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Cetais
Joined: 02 Feb 2012
Posts: 507
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 Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 8:13 am
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... People on this thread seems to be missing the fact that it's not only the the tweets the problem; it's also the content of the novel itself.
Also, as a white people, I don't get how people can just excuse racism like that. It doesn't even touch me, and yet I couldn't excuse something like that.
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青白
Joined: 30 May 2012
Posts: 184
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 8:46 am
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Edited out some content that was little more than insults. --willag
| G S Palmer wrote: |
| MoonPhase1 wrote: | | That’s the way life works right now. All it takes is 1 person doing something stupid and everyone gets involved instead of just punishing the dumb person and letting us who did not post the dumb Tweet buy the series. |
How do you propose "punishing" them other than by cancelling their series, which apparently contains the very material they're in trouble for? Lecturing them?
I am sorry for the people who enjoyed this series, but some of the people here need to take a step back and decide whether the author is really worth defending. |
It doesn't take a genius to think of ways to "punish" somebody without resorting to cancelling a massively popular product that somebody spent years of effort building and the author of which has already apologized and fixed his mistakes. What the public is doing now is akin to giving somebody a death sentence for being a racist when they have already made the point to him that he is a racist and that he needs to fix his worldview (which he did).
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wewhomustnotbenamed
Joined: 01 Jun 2018
Posts: 50
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 9:14 am
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people tend to forgot it's not always about "muh feelings" or "free speach" or "creativity" bullshitery... it mainly about money, that is chinese/korean market... company doesn't want to get affiliated with someone who offended their market.... it's not even special to racism in any way... it is that simple... author is dumb and deserved for it stupidity.... tho i don't agree for him to get jailed, but what happened soo far is just damage saving from the company who don't want to involved, not actual punishment, which is fair....
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BlueOla
Joined: 08 Feb 2016
Posts: 161
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 10:08 am
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| 青白 wrote: | |
It doesn't take a genius to think of ways to "punish" somebody without resorting to cancelling a massively popular product that somebody spent years of effort building and the author of which has already apologized and fixed his mistakes. What the public is doing now is akin to giving somebody a death sentence for being a racist when they have already made the point to him that he is a racist and that he needs to fix his worldview (which he did). |
I mean it's unfortunate that his old tweets came back to bite him in the ass right when he had like 20 volumes published and an anime in the making ,and that sometimes throwing some spit and an apology won't fix some mistakes, but let's make some things clear:
Firstly, it was NOT a massively popular product - if it was, they wouldn't have cancelled it. Why do you think Rurouni Kenshin is still going, despite the fact that the author is a confirmed, convicted pedophile? Because his manga sells. And while I'm sure that this guy put a lot of time and effort to write his novels, they were isekai after all, and sadly, from a practical point of view, these can be almost immediately replaced with a convincing dupe, they're all similar anyway.
And finally, "giving somebody a death sentence for being a racist" is a MASSIVE exaggeration. The guy works under a pen-name and his face was never made public. All he needs to do is find a new pen-name and just write a new light novel under that. Boom! Problem solved! They could have done something much worse to him, and while the cancellation of his work is unfortunate, he is by no means dying and he can still continue his writing career under a different name.
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青白
Joined: 30 May 2012
Posts: 184
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 11:05 am
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| BlueOla wrote: |
| 青白 wrote: | |
It doesn't take a genius to think of ways to "punish" somebody without resorting to cancelling a massively popular product that somebody spent years of effort building and the author of which has already apologized and fixed his mistakes. What the public is doing now is akin to giving somebody a death sentence for being a racist when they have already made the point to him that he is a racist and that he needs to fix his worldview (which he did). |
He is by no means dying and he can still continue his writing career under a different name. |
Apologies for my bad writing skill, but I was actually making the death sentence metaphor for the novel. There is probably nothing that can be done to revive the novel's reputation after all that has been happening lately, that is akin to the novel getting the death penalty. What is frustrating to me is that people can't seem to distinguish between the difference between the novel and the author, and compounded is that the author genuinely spent a long period of time making the novel successful, only to be axed for some immature things he said ages ago that more than likely no longer characterizes who the author is as a person.
