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How An Animator From Massachusetts Worked On Sword Art Online




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maximilianjenus



Joined: 29 Apr 2013
Posts: 2156
PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:04 pm Reply with quote
As a former mugen creator It's cool to see a former mugenboy 's post mugen career. Though in my experience is that anything anime or game related is unsustainable as they pay very litle money and ask you for a lot of hours.
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Ryuji-Dono



Joined: 26 Apr 2018
Posts: 196
PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 2:19 pm Reply with quote
maximilianjenus wrote:
As a former mugen creator It's cool to see a former mugenboy 's post mugen career. Though in my experience is that anything anime or game related is unsustainable as they pay very litle money and ask you for a lot of hours.


So, what are you a creator of now?
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maximilianjenus



Joined: 29 Apr 2013
Posts: 2156
PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2020 4:16 pm Reply with quote
Ryuji-Dono wrote:
maximilianjenus wrote:
As a former mugen creator It's cool to see a former mugenboy 's post mugen career. Though in my experience is that anything anime or game related is unsustainable as they pay very litle money and ask you for a lot of hours.


So, what are you a creator of now?


Computer software in general,I dabled a bit into game creation but it was a full time job, so I went back to business software after wrecking my economy for 3 years. I am considering oging back to game creation as a weekend warrior just to make a few dollards back from the half finished stuff I got.
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invalidname
Get off my lawn!Get off my lawn!


Joined: 11 Aug 2004
Posts: 2022
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2020 5:05 am Reply with quote
Nice job on River City Girls, Kay. The opening movie and animated cut scenes are super fun.
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pikkuhukka



Joined: 18 Apr 2016
Posts: 69
PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2020 5:22 am Reply with quote
didn't know the dude of canipa project wrote this, but i did read it "in his voice" lol

what a small world it is
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Hiroki not Takuya



Joined: 17 Apr 2012
Posts: 1456
PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2020 12:39 pm Reply with quote
Mr. May (Canipa Effect) is no stranger to ANN and he was interviewed (again) a week or so ago. Wouldn't be surprised if he and ANN were considering a part-time gig and it seems would be a good fit with his connections (which ANN needs BTW)...
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relyat08



Joined: 20 Mar 2013
Posts: 4124
Location: Northern Virginia
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2020 9:57 am Reply with quote
Great article. Good to see more content about this issue and the impossible balance these guys are trying make between life and work. I wish there was a more obvious answer to fix this issue. The industry will either kill or scare them all away before changing though, based on how things seem to be going...
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#905816



Joined: 11 Mar 2020
Posts: 3
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2020 2:01 pm Reply with quote
relyat08 wrote:
The industry will either kill or scare them all away before changing though, based on how things seem to be going...


An unappealing and high barrier of entry results in only serious people who love animation will take the job and stick with it. So you don't get as many shovelware shows like you do here in the west.
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dragon695



Joined: 28 Nov 2008
Posts: 1342
Location: Clemson, SC
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2020 3:58 pm Reply with quote
#905816 wrote:
relyat08 wrote:
The industry will either kill or scare them all away before changing though, based on how things seem to be going...


An unappealing and high barrier of entry results in only serious people who love animation will take the job and stick with it. So you don't get as many shovelware shows like you do here in the west.


It’s not sustainable, though. We are already seeing more anime shovelware with mobile phone games/idol getting anime adaptations left and right. The result is production values that are grossly inconsistent across projects and multiple series getting delayed each year (practically unheard of 10 years ago). Corona virus is only exacerbating a broken production pipeline. That is: fewer people are working on more projects today than at anytime in the past.
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relyat08



Joined: 20 Mar 2013
Posts: 4124
Location: Northern Virginia
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2020 7:54 pm Reply with quote
#905816 wrote:
relyat08 wrote:
The industry will either kill or scare them all away before changing though, based on how things seem to be going...


An unappealing and high barrier of entry results in only serious people who love animation will take the job and stick with it. So you don't get as many shovelware shows like you do here in the west.


