Forum - View topicShirow Shiratori, Author of The Ryuo's Work is Never Done!
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amc9988
Posts: 52 |
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ANN reviewers always make a big deal out of any form of fan service, be it a minor or implied one, Just look at Franxx, they complain about anything that they can, about stupid representation or sex jokes even though it barely there and just a minor thing in the anime.
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relyat08
 Posts: 4125 Location: Northern Virginia |
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The audience votes on what is reviewed, not the reviewers. The real reason this isn't getting reviewed is because not enough of the audience cared about it. |
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zrnzle500
 Posts: 3767 |
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I was surprised to learn that Ryuo was written by the same guy that did No-Rin. I didn't initially pick up the latter while it was airing, but after hearing good things about it I gave it a try and enjoyed it very much, so that does give me some more hope in how this will turn out.
I don't really understand why some find it odd or improper for reviewers - and other viewers for that matter - to think that the sexualization of children - specifically 9 year olds - either generally or particularly, is distasteful, at the very least to them personally. You are free to disagree with their opinion on the matter, but why you need to act as if that is not a valid concern is beyond me. If the lolicon content were truly minor and tastefully presented, and if the plot had been more compelling, at least in the first episode, I don't think that would have prevented the show from being well regarded by critics, as Made in Abyss was last year by both critics and viewers. In terms of nudity, yes, the subsequent episodes do not have that sort of loli fanservice, but can anyone tell me with a straight face that they are not playing to such interests in other ways, such as the "bride" scene mentioned? The plot has interested me more after the first episode, but not to the point of understanding why it was so highly ranked among light novels of recent years, and there remain elements that leave me uneasy while I continue watching it, let alone recommending those put off by the first episode that the strength of the plot outweighs such concerns. Frankly, I'd say 青白 is correct in saying those complaining about the reviewers reactions to the show wouldn't want a review from them anyhow. I suspect many fans of the show thought so too and voted accordingly. |
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harminia
 Posts: 2012 Location: australia |
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I wonder that too. Like it's entirely possible he's being sexist, but based on the other information he provided it does make me think they just aren't supported in shogi, whereas males are. They don't have the opportunities to improve and master it that males do? I like that he reads incest manga but for the light novel-focused story, not the content.... Like reading playboy for the articles eh |
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Emdykay
 Posts: 85 |
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Of course it is systemic that there are very few or rather no females at the top of shogi (and many other facets of life). From lack of support, deliberate displacement to different expectations, there are a multitude of reasons this happens. That does not make the statement he did in any way excusable. The context of the statement was wether child geniuses in shogi are realitstic, he says in general yes, but not for girls. The man felt the need to point out that due to her sex her portayal would be unrealistic, without any kind of additional information in that regard. There is no further explanation as to why, such as "because they rarely receive this kind of support", much less any kind of sign that he disapproves of that situation. Just the short addendum, girls do not perform as well as boys. Anyone with a little bit of common sense who is aware and concerned about this kind of sexism would not have let this sentence just be there as it is, at the very least you should know how people would interpret it... He still did. Says everything. |
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BalmungHHQ
Posts: 399 |
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I think the way you're reading what he said is way off base. If you actually look at what he said, with consideration of the state of the shogi world in mind, I think the most natural interpretation of what he said is this:
Here he starts by saying that MAYBE it's not realistic for a girl player, indicating that the possibility exists that it may be unrealistic. (Likely because he's had criticisms like that before in regards to this story.) He's not saying it definitively, like you implied.
He then turns the topic around by saying that "there are" boy players who can master shogi quickly, within a few months, much like how he wrote Ai. The fact that he says "there are" means there's probably a record of some children in real life mastering shogi that quickly. (and those players have likely all been boys) This is clearly a point he added to emphasize the idea that "Maybe it's unrealistic for a girl player (since none have ever done it in real life) but there exist boy players who have. (so why can't a girl player do the same?)" Because of how the world of shogi is structured, it's common to think of boy players and girl players individually as two separate things within the greater world of shogi. (Remember, the entire Woman's League exists as something separate from professional shogi players. And there has not yet been a single female professional shogi player) So fragmented thinking based on gender isn't uncommon. But if he truly believed it were "unrealistic" due to one's sex alone, then I can't possibly imagine him writing such amazing, determined, female shogi players in his novels like Ginko, Keika, and even Ai. The novels are amazingly in-depth and accurate in exploring the world of shogi and many of the most amazing characters are the strong female characters who are defying all odds, and becoming the best in their own ways. Ginko is a female titleholder who is very much on her way to becoming pro (even though no professional female shogi players exist), and with the way Ai's being written thus far, I'm willing to bet once she's older, by the end of the story, she'll become a pro as well. The idea that someone who writes great female characters accomplishing great things like that could be 'sexist' is laughable, but more frustrating when you try to twist his words the way you did, when you have a total lack of understanding of the world of shogi or his writing. |
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Frog-kun
ANN Reviewer
 Posts: 118 |
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As the person who interviewed Shiratori-sensei, I'd like to address a few misconceptions in this thread.
