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Dessa
Joined: 14 Jul 2004
Posts: 4438
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Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 10:39 pm
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HeeroTX wrote: | Speaking of which, I have no idea how Plant Hwyaden can afford their own maintenance if Shiroe is going after the "source" of gold spawns in order to "make rent". |
From what I understand from the wikia, Plant Hwyaden has required everyone in the city to join their guild. Which means everyone's money goes into the guild coffers to pay for stuff, I'd assume..
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Via_01
Joined: 24 Aug 2014
Posts: 551
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Posted: Sun Nov 16, 2014 9:44 pm
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One thing: I don't believe the murderer Nelreth is killing adventurers only because he's being possessed by the spirit in his sword. How I see it, the whole thing about flavor text becoming real began to affect things in a drastic manner a bit after the murders began. Plus, it seems to be gradual, as Nelreth still retains some of his mind, not to mention that he wouldn't have gone into town and bought a super-katana if he didn't have a plan for it.
So I believe the political implications of this issue are still big.
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natchu96
Joined: 03 Jan 2014
Posts: 189
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Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 6:06 am
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Via_01 wrote: | One thing: I don't believe the murderer Nelreth is killing adventurers only because he's being possessed by the spirit in his sword. How I see it, the whole thing about flavor text becoming real began to affect things in a drastic manner a bit after the murders began. Plus, it seems to be gradual, as Nelreth still retains some of his mind, not to mention that he wouldn't have gone into town and bought a super-katana if he didn't have a plan for it.
So I believe the political implications of this issue are still big. |
Maybe . . . he just wanted a better katana to use on guard duty on a whim?
Then when he decided he ought to test it out he felt this slowly budding urge to kill people?
I mean clearly that scythe that screwed up Crusty has been acting up for quite a while now, if she can say she's been ignoring it heating up this whole time.
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HeeroTX
Joined: 15 Jul 2002
Posts: 2046
Location: Austin, TX
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Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 9:13 am
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Dessa wrote: | From what I understand from the wikia, Plant Hwyaden has required everyone in the city to join their guild. Which means everyone's money goes into the guild coffers to pay for stuff, I'd assume.. |
Yeah, they noted that at the end of first season, but I guess I need to go re-watch the beginning of this season because the implication (if not stated point) about the maintenance cost was that the whole Round Table was aware of and dealing with it. Considering the method used to buy the Guild Hall in the first place, there's no way Log Horizon would be able to try to shoulder that load alone. And considering that at this point the Round Table basically represents the entirety of Akiba, the difference between their finances and Plant Hwyaden's SHOULD be negligible unless PH's people are basically "slave labor" (like Hamelin).
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Dessa
Joined: 14 Jul 2004
Posts: 4438
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Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 4:21 pm
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HeeroTX wrote: |
Dessa wrote: | From what I understand from the wikia, Plant Hwyaden has required everyone in the city to join their guild. Which means everyone's money goes into the guild coffers to pay for stuff, I'd assume.. |
Yeah, they noted that at the end of first season, but I guess I need to go re-watch the beginning of this season because the implication (if not stated point) about the maintenance cost was that the whole Round Table was aware of and dealing with it. Considering the method used to buy the Guild Hall in the first place, there's no way Log Horizon would be able to try to shoulder that load alone. And considering that at this point the Round Table basically represents the entirety of Akiba, the difference between their finances and Plant Hwyaden's SHOULD be negligible unless PH's people are basically "slave labor" (like Hamelin). |
From what I understand, between the first season and the wikia, PH/Minami is pretty much a dictatorship. You have to do exactly what you're told, or you're kicked out of the guild, which means no access to the guild hall (your storage) or the Cathedral (resurrection).
I don't know if the novels have said/implied what happens to someone if they die and can't access the Cathedral. We know you go to the Cathedral of the last major city you were in, so if you can't get to another town, and can't get resurrected at your town's Cathedral...
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HeeroTX
Joined: 15 Jul 2002
Posts: 2046
Location: Austin, TX
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Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:43 pm
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Dessa wrote: | I don't know if the novels have said/implied what happens to someone if they die and can't access the Cathedral. We know you go to the Cathedral of the last major city you were in, so if you can't get to another town, and can't get resurrected at your town's Cathedral... |
I don't think it's been stated, but my impression has been that the Cathedral instead becomes a prison. Its not that you won't revive, but once you do, you can't get out. Like When Hamelin was defeated, their members (that were in the Guild Hall) couldn't leave unless they killed themselves or used "call of home". If you're locked in the Cathedral, the "kill yourself" option is definitely removed. So, you'd be imprisoned until you agree.
