Forum - View topicEP. REVIEW: One Piece
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Snakebit1995
 Posts: 842 |
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For the third time, I'm not talking about cultures I'm talking about humans as a species. This has nothing to do with me being American, this has nothing to do with Oda being Japanese, This has to do with the basic human condition. We don't have a hard number of the amount of Minks on Zou but we'll use you're estimate of approximately 500 Minks. If you were to take the same number of human beings in a sample survey the chances you find a group in which when threatened with death or sever injury all 500 will still agree to not give up the stranger they are hiding would be so low it would be considered an anomaly to find a group that all agreed. Watch this TedEd on Unanimous decisions. if you have a large group especially one as huge as 500, the chances of getting a unanimous decisions go down and the lack of logic in an agreeing result goes up. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=heCSbA8w57A The likelihood that all the minks would agree to sacrifice themselves makes no sense, there should be natural outliers who don't agree with the group and sell out Raizou to save themselves. It does not make any sense for all the Minks to agree on this, it's completely illogical that a group of 500 would all agree on the same choice, especially when their lives are threatened. And again obviously this is a fantasy story, the Minks aren't real and they can do whatever they want in the make believe society, but the decision to give up their whole society to protect one stranger their ancestors were tangentially friends with makes ZERO sense. Sometimes it can become hard to enjoy a series when it applies certain real world attributes like physics and thermodynamics, but totally ignores other, the logic of the Minks decision to hide Raizou is completely illogical and would never work in the real world, the scene loses some value because it becomes so unrelatable. The scene with Robin on the tower in Enies Lobby is far more normal and relatable than the Zou scene. |
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chex mix
 Posts: 415 |
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^^ I agree. People not acting how people would act drives me nuts in all fiction.
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leafy sea dragon
 Posts: 7163 Location: Another Kingdom |
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I can say that where I live, it is absurdly common for people to just jaywalk out into open traffic and not feel a lick of fear. Not even when a motorist nearly hits them. They just look over, smile, and wave (as in, "It's all good") as if this happens to them daily. In other words, even basic fight-or-flight reactions can be extinguished via culture. (Technically, there are four components to that reaction, with fight and flight being only two of them, but that's besides the point.)
We also don't know what it is that happened on Zou in the past. We don't know how this elephant came to be, who commanded the rules of its behavior onto it, or any of its history beyond the two dukes and what happened when they first met Jack and his forces. It may be that the Kozuki Clan, in the past, saved Zou from complete annihilation, and this massive level of debt has been ingrained into its society. It may even be part of their religion.
There actually ARE outliers, Minks who did not want to sacrifice themselves. spoiler[There is confirmation of at least one Mink on Jack's side, for instance, and the manga strongly suggests there are a few on Big Mom's side too, at least beyond Pekoms.] However, most Minks have never left Zou and have rarely come in contact with anyone who doesn't live on Zou. A society as remote and insular as the Minks can most certainly develop strong collectivism. Said collectivism is how those anarchist towns in Spain continue to function to this day, for instance. |
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Animorphimagi
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how does this reviewer NOT understand the goal of the show? "once they reach the last island that's the finale" and "the 4 yonkou are the final bosses". NO. It's pretty obvious everything is actually building up to the reveal of the blank century and which would be revealed at Raftel. The final fights will be against the World Government at Mariejois. The big question is how they will travel halfway around the world so quick to reach the finale after getting to Raftel. Also when they get to Raftel Luffy will likely become king of the pirates by beating blackbeard and will then go to Mariejoi with tons of other pirates, and the alliances he's made with fishman isl., dressrosa, Alabasta, etc. I'm also pretty sure by the end even the Navy will end up turning on the World Government when Luffy reveals some major revelation there
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Sam Leach
 Posts: 53 |
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? It's one thing to have a different take on how the story will play out, but saying I don't understand the goal of the series bothers me a lot. I don't thinks it's crazy to assume that Blackbeard, preceded by fights with likes of Kaido, etc. will be the final battle. The story of the government is one of reformation, as they've always been depicted as un-unified, and often morally grey. We're going to be seeing massive change-ups with them throughout the series for the betterment of the world. They are not the be-all-end-all bad guys by a long shot. The fight for the One Piece has always been the core thrust, and that's a fight between pirates above all else. |
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HeeroTX
Posts: 2046 Location: Austin, TX |