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LastPage 3
Joined: 13 Jun 2010
Posts: 193
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 12:21 pm
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| louis6578 wrote: | | As a half-black, Jewish member of society, I have to say... I really don't care how racist an author is. If their work is good, let them continue making it. It should be up to the consumer whether or not the discriminatory behavior should impact their decision to read the person's novel or manga. I don't like companies making that decision for me. |
Nobody is stopping the author from writing anything. Hobby Japan and J-Novel have simply decided they want nothing to do with him, as is their right.
If people want to read his stuff so badly, they can pay him to write for them directly.
| 青白 wrote: | |
What is frustrating to me is that people can't seem to distinguish between the difference between the novel and the author, and compounded is that the author genuinely spent a long period of time making the novel successful, only to be axed for some immature things he said ages ago that more than likely no longer characterizes who the author is as a person. |
The author wrote the novel, it's perfectly normal for the author's personality and actions to determine whether businesses want to do business with him. In this case, they don't.
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psiho66
Joined: 09 Feb 2016
Posts: 23
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 1:03 pm
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Well I can see why the Anime was canceled, because China is the biggest Anime market outside of Japan and they wouldn't want to piss them off with the Anime adaptation. But the suspension of the Light Novel by the original publisher with 20 vol. already released is kinda dumb, tho its probably a decision by the publisher (maybe even the author himself) so that they can wait for the outrage to die out and continue the series, because there isn't a logical reason for the Light Novel to get axed because China got their feelings hurt, the Anime sure but not the Light Novel, it will probably continue in a couple of months or even a year when the outrage has died down. That being said J-Novel Club Suspending sales and publication is also as dumb tho with only 3 vol. translated its not as bad and just like Hobby Japan they will probably continue in months time after the outrage has died down and even if they don't another company will most likely take the license and continue to translated it.
What is worrying is the message these 2 suspensions sends, that if a group doesn't like a manga, Anime Light Novel ect. if they cry enough the company will stop the creation of said property, Imagine companies in Japan accepting the complaints and demands of crazy PC person who cares about social justice nutjobs that are plaguing the west ,because they are harassing the company and the creator enough, I hope this never happens, but its a scary thought.
Last edited by psiho66 on Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:14 am; edited 1 time in total
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GrayArchon
Joined: 28 Feb 2011
Posts: 393
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 1:24 pm
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| Kruszer wrote: | Even the English translation now? This is some of the dumbest over-reactionary bulls*** I've seen and potentially sets a dangerous precedent for smothering creativity.  |
This isn't an over reaction on the English publisher's part, it's a necessary move. Depending on what the Japanese publisher does, the English publisher could lose the rights to publish the series. As it stands they were barely able to get volume 3 published to honor pre-orders and avoid being penalized by Amazon or other ebook sellers. They can't promise anything beyond that as if the Japanese publisher pulls the rights at the wrong time they could take a serious financial hit. That they're apparently going to suspend publication of what they've already released probably is something that the Japanese publisher wants, and JNC has to maintain good relations with them. The July 1st date probably represents a compromise between what the Japanese publisher wants(the series suspended now), and the soonest that JNC can pull the series from Amazon and other stores without incurring significant penalty.
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BadNewsBlues
Joined: 21 Sep 2014
Posts: 6030
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 2:21 pm
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| Chrono1000 wrote: | | I am skeptical of the growing concern over wrongthink but just from an economic perspective this makes sense since the Japanese publisher had cancelled the series. The problem of course that as the demonization of men grows worse with every passing year |
The gender of the author had nothing to do with this though and the demonization of men is no worse than the disregard or disrespect of women that's still a pretty big problems in various cultures. Now the demonization of transgendered and homosexual men on the other hand is problem but then the author in this incident was neither.
| Chrono1000 wrote: | |
we all know that eventually ecchi content will start to fall into the realm of wrongthink. |
When they start to reach levels of stupid like Eiken them it'll.be a problem.