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natchu96
Joined: 03 Jan 2014
Posts: 189
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Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 12:06 am
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HeeroTX wrote: |
Dessa wrote: | I don't know if the novels have said/implied what happens to someone if they die and can't access the Cathedral. We know you go to the Cathedral of the last major city you were in, so if you can't get to another town, and can't get resurrected at your town's Cathedral... |
I don't think it's been stated, but my impression has been that the Cathedral instead becomes a prison. Its not that you won't revive, but once you do, you can't get out. Like When Hamelin was defeated, their members (that were in the Guild Hall) couldn't leave unless they killed themselves or used "call of home". If you're locked in the Cathedral, the "kill yourself" option is definitely removed. So, you'd be imprisoned until you agree. |
Well, the doors prevent entry according to zone ownership, not exit. So in order to lock you into the cathedral they have to buy the whole plot of land in front of the door and probably the whole area around the building in case you go YOLO and try to blow up the wall.
I wonder how environmental destruction affects zone differentiation . . .
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HeeroTX
Joined: 15 Jul 2002
Posts: 2046
Location: Austin, TX
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Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 12:17 am
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natchu96 wrote: | Well, the doors prevent entry according to zone ownership, not exit. So in order to lock you into the cathedral they have to buy the whole plot of land in front of the door and probably the whole area around the building in case you go YOLO and try to blow up the wall. |
Actually, it's detailed that an area's owner has (as near as possible) "complete control" of the owned area. When they were taking down Hamelin, Shiroe was able to keep Hamelin from using ANY of the doors as well as changing the rules of the area to allow/prevent combat, spells, etc. If PH owns the Cathedral, they should be able to "lock" people in by the same method.
(Henrietta did the same thing to Akatsuki inside the Crescent Moon guild hall at one point)
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GrayArchon
Joined: 28 Feb 2011
Posts: 393
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Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 12:07 pm
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HeeroTX wrote: |
natchu96 wrote: | Well, the doors prevent entry according to zone ownership, not exit. So in order to lock you into the cathedral they have to buy the whole plot of land in front of the door and probably the whole area around the building in case you go YOLO and try to blow up the wall. |
Actually, it's detailed that an area's owner has (as near as possible) "complete control" of the owned area. When they were taking down Hamelin, Shiroe was able to keep Hamelin from using ANY of the doors as well as changing the rules of the area to allow/prevent combat, spells, etc. If PH owns the Cathedral, they should be able to "lock" people in by the same method.
(Henrietta did the same thing to Akatsuki inside the Crescent Moon guild hall at one point) |
Shiroe only controlled the Guild Building, not the Hamelin Guild Hall, they're separate areas. He barred Hamelin from the Guild Building, which prevented them from entering it, even from their Guild Hall.
The confusion seems to stem from the Guild Halls (like Crescent Moon's or Hamelin's) allowing the owner to set entrance, but not exit restrictions; while buying full up buildings allows you to set exit restrictions in addition to entrance restrictions.
So Plant Hwyaden should be able to prevent people from entering, or exiting the Cathedral. Blocking people from exiting is self explanatory. They can't walk out the door, and if you disable skill usage, they can't teleport out either, making it effectively a prison.
The question is, what happens when you ban someone from entering the Cathedral? Naturally they're left unable to walk in through the front door. But what happens when it's their respawn point and they die? Do they revive inside anyways and bypass the restriction completely? Do they revive inside and get immediately ejected? Do they revive outside the Cathedral as close to the respawn point as they can get? Do they revive at the next closest Cathedral? Do they not revive until the ban is lifted?
All of those are possible scenarios for being banned from a Cathedral you're bound to.
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Dessa
Joined: 14 Jul 2004
Posts: 4438
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Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2014 1:45 pm
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GrayArchon wrote: | The question is, what happens when you ban someone from entering the Cathedral? Naturally they're left unable to walk in through the front door. But what happens when it's their respawn point and they die? Do they revive inside anyways and bypass the restriction completely? Do they revive inside and get immediately ejected? Do they revive outside the Cathedral as close to the respawn point as they can get? Do they revive at the next closest Cathedral? Do they not revive until the ban is lifted?
All of those are possible scenarios for being banned from a Cathedral you're bound to. |
And this exactly is what's making PH so scary. We know that they have control of the Cathedral, and are forcing everyone in Minami to join their guild, or lose access to the Cathedral. What we don't know, is what happens to people who die without access to the Cathedral. Quite frankly, I wouldn't want to be the one to find out, either.