I don't think unlivable pay and, frankly, employee abuse, have any sort of positive effect on the quality of the shows, to be honest. The people and companies who actually make the most money off of these artists don't care any more about good writing and good animation than they need to. They want a product to sell just as any media company does. And the artists themselves are certainly not doing better work because they are being paid so little. In any case, it's time to stop defending treating people like sh*t for any reason. Especially because of a perception that it makes cartoons better. That's super messed up.
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kotomikun



Joined: 06 May 2013
Posts: 831
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2020 7:55 pm Reply with quote
More to the point, people shouldn't be punished for doing what they love. The "barrier of entry" in anime and many other industries is the ability to work long hours for low (or no) wages, which has less to do with talent and more to do with personal wealth, health, and able-bodiedness. The animators don't get to decide what projects get produced, anyway.

Instead of trying to make life difficult for the small minority with "fun" jobs, we'd all be better off if we tried to make life easier for everyone, and expand opportunities for people to work on things they enjoy. And there'd be more good anime, too.
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AkumaChef



Joined: 10 Jan 2019
Posts: 551
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2020 8:40 am Reply with quote
I'm glad that this article puts some more light on the state of the industry at the moment.

That said, I also feel the title was a little clickbaity. The description on ANN's frontpage reads:
Quote:
"An animator from the US worked on one of the biggest anime of 2019 - but the toll on his health and personal life was deep"


This implies that the mere act of working in the anime industry took a toll on his health. However, after reading the article it becomes clear that Kay's experience with the anime industry itself wasn't particularly onerous and instead the real problem in this case came from Kay trying to work two jobs at the same time--something that would be challenging for anyone in any field, even one totally unrelated to anime.
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Horsefellow



Joined: 01 Jan 2020
Posts: 48
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2020 11:53 am Reply with quote
kotomikun wrote:
Instead of trying to make life difficult for the small minority with "fun" jobs, we'd all be better off if we tried to make life easier for everyone, and expand opportunities for people to work on things they enjoy. And there'd be more good anime, too.


How do you know it'd make more 'good' anime? That seems like an unfounded assertion.

It's easy to say to make the industry better and pay people more, but it's hard to actually do. To pay animators more means higher production cost, which means anime needs to make more money to be profitable, which means it'll cost a lot more or it'll have to sell more at the same price which is going to mean more shows fail. Less hours for the animators means anime comes out more slowly, with less episodes, and fewer shows every year. In turn that would ironically lead to just more of those mobage, idol, light novel, and manga adaptions people are always complaining about only being made because they'll stick with established works that have built in fanbases rather than risking any original anime being made.
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dragon695



Joined: 28 Nov 2008
Posts: 1342
Location: Clemson, SC
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2020 10:14 pm Reply with quote
Horsefellow wrote:
kotomikun wrote:
Instead of trying to make life difficult for the small minority with "fun" jobs, we'd all be better off if we tried to make life easier for everyone, and expand opportunities for people to work on things they enjoy. And there'd be more good anime, too.


How do you know it'd make more 'good' anime? That seems like an unfounded assertion.

It's easy to say to make the industry better and pay people more, but it's hard to actually do. To pay animators more means higher production cost, which means anime needs to make more money to be profitable, which means it'll cost a lot more or it'll have to sell more at the same price which is going to mean more shows fail. Less hours for the animators means anime comes out more slowly, with less episodes, and fewer shows every year. In turn that would ironically lead to just more of those mobage, idol, light novel, and manga adaptions people are always complaining about only being made because they'll stick with established works that have built in fanbases rather than risking any original anime being made.


For how many more years will home video still be relevant? At some point it will only be the most hard core of the hard core who will still want it. How much does streaming actually pay? Does it pay a one-time license fee or is fractional pennies per view? I’ve always been skeptical that streaming rights can make up for the obvious decline in home video sales.

Here’s the problem with studios sticking to adaptations: it is low risk with very low reward. At best, they are offered a marginal stake on the production committee and see a percentage of the revenue stream. At worst, they do work for hire and get a one time fee. Playing it safe is not going to be profitable in the long run. That is why original IPs will continue to exist. KyoAni flourished because it moved away from mostly adaptations to mostly in-house IP. This is common sense.
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