Forum - View topicFruits Basket (see 2nd post for thread info)
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Ashen Phoenix
 Posts: 2912 |
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I got and read my vol. 22 a few weeks ago, so perhaps we can talk about it here (with loads of spoiler tags) or in private msg? I'd love to discuss it. |
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fighterholic
Posts: 9193 |
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Don't worry Psycho. There's no necroposting with this thread. I've had my copy for a while, I was thinking of going ahead and starting off the conversation but if you want to you are more than welcome to kick start us off.
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LydiaDianne
 Posts: 5633 Location: Southern California |
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I've got mine and I'm ready and waiting.
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suna_suna
 Posts: 550 Location: Ohio |
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yes i do have mine. and thank you for the necropost. i'd post some toughts now but i need to go to sleep
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar  Posts: 16935 |
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Think I'll grab some sleep. I'll at least post my thoughts on the volume tomorrow during the since I'm off. That way I can skim it and refresh my memory too lol.
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JacobC
ANN Contributor
 Posts: 3728 Location: SoCal |
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Right-O! I'll be happy to jump in when y'all are!
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aya_honda
 Posts: 920 Location: Around here |
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I hope that you don't mind if I start this discussion in advance because it seems like we are always ready to dicuss this volume but we never actually do start to discuss it so I just decided that I will post some of my thoughts on this volume. WARNING: spoilers for volume 22 (in case that someone doesn't want to be spoiled). 
I think that the first thing which impressed me so much in this volume was the encounter between Kyo and spoiler[his father.] I mean, we all agreed many times that Kyo has about the crapiest parents in the manga, but I think that this encounter shades a totally different light on the events and perhaps enlightens us a bit more on spoiler[ what Kyo's mother had to endure as well. She must have been very lonely, married to such a man, a thing that Kyo understands from the very beginning. She was left all alone after Kyo was born because firstly it was a shame to bring onto this world, the cat or the monster and then she finds herself completely alone wiith her husband deciding that it was better to just yell at her and wishing for her and their son's disappearence rather than support her. It must have been really tough for Kyo to comprehend that and I think that to a certain extent he has forgiven his mother for letting him all alone. ] What also impressed me about this confrontation was the fact that even now, after so many years have passed and after he had such a deep involvement in the curse matter, spoiler[ Kyo's father still considers his son guilty for his wife's suicide denying that he had any blame in it. Even more, he tends to get abrsurd when he starts yelling that his son is trying to kill him, even when Kyo proves him over and over again that all he wanted to do was talk and perhaps settle the things between the two of them. ] I get annoyed everytime I read these scenes because the whole thing is about redemption and forgiveness and how can these two can hold you down, stop you from progressing if you don't obtain them or if you don't give them. While Kyo realizes that it's time to spoiler[ to move on, to live freely as much as he can with Tohru and enjoy every chance that life's got to offer him, his father is still stuck in the past, unable to progress, unable to live to the maximum, trying to constantly shift guilt to other people, especially to his son when we all know that in the end all he does is running from his own guilty conscience. Perhaps this is also a reason why he doesn't want to forgive his son: admiting that Kyo's fault wasn't that big and moreover forgiving him, he also has to face what he has done, what he has said in the past and that would force him to admit his own guilt and who is the one to do this without fighting against it?] But I loved Kyo's courage. spoiler[ To face what you fear the most and even more to find the courage to understand that this will take time and understanding and therefore he would have to come back to his father - it truly shows that Kyo has matured and that he is also capable to find his own way from now on.] Related to this confrontation that seems to be "epic", it's also the scene when Akito spoiler[ decides that it's time to destroy the nekotsuki's room, thus getting away from the past and also moving on just like Kyo tries to do. I loved her confrontatio with the old maid, who tells her that she liked Akito better before, while Akito tells her that she wants to move on and stop living in the past. Of course, on the bright side of the things, I have to admit that what she has done was a brave thing to do taking into consideration that she breaks the Sohma's traditions.] On a lighter tone, I always love to see the faces that Kyo does everytime that he sees spoiler[ Hanajima next to Kazuma and her interest in the older man. His reactions towards her are priceless. ] 
But of course the reason why I love this volume so much and why I will sound like a squeeing fan girl  in the next couple of lines would be because finally, after 21 volumes and constant hoping that things will go in this direction, I finally get to see spoiler[ Kyo and Tohru being together. I loved how she ran away from him at first but I would get anxious and just hoping that he would catch up with her quickly. Because above all, I wanted to see how Kyo understood that sometimes life doesn't offer an other chance but he was lucky enough to get it. Plus there's a certain tenderness in their story that seems to have been here all along. I loved Thoru's way of seeing the things so simple and her unconditional love or Kyo, a love which struggled through many troubles and which has succeeded in giving him another chance. ] This is something I definitely want to talk about later.