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jr240483
Joined: 24 Dec 2005
Posts: 4380
Location: New York City,New York,USA
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2014 8:25 am
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ajr wrote: | I just want to add that it was nice to see a character in an anime acknowledge a romantic pairing was one-sided and wasn't going to happen (even if it did seem like the most natural of Shiroe's pseudo-harem). |
especially considering that from the looks of things the only person shiroe really likes is that girl who was the former leader of the tea party guild.
Though i'm kinda suprised they didn't use that one part of SAO's aincrad arc where their real bodies were used as the avatars. i definitely would have liked to see what shiroe or better yet that cat chef nynatta looked like in the real world (I predict he had to be a black american just like that other guy from SAO ).
all in all it definitely have promise and hopefully those weaboos who keep naging nonstop on how bad SAO's Fairy Dance arc are can instead watch this since it have none of things that made them disliked it.
However i for one hope that this series can also get a manga release too.
Last edited by jr240483 on Fri Nov 21, 2014 10:59 am; edited 1 time in total
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natchu96
Joined: 03 Jan 2014
Posts: 189
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2014 8:37 am
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jr0904 wrote: |
ajr wrote: | I just want to add that it was nice to see a character in an anime acknowledge a romantic pairing was one-sided and wasn't going to happen (even if it did seem like the most natural of Shiroe's pseudo-harem). |
especially considering that from the looks of things the only person shiroe really likes is that girl who was the former leader of the tea party guild.
Though i'm kinda suprised they didn't use that one part of SAO's aincrad arc where their real bodies were used as the avatars. i definitely would have liked to see what shiroe or better yet that cat chef nynatta looked like in the real world (I predict he had to be a black american just like that other guy from SAO ).
all in all it definitely have promise and hopefully [b]those weaboos who keep naging nonstop on how bad SAO's Fairy Dance arc are can instead watch this since it have none of things that made them disliked it.
However i for one hope that this series can also get a manga release too. |
Funny thing about Nyanta is that I here they dubbed him as an african american. With the real smoooooth kind of voice.
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Dessa
Joined: 14 Jul 2004
Posts: 4438
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2014 12:15 pm
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jr0904 wrote: | especially considering that from the looks of things the only person shiroe really likes is that girl who was the former leader of the tea party guild. |
1) Debauchery Tea Party wasn't a guild, it was just a party.
2) Shiroe respected Kanami, but I don't think he had any romantic feelings for her. He comes across as very asexual to me.
Quote: | Though i'm kinda suprised they didn't use that one part of SAO's aincrad arc where their real bodies were used as the avatars. i definitely would have liked to see what shiroe or better yet that cat chef nynatta looked like in the real world (I predict he had to be a black american just like that other guy from SAO ). |
1) We have seen what a number of characters look like in the real world, and most look at least somewhat similar to their characters.
2) Unlike in SAO (the game, not the anime), where all of the PCs are a single race, in Elder Tales, there are a number of different races, each with their own weaknesses and advantages. Making everyone appear as they do in the real world would take away these weaknesses and advantages (since human is a possible race), since no one would be their race anymore.
3) It's actually an important plot-point that people don't look like they do in the real world, and that some people are trapped in alternate-gender avatars. I doubt the anime will go into it, but the Roderick Firm has recreated lesser appearance potions, that won't completely reset the spectrum like the one Akatsuki used, but that can change 1-2 parameters, so people can fix their genders.
Quote: | However i for one hope that this series can also get a manga release too. |
There are currently 4 separate manga series for Log Horizon. One follows the West Wind Brigade, one follows Crescent Moon Alliance, one is about Nyanta, and the final is a direct adaptation of the novels. The latter one has been picked up by Yen Press, with release scheduled for March 2015. However, there is currently only one collected volume, as the series was on hiatus in Japan, though I believe it has picked up again.
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whiskeyii
Joined: 29 May 2013
Posts: 2247
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Posted: Mon Nov 24, 2014 1:33 am
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Yeah, this review feels pretty spot-on. That epic slide in the first part of the battle got my hopes up before promptly dashing them. ^^; Some days I wish Log Horizon had a more...ambitious(?) art direction. Or maybe just a bigger budget.
But I always feel like the story and worldbuilding more than make up for that!
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Wrangler
Joined: 11 Nov 2007
Posts: 1346
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Posted: Mon Nov 24, 2014 10:22 am
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New mystery is Crusty, what happened to him.
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