offers plenty of scope for discussion for those who want such things. |
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jl07045
 Posts: 1527 Location: Riga, Latvia |
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When the tournament started I was quite determined to vote all the way to the end, but my laziness got the better of me early on. I also felt uncomfortable voting when I had seen only one or neither of the shows. I am glad LoGH one although From the New World was my top pick out of the ones I'd seen. Maybe if there is a tournament, where I don't have to watch most of the show to make an informed vote I would participate more.
I think that Kyubey would win that one by a landslide. |
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Aylinn
 Posts: 1684 |
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I am glad to see that LoGH has finally won a tournament.
 It is a pity this tournament had not more voters, but I understand life goes in the way. I myself could not have been more active, because it coincided with the time period when I had a lot of work.
I don't think there were any great omissions, the only show I can think up that, although would not have been a top contender, has an interesting world is Amatsuki, I even nominated it, but it seems that no one apart from me has seen it.
I think it is a good idea to give everyone time to watch nominated series. During the tournament I come up with the idea that maybe it might be interesting to have Best plot-driven or Best character-driven series, but I don't mind if there is something more light-hearted first. I have just written these ideas down lest I forget them. |
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Vaisaga
Posts: 13230 |
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I dunno, most people I know hate that thing. Pikachu all the way! |
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One-Eye
Posts: 2261 |
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I don't know. I think the longer the tournament the more drop off or inconsistency in voting you get. You mentioned in a previous post about getting new blood in these tournaments, but I'm not sure lengthy ones are the way to go about it. I'm not convinced that its strictly waning enthusiasm for serious tournaments either. Its the discussions in the serious tournaments that keep me coming back. I also think this tournament might have suffered from real life syndrome, some burnout and the fact that the subject was both broad and complex. I think tournaments like Best First Episode were narrower in scope and allowed us to focus more on a single episode without worrying about the whole show. However, I do agree overall that are more fun tournament which doesn't require deep thought or rewatching some episodes would be a good break. I think "fun" in this context could easily include watching Youtube clips of your favorite action scene or mascot or character being moe, etc.
1) and 2): But you just told Unicorn Blade that:
3) No one says the voting window has to change or be an equivalent number of days. Just pick 2 days and that's that. Don't get me wrong I'm not married to the idea or anything like that. I'm just thinking out loud and trying to see if there's some other structure the tournament could take. Once a week is easier for everyone to remember after all. Anyways, this is just speaking for myself but I'm not sure at this time I could maintain enthusiasm for a 6 month long tournament whether its a more cerebral one or a light and fluffy one. I would definitely want a 3-4 month break after this last one. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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I know what you mean. But I'd like to respectfully point out that for the past few tournaments we have had big breaks in between each one and they still have suffered terrible turnout. I don't mind a break, I really don't. No-one's demanding that the next tournament be held right away. But while we should have a break it isn't going to fix our fundamental problem, that of people being burned out. Will having a light and fluffy topic do the trick? I can't make any promises that it will be a silver bullet, but I do believe we should at least give it a go. Now, whether the topic has to do with moe, fight scenes, mascots or whatever doesn't bother me. It doesn't have to be moe. As long as it is popular and can produce an interesting (and decently-sized) field of candidates, I'm fine with whatever people decide on. |
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Unicorn_Blade
 Posts: 1153 Location: UK |
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Of course I realise no one forces me to vote every week and that it is for fun and not an obligation. But I work a lot in front of computer, and a few times a year I have so much deadlines to cope with. You're not counting a human factor in here, physically I would have time to vote, but after a whole day of typing reports and entering data, sitting at home in front of my laptop seems like another obligation. And during a tournament that lasts 3,5 months (first post in this thread was in October), doing it every week just does not sit with me. Of course I realise that's just me and a few people find time and pleasure in participating actively every week for an extended period of time, Im just saying from a perspective of someone who would like to see a tournament through, but is unable for such a long term commitment. Judging from the uneven and decreasing numbers of people voting, I am not the only one to struggle. In terms keeping people interested over a period of time, maybe a shorter tournament would work. Or maybe not, but we will not know unless we try and see. Secondly, I cant remember saying that I would like voting twice a week (although that might work too). By quicker tournaments I meant shorter, with fewer titles. I was also not saying anything about particular tournament ideas, but Im not sure why would Moe Redux be so hard to pull off, or harder to pull off, than any other tournament in a shorter version? All we would need to do is to half the amount of contestants in the brackets during the voting stage- it would be like starting from round two. That would mean some titles not making it through, which is the case anyway in case of all tournaments. Reducing the amount of participants and shortening the touney might work in terms of keeping people on board. Those are just some ideas, Ill go with whatever people come up with in the end. |
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farichada
 Posts: 303 Location: Wisconsin, USA |
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I blame the time of the year. Its the near the end of the fiscal year. Perhaps a Biggest Loser or Biggest Otaku tournament would be more light hearted and popular.
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Animegomaniac
Posts: 4102 |
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Fight scenes, the drum solos of anime. Fine when you first experience them - as long as they're done well- but after awhile you just tune them out. Except when it's Wrath in FMA Brotherhood...
That's amazingly inaccurate. There's been a lot of them, yes, but "strong" is not the word I'd use myself. Incessant, numerous, cookie cutter and by the numbers for starters. Many were mass produced in recent years, mostly thanks to light novels. Face - hair > color - school uniform or any easily iconic outfit - voice actress and we're in business and I do mean "business". Was I the only one who wondered what was going on when characters talked about their named voice actresses before they're even supposedly cast as part of the plot? Light novels are made to be creatively bankrupt, not all of them are but they are stories sold on key images and that image is moe. I could only consider about two or three as "strong" within a year and that number goes down dramatically once you start putting characters side by side. "Oh, she's just a bit of her, her and her." |
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WhiteHairGirls
 Posts: 4713 Location: New York City |
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Yes please do an easygoing one for the next one. I lost interest halfway through the last 2 tournaments because I didn't feel like giving good explanations. I like the Best Mascot idea.
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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For your information we already have tried a shorter tournament. It did not work. Tournaments in the past were six months long and got twenty or even thirty votes each week, so waning interest has nothing to do with length.
Even after all the cookie-cutter characters have been taken out there are still plenty of strong candidates. Getting enough worthy candidates will not be a problem with Most Moe Redux. |
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