And talking about being honest to oneself and admit everything, I was surprised somehow by Yuki's decision spoiler[ to tell Machi the truth, although I knew that a time like that was to come sooner or later. - By the way, it was the only time when I actually felt annoyed with Kim and wished she minded her own bussiness somewhere else.  ]
Another character which must understand better than anyone the desire to move and start over is definitely spoiler[ Kureno. After being stabbed by Akito, I personally had the worst fears. But I enjoyed how Takaya Natsuki managed to pull off these scenes related to him and to Arisa, who reacts in a very unexpected manner, by crying. I think she hated that she hasn't be involved in Kureno's life so much, that her casaul meetings with him didn't necessarily give her the chance to find out more about himself and especially to claim him. But she is also very matured and she is the person that Kureno needs the most. Because she is the only person in the world that loves him for what he truly is, and not for what she would like him to be or for not feeling lonely. ] There are many things to be discussed about this volume and I can't wait for it. Ok, I left two important things left out: spoiler[ The breaking of the curse and the true story of the zodiac ] I am not good at initiating discussions so hopefully someone of you will decide to continue this. 
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LydiaDianne
Posts: 5633 Location: Southern California |
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I know that I have made it very obvious that I have hated, loathed and desipised Akito...but these last few volumes have made me change my mind. Akito is spoiler[a scared little girl who was messed up in the head by old "well-meaning" (**sneer**) adults.]
I forgive Akito. Period. The parts of this volume that made me cry was when Akito spoiler[not only freed the other members of the Zodiac who had not yet freed themselves but freed herself from the past. Realizing that it was okay not to be "God" any more and to be able to travel down her own path.] And tangled up with that was watching spoiler[Kyo and Tohru realizing that they were able to hold each other and Kyo removing the Beads. Just as special was seeing Ayame holding Mine and telling her that he was born to love her. And of course, the tears of Kisa, Ritsu and Kagura realizing that the bond had finally been broken. Seeing Haru, Rin, Hatori and Shigure being freed wasn't as hard...why I don't know.] But seeing the freedom of spoiler[Yuki and that combined with how the Zodiac came to be and why the cat was "punished" so."] While it was very special to see Tohru and Kyo, it was also very, very special to see spoiler[ Yuki and Machi be together] And seeing the next to last panel of Akito spoiler[being in Tohru's arms, able to accept Tohru's Super Heart Healing Power was just as terrific!] That's the good stuff. Now... Kyo's sperm donor and that old maid are modderpockers! Period. The sperm donor's reaction to merely seeing Kyo was spoiler[over the top hysterical. Very obviously the sperm donor cannot and will not accept his guilt and part in Kyo's mother's death. (I refuse to use the word "wife" or "husband" because the sperm donor doesn't deserve that honor.) Denying the fact that his words were what drove Mother to the brink and sent her over.] Pocker! And as for the old maid...well I really like what Akito told her spoiler["Fine. Then stay where you are. As long as you want. But as for me...I'm going now.] Beautiful! Of course, that sentence had several meanings, one of which was the fact that Akito spoiler[went to various people to apoligize for things that she'd done to them either directly or indirectly. Seeing Akito's face when Arisa hugged her was priceless! And, you know, if it hadn't been for Tohru, Arisa would not have been able to forgive Akito for what she'd done to Kureno.] Yup! Tohru's Super Heart Healing Power is very powerful indeed. |
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suna_suna
Posts: 550 Location: Ohio |
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i said before, this really is the climax of the series
and yes, we all said that Kyo had carppy parentsspoiler[but i feel this volume does shed a bit more light on what they were actually like. before, we had never really seen that much of either of them. His father is still a jackass who is more concered with his face value then his own family (huh, kind of like Kyoko's father) and was unwilling to accept the fact that his son was the cat. i think he felt that he would no longer be known amongst the family for himself, which he'd prefer, but that he would forever be known as the father of the cat.] nowspoiler[even though she wasn't the best, i've always felt that Kyo's mother truly did love him, but she didn't love the cat. and her husband only drove that in further with his yelling. i think what made her obsessive about whther or not Kyo's braclet was still on was because she was trying to prove to herself that he was not the cat, or that he wouldn't be like the others. she woulddeny it to herself and to Kyo. but, i think that if Kyo had a different father, things would have been much different.] alsospoiler[i love the filler sketch where Kazuma is about to chew Kyo's father up and spit him out.] this is my favorite volumespoiler[because it finally has the happy ending everyone knew was coming, it just had to go through one gigantic pile of drama to get there. i'm curious, when did you all first satrt thinking that this was how the characters would end up? i think i first thought that it was for sure in vol. 13 on the class trip. but i'm rambling a bit.] i'll do more later[/spoiler] |
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar Posts: 16935 |
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I have to say for me the best part of the volume was watching Kyo confront his father. spoiler[Watching him tell him he likes Tohru and wants to be with her. he accepted what happened with his mother. Then he realizes aftter hearing his dad cursing at him it was him, not Kyo, that really pushed his mom away. What makes this so amazing for me is Kyo doesn't hurt him or do anything to him. ]That to me shows how he has grown.