I don't believe he's sexist just for saying that there are no female pros or that Ai's growth is unusual for a girl. When you ignore the sexualising aspect of the female characters in the novels, his portrayal of female shogi players is very impressive. They all have their own aspirations and different levels of skill. In the novels, Shiratori actually does address the systemic sexism in the shogi world. For example, he notes that kids don't like getting tutored by female players because they get unfairly perceived as weaker. Girls perceive other girls as weak, which means they also tend to lose confidence in their own skills when beaten by another girl. Although Shiratori doesn't offer direct answers for why this perception issue exist, he doesn't seem to believe that there's a reductive biological explanation, because a character goes out of his way to say that since it's a mental game, men and women should be equal. For people who are interesting in reading more about this topic, you might want to look up the issues of sexism in professional chess, as that game has similar problems, and there are professional women players who have spoken up vocally about it. Also, as a few other people in this thread have mentioned, the reason the anime didn't get reviewed is simply because not enough ANN readers voted for it. Don't put this on the reviewers. Heck, had it gotten enough votes, I would have volunteered to cover it, since I've read the first three volumes of the light novel and I probably like the series more than anyone else on the team. |
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Emdykay
Posts: 85 |
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Well if indeed the novels go indepth about the issue I retract my statement and apologize, although I still think it is awfully weird for the statement there without context, regardless of japanese coloquial customs^^
I do not see how I was twisting any words though. Not giving a definitive statement and going for vagues, in this case the "maybe", is not unusual for a japanese speaker. And assuming he does mean it you can easily read the "although there are boy players who can"as implying that the statement would not be unrealistic in the case of a boy, thus, rather than any turning the issue around, indicating he wants to point out the difference here. How this has anything to due with my presumed lack of understanding of shogi is beyond me, as I never criticized his portrayal of the current state of shogi, nor his statement about the absence of professional female players, considering it is simple truth. Do I lack understanding of his works? Yup, have not read or seen them. This interview though is accessible even if you did not, which is why I indicated that I find it hard to believe someone would say something so ambiguous who is well aware of the issue. And seeing as I sure was not the only one getting the wrong impression it has to remain that this sentence was horribly clumsy and not very well thought out. Last but not least I personally do not mind being wrong here, I rather call someone or something out wrongly, and have a discussion about it, than just sit there doing nothing because I might actually step on someones toe. |
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Kamieichi
 Posts: 54 |
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Well I'm sure someday in the future first female shogi player who get 4th Dan and become pro will appear. In the Ryuou's world Ginko's 2nd Dan is the highest, but in real life there are currently two female players whose rank is 3rd Dan. Only top two among 3rd Dan players can be promoted to 4th Dan and become pro, so it's not easy, but yeah someday.
How about having an interview with her, ANN? The first and only non-Japanese shogi player. She got interested in shogi because she saw it in Naruto, so you can somewhat make it anime/manga related article. And you can ask the questions about the pro shogi world popped up in this thread. Personally I'd like to know her thought on Ryuou and 3-gatsu no lion if she watches them. |
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Yttrbio
 Posts: 3653 |
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Emdykay
Posts: 85 |
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Right, because the ability to admit to having made a mistake and apologizing after being presented with clearing up information is a sign of lacking moral integrity and thus sexism debates should not be taken seriously. Interesting interpretation, I will always carry that wisodm with me. Considering people took this seriously enough to argue, including the interviewer to chime in and correct things, I guess this was fine enough... |
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Yttrbio
Posts: 3653 |
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Except you then said you didn't mind making the mistake. That means your apology was complete B.S. And yes, if you would slander a stranger without regret because it serves a purpose you value, that means you lack moral integrity.
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Crext
 Posts: 211 |
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I like this show for some reason. I know next to nothing about shogi, and I kinda feel it's a "chess anime" as the same elements apply. It's really weird, but I like how it's a battle of the minds, and how "expressional" all the characters becomes. They're really good at drawing cute characters too, so that's a bonus and the art all around is gorgeous.
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Blanchimont
 Posts: 3461 Location: Finland |
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Perhaps it pays to consider this in relation to chess. There is a world chess championship(obviously), and also one separately for women as well. To answer, yes, women DO take part in the regular championship as well. The best ranking achieved so far? Judit Polgar, 8th, in the San Louis double round-robin world championship tournament in 2005. So the situation there isn't that much different from what we are discussing here... |
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Emdykay
Posts: 85 |
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I have no idea how someone could infer this meaning to what I wrote, I kind of wanted to let this rest, as this whole discussion is so absurd I can´t believe it to go anywhere, but this is just bugging me. I saw a statement that seemed awful, without context admittedly, pointing out the problematic nature of it, as I am not a person who can just sit idly while shitty things happen in front of me, explaining how I came to the conclusion and why I thought it was problematic, that has nothing to with slander. Yes, I sure was cynical and going overboard, especially in my first comment by not elaborating and judging the man by simply being presumptuous, which I in fact do regret. I jumped the gun too quickly with too little information and I was wrong, that is why I took that statement back and apologized for my behaviour. And because I said that I don´t mind admitting to my mistakes and taking responsibility by apologizing you are accusing me now of deliberately spreading lies about someone to further my agenda. The heck. That this is what makes my apology hollow. Where is the logic in that? I don´t mind that I´m wrong does´t mean I don´t care wether I am wrong or right in my statements. It means I can accept being wrong and owning up to my mistakes, even if I am not afraid of making them. No I am not afraid of being wrong at times, I´ll take the blame in those cases, just like now, thus I will again bring it up whenever I see something that does not sit right with me and I would assume that I have every right to do that, without being accused of being an awful person, because you don´t like what I´m saying. Just look where this has come and what could have happened if I didn´t say anything. I was not the only one posting this interpretation of his words, so we can assume there might be more people out there who read the interview and thought the same, not pointing it out or questioning it. If I, among the others, did not bring the topic up, this probably would have never been adressed and there could be people out there wrongfully thinking that Shiratori is a sexist ass, but it was cleared up, we just established here for everyone to see that he is not. Fairly productive and positive result I would argue. And due to that I am fully ok with being the only "looser" in this round, because this was good anyway. So explain to me how prefering to bring those things up and discuss them is awful?
That would be absolutely awesome btw. |
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