Forum - View topic[Encyclopedia] Card Captor Sakura request
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GATSU
Posts: 15324 |
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Can you get rid of, or merge the "Master of the Clow" thing from Tokyopop? Because it makes people think there are 18 volumes.
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Shiroi Hane
Encyclopedia Editor
 Posts: 7580 Location: Wales |
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Context: manga#3092
When Tokyopop released the second half of the Cardcaptor manga they gave it the subtitle "Master of the Clow". IIRC this was their first release of CCS under their "100% Authentic" brand and they later re-released the first half unflopped to match. Dark Horse has made no such distinction with their omnibus releases and I'm pretty sure there was no distinction made in Japan either (I have Kodansha's bilingual release of the series, but they only covered the first six volumes). |
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Dessa
 Posts: 4438 |
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There is no distinction in the Japanese release. I have 8-12, and they look just the same as the earlier volumes.
My suggestion would be that the "Master of the Clow" entry gets merged into the Cardcaptor Sakura entry, and add the title under Alternate Titles, with the precision "(English volumes 7-12)", and the volumes be listed as "Master of the Clow 1 (7)", etc. |
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Dessa
Posts: 4438 |
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You know, thinking on this more, I'm even more thinking that the CCS manga should be a single entry.
* Unlike Magic Knight Rayearth, in which both the Japanese and English releases are broken into "Magic Knight Rayearth" and "Magic Knight Rayearth II", it is only the English release that adds the subtitle to Cardcaptor Sakura. The Japanese release is numbered 1-12. * With long-running anime, it's not uncommon, for the English releases, to break the series up into "seasons", whether they have them in the Japanese version or not. The two in particular that come to mind are Naruto and One Piece, both of which have US releases that go "Season #, Part #", whereas, from what I understand, the Japanese release is continuous. Bleach is similar also, adding in subtitles to the arcs ("The Substitute," etc). As the anime releases are not broken up (in the Encyclopedia) by seasons, because they are a single entity in Japan, I see no reason for Cardcaptor Sakura to be broken up, simply because Tokyopop arbitrarily decided to change the title of the second half. CCS is not Rayearth, where it is explicitly "I" and "II", in both the anime and the manga. This should especially be taken care of, soon, as there is already a note on the Cardcaptor Sakura manga page that notes that Tokyopop added the subtitle to 7-12, and the page lists 12 volumes. As GATSU pointed out, listing Master of the Clow as a sequel in the "related anime" makes it seem like there are 18 volumes (12 of CCS, 6 of MotC), even though the comment does list that it's 7-12 with the different title. As much as I disliked many of the things Tokyopop did, I do not feel that it was edited enough to warrant a separate entry, like some of our other discussions on here. |
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dormcat
Encyclopedia Editor
 Posts: 9902 Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan, ROC |
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Yeah, I know that CCS: Master of the Clow and Peach Girl: Change of Heart shouldn't exist in the first place, but merging them into respective "mother" entries isn't as simple as pressing a button (sigh). I'm willing to do so, but I can't promise a schedule at this moment before a "damage assessment" can be done first.
ADDENDUM: I just found that an user has added Sailor Moon Stars and Sailor Moon SuperS released by TokyoPop (duh!) under the main entry of Sailor Moon. Does anyone know how those correspond to the original Japanese tankōbun? Gawd I hate those unnecessary name changes. |
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Shiroi Hane
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 7580 Location: Wales |
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I have a couple of the original Tokyopop Sailor Moon manga somewhere if it helps.
The TV series was split into Stars and SuperS etc, but I don't know about the Manga off the top of my head. |
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Dessa
Posts: 4438 |
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The anime differentiated each of the 5 seasons. Sailormoon, Sailormoon R, Sailormoon S, Sailormoon SuperS, and Sailormoon Sailor Stars.
The manga had arcs, which roughly matched the seasons. Original arc (forgot if it had a name), Black Moon, Infinity, Dream, and Stars, IIRC. What TP did, was that since they released Dream and Stars as volumes while they were still printing the first 3 arcs in individual comic format, they had to give it a separate title, which is where the SuperS and Stars subtitles came from. The Japanese arcs did not have individual subtitles, nor do the Japanese or English re-releases. The Encyclopedia page holds all 18 volumes. |
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Shiroi Hane
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 7580 Location: Wales |
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..or just wait for an expert
I have volume one of SAILOR MOON, from "Chix Comix", and volume one of SAILOR MOON StarS from Tokyopop Manga, where "Rini" goes Back to the Future and "Bunny"'s boyfriend "Darien" goes to Harvard. |
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Dessa
Posts: 4438 |
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Hee... I was a huge SM fan, back when... Eventually, I want to get the new releases.
Since I'd missed dormcat's addendum the first time... English volume = Japanese Volume Sailor Moon 1-11 = Sailormoon 1-11 Sailor Moon SuperS 1-4 = Sailormoon 12-15 Sailor Moon Stars 1-3 = Sailormoon 16-18 So the only problem with the listing is that it's alphabetical, so Stars comes before SuperS, even though Stars comes after, story-wise. |
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dormcat
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 9902 Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan, ROC |
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In that case we have no problem.