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Stuart Smith
Joined: 13 Jan 2013
Posts: 1298
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 5:05 pm
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| Chrono1000 wrote: | | The problem of course that as the demonization of men grows worse with every passing year we all know that eventually ecchi content will start to fall into the realm of wrongthink. It is not a matter of if but only a matter of when before we start to see the censorship of light novels due to content. |
Americans and Europeans have been trying to influence and censor Japanese products for decades. It has never worked because Japan doesn't care about what they find offensive or problematic. The only thing westerners can do is censor the localization like with 4Kids and Funimation, or outright cancel it like how people got Kodomo no Jikan's American release pulled. But the series still went on in Japan just fine. When Kotaku tried to shame a Japanese game company for making porn games, the Japanese response was to simply block western IPs from accessing their store. When the BBC attempted to write a hit piece on the character designer of Girls und Panzer for being a pedophile and asked why doesn't Japan be more like the UK and help prevent sexual deviancy through media, he basically straight up told them that Japan has less sexual assault than UK does, so maybe they should be emulating Japan instead and worrying about their own problems like poverty and migrants. That didn't result in a huge controversial issue because a Japanese industry person insulting the UK, because the UK market is largely irrelevant, and there's not really any UK people living in Japan like there are Chinese. There was the director of Netjuu who some American sites called out for his tweets that were seen as being anti-Jewish, but he still finds work just fine. Again, there are maybe a few hundred Jewish people in Japan at best, so they're not going to really care about that very much.
The fact China is able to do something neither America no Europe could says a lot of how much Japan values the Chinese market over America and Europe. And luckily for us, China has no problem with sexual content, just content that may be perceived as a slight against them.
-Stuart Smith
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Crisha
Moderator
Joined: 21 Apr 2010
Posts: 4290
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 5:41 pm
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Did a little bit of thread clean-up of some insults.
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Polycell
Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 4623
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 6:27 pm
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Do we know exactly when the last tweet of this kind was? Five years is an awful long time; a dramatic change in his outlook in that period is far from unlikely.
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Iron Maw
Joined: 29 May 2008
Posts: 492
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 7:35 pm
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| louis6578 wrote: | | As a half-black, Jewish member of society, I have to say... I really don't care how racist an author is. If their work is good, let them continue making it. It should be up to the consumer whether or not the discriminatory behavior should impact their decision to read the person's novel or manga. I don't like companies making that decision for me. |
Putting aside the issue of race, it was company's decision to publish this guy at all inf the first place, and it within they rights to get rid of him if they want. Especially if it concerns their potential and future audiences. So even on a practical level they don't want to be associated with someone that has much amount of baggage.
| psiho66 wrote: | | What is worrying is the message these 2 suspensions sends, that if a group doesn't like a manga, Anime Light Novel ect. if they cry enough the company will stop the creation of said property, Imagine companies in Japan accepting the complaints and demands of crazy PC Shonen Jump Weekly's nutjobs that are plaguing the west ,because they are harassing the company and the creator enough, I hope this never happens, but its a scary thought. |
Oh for christssake. No this won't happen. There no way anyone go this far to put this kind of pressure for something as petty as "not liking something". You can't kind of outcry some random person opinion. The reason became a big as did was entirely because of author's racist statements and elements of his work that exemplified them. In other words personal and emotional context that grounded in history allow this kind of thing to happen. It's far cry from anyone say caring about whether you have a gay character in your work ir not. There are certain boundaries shouldn't be crossed for entertainment in a work unless it plans to deal with the subject in a serious and non-offensive manner.
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#TheGreatestP4P
Joined: 13 Feb 2018
Posts: 70
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 8:30 pm
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People already described the mc to be against killing civies and pows in the story. the mc is seen as a noble guy and had nothing to do with najing. seriously even the hints in the manga already show the character is based off a noble japanese. people i've seen in these threads always say,"hur dur novel inspired." when they never read the novel and in complete stupidity don't see how nanjing isn't even in the story. Now the guy being racists can also be being young and stupid. And let's not lie we all you used be racists when you were young.
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CurseTheSky
Joined: 21 Nov 2015
Posts: 236
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Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2018 9:27 pm
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| Iron Maw wrote: |
| psiho66 wrote: | | What is worrying is the message these 2 suspensions sends, that if a group doesn't like a manga, Anime Light Novel ect. if they cry enough the company will stop the creation of said property, Imagine companies in Japan accepting the complaints and demands of crazy PC Shonen Jump Weekly's nutjobs that are plaguing the west ,because they are harassing the company and the creator enough, I hope this never happens, but its a scary thought. |
Oh for christssake. No this won't happen. There no way anyone go this far to put this kind of pressure for something as petty as "not liking something". You can't kind of outcry some random person opinion. |
How much you want to bet?
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