Forum - View topicMonogatari is a Disaster
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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Hear hear, I fully agree. It's wacky and crazy and messy at times, and some entries in the franchise are far stronger than others, but Monogatari is no disaster. It's brilliant, frankly, albeit in its own unique way. |
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Jackanapes
Posts: 119 |
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I dont understand why you would deliberately want to include things that would turn certain types of people off from a show rather than the other way around. No it that I'm saying its impossible cause that's kind of what it feels like at times with certain kinds of shows lately. I still feel entirely alone in my distaste for this franchise here if not unwelcomingly so since nobody has bashed me as much as they've bashed the author who likes the franchise for his efforts. Kind of feel bad for Nick in a way, he clearly likes the franchise but is writing a rare honest take on why he thinks its hard to recommend instead of the usual overwhelming praise stuff I usually see and is getting trashed for I guess not liking the show the right or unconditional way. This is also something I've often found pretty uninviting about the franchise is that its atanabe comes across as extremely intolerant of people that dont unconditionally praise allaspects of it. That's kind of what I'm talking about when I jokingly ask if its okay not to like this franchise. Some people quietly say sure why not, others scream absolutely not you damn hater you. |
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sunflower
 Posts: 1080 |
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Especially when you don't tell them the names of the installments, what order they go in, and if and where I can watch them streaming. Yes, search engines are my friends, but if you're trying to entice people to watch something, it helps if you don't aim your article at people whom you expect to already know these things. |
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Eldritcho
 Posts: 260 |
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I can agree with this succinct dissertation. kekeke |
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Ashen Phoenix
 Posts: 2914 |
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Technically speaking, that would be hebephilia, not pedophilia. Really enjoyed the article. I've only seen Monogatari so far so I can't speak to how I feel about any of the later seasons, but just from a first season standpoint the gatari 'verse is memorable in its audacity, insanity, and acid-trip artistry. |
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Actar
 Posts: 1074 Location: Singapore |
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That's what makes it enjoyable. It's self-aware enough to incorporate fanservice in a fun and playful way. Also, is the word "pandering" really necessary? Every show panders to their target demographic. It always seems to me that people who use these words use them to demean and distance themselves from the "otaku" to make themselves out to have more refined tastes. Can't we just have different tastes as opposed to good versus bad tastes? |
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jr240483
 Posts: 4385 Location: New York City,New York,USA |
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and while its not a high quality harem series like high school dxd ,its still a solid harem series and they didn't go over the top with the fanservice.especially when it came to sibling complex that happens in the series since that type of fanservice turns some people off of a series very quickly. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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^
Well, I'll never look at a toothbrush the same way again, that's for sure. |
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Animegomaniac
Posts: 4099 |
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I like Bakemonogatari but I have no interest in watching anything else of it.
1 Because I do like the primary show, I want to still like it. 2 "Here's more characters, new and newish characters done in the same style of just characters talking." Wow, it's almost like they're copying the show rather than evolving it. 3 Prequels. Gah. Or is it garg? Gor. Anyway, some kind of sound where the pit of the stomach becomes both bottomless and infected. 4 Interquals. Bleargh~ Guess what just happened? Have we wasted enough time yet? 5 Direct continuations or sequels. And then what happened? I saw the first season, nothing else had to happen. That is, while it's not complete as a romantic comedy drama -which plays out just as I'd think from the first season, it just took a lot longer than it had any need to- its thematic character arcs are sufficient for its own premise. So. My conclusion? Bakemonogatari is a fine example of "less is more" animation design which is Shaft as its best and the rest of it is an actual disaster. But I'm reaching that conclusion based on the idea that the first season/book was an experiment and the rest was a cash in once the creators found out they had an audience. Well, more on the fact that once you do a giant invisible crab monster that attacks you by making you weightless, you can only go creatively downhill from there. Maybe just on the idea that I actively sought out the first season and loved it and the rest of it, readily available now, just has me feeling "So? You've done this, now do something else." Nisekoi. "No, something else." Nisekoi 2 "By something else, I mean something less of a 'we have an audience to maintain' show." Madoka. "Right, I give up." Sasami-san@Ganbaranai Actually, this one was ok, too weird to be have mass appeal, to be made as a product for the masses. This is the Shaft I loved, back when they did their own thing without expecting a massive payout with every title. Monogatari is a disaster? It certainly precipitated one. |
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HaruhiToy
 Posts: 4118 |
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It is sort of interesting how few people seem to comment on the persistent feature where the screenplay flashes a pasteboard with about 27 kanji characters and subtitle for about TWO FRAMES. Often but not always with something salient written. Does anyone besides me spend time rewinding and stopping the playback just to read them?