I'd suggest Dan to have the release list sorted with date first, alphabetic or volume numbering second. Thoughts? |
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Dessa
Posts: 4438 |
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Alphabetical definitely last.
But I'm torn on if release date or volume number should be first. Pros for Release Date first: *Release date should give you the correct order of release. *Titles like Sailormoon, or titles that get re-released in omnibus form would have strange and not-entirely-accurate listings if it went by volume number (since the Sailormoon rerelease doesn't match the original, and omnibus are 2-in-1 or 3-in-1) Pros for Volume Number first: *Straight volume-to-volume rereleases would keep the same volume together (like CCS, where Tokyopop had two distinct releases for vols. 1-6). *Some series are released out-of-order. Such as Sailormoon. I'm not really sure that any way will work completely correctly, especially since you run into tons of problems with titles like Sailormoon, in which NONE of the 3 methods will correctly order the releases. Current Sailormoon Release List (Alphabetical, I believe) Sailor Moon (GN 1) 1998-04-30 (from $95.26) Sailor Moon (GN 1) 2011-09-13 (from $5.82) Sailor Moon (GN 2) 1998-12-24 (from $67.37) Sailor Moon (GN 2) 2011-11-15 (from $5.97) Sailor Moon (GN 3) 1999-04-01 (from $1.21) Sailor Moon (GN 3) 2012-01-17 (from $6.11) Sailor Moon (GN 4) 1999-07-01 (from $2.40) Sailor Moon (GN 4) 2012-03-13 (from $6.49) Sailor Moon (GN 5) 1999-10-31 (from $5.46) Sailor Moon (GN 5) 2012-05-01 (from $6.68) Sailor Moon (GN 6) 2000-02-01 Sailor Moon (GN 6) 2012-07-03 (from $6.76) Sailor Moon (GN 7) 2000-06-01 Sailor Moon (GN 7) 2012-09-11 (from $6.01) Sailor Moon (GN 8) 2000-12-05 (from $10.11) Sailor Moon (GN 8) 2012-11-13 (from $6.01) Sailor Moon (GN 9) 2001-04-17 (from $10.20) Sailor Moon (GN 9) 2013-01-29 (from $10.99) Sailor Moon (GN 10) 2001-07-10 (from $9.28) Sailor Moon (GN 11) 2001-10-15 (from $39.99) Sailor Moon Stars (GN 1) 2001-03-01 (from $15.78) Sailor Moon Stars (GN 2) 2001-06-01 (from $210.23) Sailor Moon Stars (GN 3) 2001-10-31 (from $34.08) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 1) 1999-03-01 (from $161.09) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 2) 1999-07-01 (from $5.28) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 3) 1999-12-01 (from $5.40) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 4) 2000-09-15 (from $4.27) Sailormoon Release List by Release Date Sailor Moon (GN 1) 1998-04-30 (from $95.26) Sailor Moon (GN 2) 1998-12-24 (from $67.37) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 1) 1999-03-01 (from $161.09) Sailor Moon (GN 3) 1999-04-01 (from $1.21) Sailor Moon (GN 4) 1999-07-01 (from $2.40) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 2) 1999-07-01 (from $5.28) Sailor Moon (GN 5) 1999-10-31 (from $5.46) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 3) 1999-12-01 (from $5.40) Sailor Moon (GN 6) 2000-02-01 Sailor Moon (GN 7) 2000-06-01 Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 4) 2000-09-15 (from $4.27) Sailor Moon (GN 8) 2000-12-05 (from $10.11) Sailor Moon Stars (GN 1) 2001-03-01 (from $15.78) Sailor Moon (GN 9) 2001-04-17 (from $10.20) Sailor Moon Stars (GN 2) 2001-06-01 (from $210.23) Sailor Moon (GN 10) 2001-07-10 (from $9.28) Sailor Moon (GN 11) 2001-10-15 (from $39.99) Sailor Moon Stars (GN 3) 2001-10-31 (from $34.08) Sailor Moon (GN 1) 2011-09-13 (from $5.82) Sailor Moon (GN 2) 2011-11-15 (from $5.97) Sailor Moon (GN 3) 2012-01-17 (from $6.11) Sailor Moon (GN 4) 2012-03-13 (from $6.49) Sailor Moon (GN 5) 2012-05-01 (from $6.68) Sailor Moon (GN 6) 2012-07-03 (from $6.76) Sailor Moon (GN 7) 2012-09-11 (from $6.01) Sailor Moon (GN 8) 2012-11-13 (from $6.01) Sailor Moon (GN 9) 2013-01-29 (from $10.99) (In other words, a total mess) Sailor Moon Release List by Volume Number Note: This assumes we can give SuperS and Stars precisions noting them as 12-15 and 16-18 Sailor Moon (GN 1) 1998-04-30 (from $95.26) Sailor Moon (GN 1) 2011-09-13 (from $5.82) Sailor Moon (GN 2) 1998-12-24 (from $67.37) Sailor Moon (GN 2) 2011-11-15 (from $5.97) Sailor