I also found it very sweet and nice that we finally get the back story on how the curse started. spoiler[How it was the cat that did not want the immortality and was cast out due to it. So having Kyo accept himself and his love for Tohru, and having it returned, ended the curse for them all. ] It is nice too see Akito growing up too. Maybe she can begin to try and undue some of the damage she has caused. I think the big announcement(s) in the final volume will be spoiler[Akito telling everyone he is really a she. I got my money on that as the big one. Probably also telling them they can live their own lives now.] Wonder if Shigure will get back with her? |
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fighterholic
Posts: 9193 |
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Wow, I've finally come back into the conversation!
Kyo's father spoiler[has had his head up his ass and will continue to do so for years to come. The fact that he can't get over Kyo, what happened to his mother, etc etc means that he'll be missing out on a lot, and that's his own doing.] Everybody's better off without him anyway. I think that the events that have been happening for the build up to this point in the series was a real wake up call for Akito. spoiler[She pretty much had everything. Her Zodiac males, power in the house, and was uncontested. However, she did not factor in a good number of things, namely Tohru and Shigure, not to mention the fact that the curse was breaking as time was going on. If it hadn't been for Tohru doing what she thought was right, Arisa forgiving her, and Shigure manipulating his ways on her, she probably would have been in the same position as Kyo's father. Thankfully that has changed and we got to see "Aachan" via Hana-chan]
spoiler[The breaking of the curse ]was a tear jerker for me. I almost cried, but I most certainly got the bumps after reading it, and seeing everybody's reaction to it. spoiler[It worked out really conveniently for Yuki because at that point, he was able to embrace Machi like he wouldn't have been able to do before. ]Their story has been one of the most interesting ones to watch, and cute. Really cute. |
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aya_honda
Posts: 920 Location: Around here |
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Continuing with spoilers from volume 22:
The most interesting thing about this volume is definitely the spoiler[ breaking of the curse and the the way the legend really went. ] As for the spoiler[ breaking of the curse] I must say that I liked the way it has been done. It was definitely soemthing people were expecting to happen at some point, but it comes beautifully and completing the story in a very nice way. For one thing, it isn't sudden. We are all expecting it, since spoiler[ the zodiacs started to free themselves, like Kureno has done it. But since the breaking of the curse is already happening and it's also felt even by some of them such as Shigure, it was only a matter of time before this would actually happen, setting free the rest of them. I loved however the enquiring that Hiro did with Kisa when she was still cursed while he wasn't any longer. He was so afraid that she might not love him anymore, while she was afraid that now things would change for them. In the end it was proven that they both loved each other very much and it was only natural for them to continue to be together, even before she was actually freed. That definitely proved that their love was strong and innocent as well. ]
The nice thing about the whole matter was the spoiler[ sadness that the characters felt when it actually happened. Because in spite of the fact that it was a curse and it had ruined their lives in more than one way, it was still a bond and it made them close with each other. Somehow that special bond between all of them might disappear. Despite knowing how they feel for each other and how this special bond would sill carry on, as they have lived so much, it still sets them free to be on thier own way. And I think that the scene between Haru and Rin is self-explanatory for this. ] However, I was really glad to see spoiler[ Kyo being free finally and most importantly free to hug Tohru. I have dreamed for these scenes so I was in heaven when reading them. The breaking of the curse was also shown through Kyo's gesture to break the beads. It was the most visible sign that he had been a monster in the eyes of the others and taking them off showed the level to which he was really free. Not to mention that Akito has destroyed the nekotsuki's room. ]
By the way, LydiaDianne, and I thought I was harsh to Kyo's father! 