It is very arty I know. But annoying. |
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killjoy_the
 Posts: 2460 |
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I like the text frames in a way because they're almost always info dumps of some sort (usually the POV character's thoughts) that wouldn't translate very well to animated material. So literally putting it in text and just flashing through it if you want to bother reading it (since it's not completely necessary to understand what's happening) is one way to handle it. Personally if I catch it in time I'll stop the video and read, but if I'm too slow to react and the frame's gone I just keep watching the episode.
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thofheinz
Posts: 98 |
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The worst thing about the incestuous, pedophiliac, predatory aspects of Araragi is that they are supposed to be funny. So for viewers like me, who thoroughly enjoy the brilliant artistry and wit of almost every installment of the series, it's jolting to be expected to laugh at something about as hilarious as a new and virulent strain of syphilis.
It's depressing. I mean, it's supposed to be amusing when that asshole puts his hand under a (supposedly) sleeping Mayoi's skirt to feel her up. (Think about that!) It's supposed to be funny when he repeatedly grabs his sisters' boobs or conjectures plans to get involved with them, as he does concerning Karen at the end of Hana. Accosting children in the street (always with Mayoi and once with "little Hanekawa") is supposed to be hilarious, as when he threatens Mayoi that he's going to take off her panties while he's groping her nonexistent boobs. There are also the comic masterpiece upskirt shots, especially the side-splitting skirt flip on Nadeko and the one where the animated doll (can't remember her name) repeatedly and unsuccessfully asks him to stop holding up her skirt while he's staring at her ass. Then there is the subtle humor of his verbally tormenting Hanekawa with the possibilities after she has told him she will "do anything" if he doesn't tell about her being abused, at the very moment that she is walking around bandaged and traumatized and about to wreak havoc because of stifled rage. Every installment of the series is punctuated by that shit. I hope that Araragi tells a story from prison someday. Now that would be funny. Incidentally, despite the lighthearted treatment of this heinousness in the novels, I never get the feeling that Ishin wants us to think this stuff is funny. What is funny is Araragi trying feebly to deny his own wretchedness and the fact that any such attempt is futile. What I will never understand is how so many viewers think this stuff is hilarious when they have sisters or even daughters in real life. Or any girl or woman they care about, when it comes down to it. |
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HaruhiToy
Posts: 4118 |
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I haven't met any ghosts, vampires, spirits, or superpower fighting athletes capable of destroying freeway interchanges who also happened to be young girls. But I have been related to and met a lot of young girls. And I don't recall a single one of them that didn't enjoy being teased to some extent by some older guy they felt comfortable with. At it often is teasing with a sexual basis to it. And that's all it is -- just teasing. Maybe you think Araragi takes it too far and you would hardly be alone in that, but you have to combine the acts with the relationship. His victims all enjoy his attention and they probably would not with anyone else. I don't see any indication that he would keep frolicking with them if they didn't like it. And they are hardly just frightened little girls -- they are dangerous beings that look like little girls. Not just anyone could play with them the way he does. As for actual sexual activity it is clear Araragi's focus is on girls in his own age group. And they're all pretty dangerous too. Whether it is hilarious or not is up to the beholder -- personally I am a bit lukewarm to it. |
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thofheinz
Posts: 98 |
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I'm not saying or implying that you're making such excuses, but it is consistently true that abusers' rationales consist of "She enjoyed it" or "She can take care of herself."
These excuses are hard-wired into the show's narrative. Truth be told, several of the examples I gave show that the girls did NOT like what he was doing, and with Mayoi especially, playing tongue hockey with Araragi right before her grand exit, you have a pedophile's stereotype of a prepubescent kid who's sexually into an adult. I know I may take this too seriously, but I freaking HATE that stuff. However, I've gotten very good at marking where Araragi shows up in each arc and pretty much cutting him out as much as possible. This leaves me with the strong characters, anyway, and I don't want to kneecap an imaginary character for being a scumbag or disrespect a character I love for excusing him. Fortunately, this is sometimes easy to do -- Neko White and Hitagi End barely involved Araragi, and they were the best of Second Season. As for Hitagi loving and letting him off the hook for most everything... If we all got the love we deserved, we'd all be lonely. (Incidentally, Araragi would look a lot less like a pedophile in one aspect if the damned studio would release *Kizumonogatari*, which explains everything about his relationship with Shinobu.) Last edited by thofheinz on Mon Aug 10, 2015 12:13 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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kotomikun
Posts: 1205 |
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In the same sense that Monogatari is not a harem series? It doesn't give the show a grade, but it certainly counts as a "here are my general thoughts about this piece of media" thing, also known as a review. |
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