Moon (GN 3) 1999-04-01 (from $1.21) Sailor Moon (GN 3) 2012-01-17 (from $6.11) Sailor Moon (GN 4) 1999-07-01 (from $2.40) Sailor Moon (GN 4) 2012-03-13 (from $6.49) Sailor Moon (GN 5) 1999-10-31 (from $5.46) Sailor Moon (GN 5) 2012-05-01 (from $6.68) Sailor Moon (GN 6) 2000-02-01 Sailor Moon (GN 6) 2012-07-03 (from $6.76) Sailor Moon (GN 7) 2000-06-01 Sailor Moon (GN 7) 2012-09-11 (from $6.01) Sailor Moon (GN 8) 2000-12-05 (from $10.11) Sailor Moon (GN 8) 2012-11-13 (from $6.01) Sailor Moon (GN 9) 2001-04-17 (from $10.20) Sailor Moon (GN 9) 2013-01-29 (from $10.99) Sailor Moon (GN 10) 2001-07-10 (from $9.28) Sailor Moon (GN 11) 2001-10-15 (from $39.99) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 1) 1999-03-01 (from $161.09) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 2) 1999-07-01 (from $5.28) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 3) 1999-12-01 (from $5.40) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 4) 2000-09-15 (from $4.27) Sailor Moon Stars (GN 1) 2001-03-01 (from $15.78) Sailor Moon Stars (GN 2) 2001-06-01 (from $210.23) Sailor Moon Stars (GN 3) 2001-10-31 (from $34.08) (Better, but it doesn't quite work, because the newer releases cover more than the original releases, and will finish with 12+1 volumes, which takes it through the content of Stars 3) Probably Most Optimal Sailor Moon Release List Sailor Moon (GN 1) 1998-04-30 (from $95.26) Sailor Moon (GN 2) 1998-12-24 (from $67.37) Sailor Moon (GN 3) 1999-04-01 (from $1.21) Sailor Moon (GN 4) 1999-07-01 (from $2.40) Sailor Moon (GN 5) 1999-10-31 (from $5.46) Sailor Moon (GN 6) 2000-02-01 Sailor Moon (GN 7) 2000-06-01 Sailor Moon (GN 8) 2000-12-05 (from $10.11) Sailor Moon (GN 9) 2001-04-17 (from $10.20) Sailor Moon (GN 10) 2001-07-10 (from $9.28) Sailor Moon (GN 11) 2001-10-15 (from $39.99) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 1) 1999-03-01 (from $161.09) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 2) 1999-07-01 (from $5.28) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 3) 1999-12-01 (from $5.40) Sailor Moon SuperS (GN 4) 2000-09-15 (from $4.27) Sailor Moon Stars (GN 1) 2001-03-01 (from $15.78) Sailor Moon Stars (GN 2) 2001-06-01 (from $210.23) Sailor Moon Stars (GN 3) 2001-10-31 (from $34.08) Sailor Moon (GN 1) (Revamp) 2011-09-13 (from $5.82) Sailor Moon (GN 2) (Revamp) 2011-11-15 (from $5.97) Sailor Moon (GN 3) (Revamp) 2012-01-17 (from $6.11) Sailor Moon (GN 4) (Revamp) 2012-03-13 (from $6.49) Sailor Moon (GN 5) (Revamp) 2012-05-01 (from $6.68) Sailor Moon (GN 6) (Revamp) 2012-07-03 (from $6.76) Sailor Moon (GN 7) (Revamp) 2012-09-11 (from $6.01) Sailor Moon (GN 8) (Revamp) 2012-11-13 (from $6.01) Sailor Moon (GN 9) (Revamp) 2013-01-29 (from $10.99) The only way I can think of to make the above work, is if a hidden "volume/ordering number" field were put into place. SuperS and Stars could have their Japanese volume numbers listed, and the revamp/rerelease could be (technically incorrectly) listed as "19-31", to get them to list underneath the others. This would help with series like the original subject of CCS, where the Masters of the Clow release could say 1-6, but have the hidden field list them as 7-12. I believe Yu-Gi-Oh! may have been released with some of the later stuff coming out concurrently with earlier stuff, too. Also, the rerelease/revamp should have a precision noted, to make sure that people realize that it's not a straight re-release, but that the volumes have different content/numbering (IIRC, by volume 3 or 4, none of the original volume's content is in there). |
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Shiroi Hane
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 7580 Location: Wales |
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Looking back at CCS issue, it seems that someone has already been adding MotC staff to the main entry, and I would have gone to the books rather than 'moving' stuff from one entry to another anyway.
I'll move the releases over because that is a simple fix, and change the volume numbers to 7-12 to make it clearer at a glance where they fit in. |
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