It was something unexpected for me, I must at least confess that. But then it also casts a new light onto the whole story, because now the things that had been done to Kyo and to other people that have been cursed to be the cat (like Kazuma's grandfather) seem all the more cruel and painful. And the God seems all the more selfish, although spoiler[ Akito's redeeming features in this volume definitely makes the reader sympathize with her and finally understanding a little bit her actions.] |
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Richard J.
 Posts: 3367 Location: Sic Semper Tyrannis. |
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Cleric with Diamond in Hand: RESURRECTION!
Thread returns to life after 10 minues. Got volume 23 not very long ago. Read it and, honestly, I think the last words of the volume say it all: spoiler["Repeat the good and the bad. Do it all and pile on the years."] The gathering of the former Zodiac Sohmas to meet with Akito was an interesting scene. Lots of humor to go with spoiler[the serious revelation of Akito's true gender to the younger ones. (Momiji and Kagura teasing Kyo and Ristsu's reaction to Akito "you share my hobby!" were hysterical.) The part that I liked best was seeing Akito being thoughtful at the end, thinking about how she couldn't say she was sorry for how she'd acted. She has a lot of repentance to do but, with Shigure around, I think she can handle it.] Actually, this volume had some extremely funny moments as well as one truly heart-rending dramatic point. (I cried a little, first in pain of reliving spoiler[Kyoko's death and then in a kinda of rapture at seeing her reunited with Katsuya.) What was most important in this scene was getting to learn the true reasons for her "I won't forgive you" to Kyo. Tohru called it, she knew her mother couldn't have meant it the way Kyo took it.] Although in many ways if spoiler[he hadn't taken it the wrong way, he might have turned out very differently and perhaps not been able to become the person who could be with and love Tohru. And they are so cute together! I love the part where she's running toward him, arms out and face in Kawaii mode. God I wish a girl would act like that when she saw me.] Interesting to consider the other possibility. This volume has so many awesome comedy bits though. My all-time favorites were Machi scenes of course! Yuki almost spoiler[throwing the spare key out and her lunge for it while admitting she's lying about worrying Yuki might find another girl was priceless. (Ah, Yuki, you've come so far! Even being able to call your mommy-figure "Tohru" for a change!) That scene tells you where they'll end up eventually.]
The bit at Kakeru's place when he tries the spoiler["climbing the stairway of life" line on Machi is also quite good. She punches him through the meat she'd brought, causing Kakeru's girlfriend to freak out. . . over the meat!] 
Yuki: "That's what you're worried about?" So funny. And Hana-chan spoiler[moving in to become "mommy" to Kyo by going after his Shishou is. . . okay, I am alone in totally thinking they'd work as a couple? Kyo's internal monologue on subject showed how much he respects his father figure though, making it clear he'll accept whatever Shishou decides. (Speaking of Kyo's spiritual father, oh lord did he crack me up with his "I have no regrets" bit about being ready to die. Live for the grandchildren! Live for the sweet Saki!] )
The little bit with the poor, long-suffering Mitsuru going "the evil has been destroyed" was awesome. Aya being. . . well, Aya was classic and fantastic. Rin shows that not all the scars are gone and many issues still need to be worked out. All the male students spoiler[reacting with pride at Kyo and Tohru's relationship. "Red rice. We must cook some red rice."] So sweet. Honestly, there are so many things I could talk about but I think I've mentioned the ones that really hit me. Well, maybe one last one: spoiler[the flashforward, seeing a little grandchild of Tohru and Kyo's, seeing that they stayed together, had a family and are still living happily together], really makes the whole experience of buying and reading every volume of Fruits Basket worth it all. Just those few pages at the end were enough to make it all worth it. Every penny, every second. The words Natsuki Takaya leaves us with at the end say it all. They are moving in their message and poetic in simplicity. (I'm sure they sound even better in Japanese but in English they sound excellent as well. Not always Tokyopop's strong suit, making lines sound great.) Well, I'm so grateful to have been able to read Fruits Basket and to have been able to participate on this insanely long thread. I can't believe I'm one of the first to comment on the last volume! If you haven't gotten a copy yet, GO AND BUY ONE NOW! 
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LydiaDianne
Posts: 5633 Location: Southern California |
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I can't believe that I'm making this post at nearly 3 am CA time but that's what I get for having a late dinner out with friends and having lots of caffeine.
**sob**sniffle**weep**cry** IT'S OVER!!!! **wail** But what a way to go! I have enjoyed the hell out of this series and this last volume really was the frosting on the cake. I fully agree with everything that Richard said (and why are you posting this late? Or is it early where you are?) Seeing Akito confront the Zodiac in her "true form" was amazing. Ritsu's reaction was quite Priceless. But, it took a great deal of strength from Akito to appear before them that way and so I'm very proud of her for doing so. I also like how Akito held out her hand to the spoiler[Old Maid to help her change. But the Old Bat just turned and walked away, refusing to change because she believed that she was too old to change.] It was also interesting to see the goofy Shigure completely gone and his true self also fully revealed, the one that doesn't like to lose and did whatever it took for him to have Akito. But it was also satisfying to see them be together as man and woman. I like the scene showing Tohru picking up all of spoiler[Kyo's Beads. Regardelss of what he thought at the time, they were important. They had been a part of his life for so long that they really should not be just thrown away. And in the final panel...seeing the bead with the Zodiac fingurines, family photos and the baseball cap...well...it brought happy tears to my eyes just now.] I will really miss this series but thankfully I will have the pleasure of renewing my friendship with it over and over again! |
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aya_honda
Posts: 920 Location: Around here |
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I am definitely share your reactions to the last volume. I nearly cry in joy and sadness that such a sweet series had ended. When it did in the Japanese version, it hadn't had such a finate feeling about it, as it does now that the last volume had appeared in the English version too. It's just so sad to see such a wonderful stoy come to an end.
There are those wodnerful moments, that make us laugh.
That scene was absolutely priceless, taking into consideration that such serious revelations were expected. What I liked even more was the way spoiler[ Kagura threw herself in Kyo's arms, making it look like something serious might come, but then quickly Momiji makes an entrance. It was priceless to see Kyo's face. ]
As for Akito, I think that in the last couple of volumes she succeeds in spoiler[ making a lot of her sins go away. She definitely made me forgive her for everything, after she finally decided that she wasn't going to lock up Kyo again and destroyed the room. ] Like Richard said, she has a lot of repentance to do but spoiler[ I have a feeling that many will be by her side, including Shigure. Shigure has finally reached his goal, making Akito understand what she should stand for and perhaps this is even better, because when she recognizes her feminity, she finally recognizes herself and she is finally able to live in the open, admitting who she truly is. That probably asks for courage and she seems determined to make up for everything that she has done. But then again, she has so many horrible things on her conscience that it will need some really hard work.] I would have been curious to see how this was going to happen. And talking about reactions towards her announcement and her words, besides Ritsu's which was beyond priceless, I have been impressed by Rin's. spoiler[ As one of the zodiacs who have suffered the kost during Akito's years of tirany I expected such a reaction and tot ell you the truth I was kind of hoping for soemthing like this to happen. Because firstly it gives a touch of realism to the whole story. Not everything can be forgiven so easily, especially when someone has to keep the scars. And Rin is such a person. In order to live in the present, one must let go of the past, but rin can't do that because the past has shaped and reshaped over and over again her life and I think I see her reaction. ] Although I was amused to see her reaction spoiler[ when Haru showed up, getting all shy and blushing like that. One of my dreams came true seeing them like that. ]
Of course, I also loved the way spoiler[ Tohru and Yuki say goodbye to each other and how later on, every zodiac understands that from that moment on they will be on their own, trying to make a life of their own. I really hope Momiji found eventually the love of his life because he was one of the few with an open-ending story - well, him and Kagura; maybe they ended up together after all because such open people with such an energy should be together. ]
And no, Richard, you're not the only one who hopes that spoiler[ Kazuma and Hana-chan will become a couple after all; Hana is after all very matured and composed and Shishou really needs a woman to look after him and after his house, because the man is a disaster in the kitchen anyways. And another man who finally finds a woman that suits him is Hatori. I am glad that he finally found a way to forget about Kana.]
What is wonderful about this manga is the fact that every time I read a chapter again, I still find something new, something beautiful and I enjoy how it makes me feel the emotions of the characters. It always had a nice gentle and at the same time emotional way to deal with the story of each character and that is priceless too. I really regret seeing it finished. [/quote] |
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