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I wouldn't say you don't understand the goal, or even that you're wrong (I do not pretend to know what the endgame is), but I have to agree with Animorphimagi on the PROBABLE endgame. The only two yonkou that COULD be "final" are Shanks (but I can't see Luffy "fighting" him) or Blackbeard. But that said, I can only see Blackbeard as "final opponent" if HE does something like Doflamingo and takes over the world government. Blackbeard is an evil terrible man, but the World Government has been the "problem" pretty much since the day Luffy left home. (Blackbeard didn't even enter the story until Luffy had over half his (current) crew) Also, the government is an appropriate opponent for "King of the Pirates" and also something that would "need" the alliance Luffy made before getting to Zou. Fighting Blackbeard shouldn't take more than the base strawhats. (and really, if you have the grand "Strawhat Alliance" come together to defeat the world government, it'll be kind of anti-climatic if they then pound Blackbeard, unless he uses his devil fruit power to become INSANELY powerful (absorbing like 10+ powers)) Also, Luffy destroying the existing government seems an appropirate point to herald in a NEW "age", and end the CURRENT age that started at the beginning of the series. spoiler[Also, in the manga Luffy is ALREADY basically fighting Big Mom, so in theory he'll either BECOME a Yonkou or at least likely take one down WELL before raftel. Shanks is likely gonna be defeated by someone who ISN'T Luffy. And I question whether or not Kaido is ever going to actually "battle" Luffy or instead setup someone else's strength. He SEEMS like he'll either be beaten by Kidd and his "rookie" alliance, or else THAT group will be "saved" by Luffy from Kaido, but it seems 50/50 eaither way depending on the plan with Kidd. (not sure if he's supposed to be pro- or an-tagonist)] |
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Snakebit1995
Posts: 842 |
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I'm gonna step in here and side with Sam, the series is about pirates, it should end with a battle amoung pirates not a bunch of no faces goverment cronies fighting Luffy and the crew. Aside from Robin's arc Luffy's never really given a damn about the World Goverment, but he's got personal stakes with Blackbeard so it makes more sense for him to be the final foe. |
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TonyTonyChopper
Posts: 256 |
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I know it has to end eventually for it to have any meaning at all ...
But that doesn't mean i would be happy about that, One Piece is one of those things that i really like where i can always come back to well a chapter and episode every week and additional movies,specials rewatch through dvd's etc. Which kinda makes me watch read other stuff don't know if that sounds weird xd) Osamu Tezuka is my other big thing i can always come back to which i will most likely never run out on or at lest gonna take a long time also JOJO is something i can also obsess over. The thing is i can not obsess over short things as much as i like Legend of the Galactic heroes is amazing but i'm not gonna rewatch it 20 times ... i can't really understand hardcore Star wars and Harry potter fans for example ... they completely obsess over something that's way to short cause you are mostly rewatching the same thing over and over again. Why bring this up in the first place ? Well i don't unconditionally like every anime ever made and don't worship the word by any means ... and i need these injections from legends to keep it going otherwise i might even eventually lose interested in it ... |
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Sam Leach
Posts: 53 |
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The only thing I'm certain of is that the story is about Luffy's goal for the One Piece, and once he has it, the story will start wrapping up. I don't think he cares enough about the government to pick a fight with them unless they got in his way, which is definitely possible.
My general (broad) road map for the rest of the series looks like this: (some minor manga spoilers referenced below) spoiler[Luffy saves Sanji from Big Mom and the Vinsmokes, but does not defeat Big Mom in a fight. The Whole Cake Island arc ends with some big, world changing event but ends without a finite conclusion. I like the idea of Luffy having to/getting to follow the Vinsmokes to the Reverie (Mariejoa, like the person above mentioned), but I'm not sure if it's realistic for Luffy to backtrack that far. We know the Reverie is coming up, but we don't know if it's its own arc or if it's something that will run parallel to the other stuff. One thing we can agree on is that shit's gonna go down there and there will be some noticeable government upheaval. Luffy finally regroups with the rest of the crew at Wano, where they're getting ready for their big fight with Kaido. Don't know what Big Mom's doing at this point. Maybe she's softened on Luffy, or maybe she gets into a fight with Kaido, Shanks, or maybe some of the other Super Rookies. Kaido will probably take a multi-arc saga to eventually take down, in part with the help of Luffy's Grand Fleet. Luffy will have shaken the world and be in an Emperor-like position. Somewhere along here, either during the Kaido stuff or shortly after, we'd get a major Revolutionaries vs. Government story and the dying breath of the Revolutionaries makes a big dent in the Government, nearly crippling it. This will lead to some kind of final, threeway battle between Luffy, the Government and Blackbeard, but ultimately end on a Luffy vs. Blackbeard fight on Raftel.] So yeah, lol. That's my fanfiction-y version for how the last stretch of the series plays out. |
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HeeroTX
Posts: 2046 Location: Austin, TX |
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Some of your manga thoughts admittedly gave me pause, I'l comment more on that below, BUT, they also made me think of something else. We've ALREADY somewhat sidetracked Blackbeard onto Sabo. As Ace's "other brother" he has the same grudge and Blackbeard was trying to get the fire fruit for his crew, so all that is already on a collision course. It can play out in any number of ways and I agree that Luffy SHOULD be involved, but that story can easily move WITHOUT Luffy. Also, the other reasons that the World Government looks like "endgame" are: -We "know" a lot about Blackbeard and his crew, so that fight can be engaged and finished at any time, we STILL don't know a LOT about the World Government, so there's a LOT of story to reveal before you can really do anything there -While the idea of pirate-v-pirate is meritous, Luffy's been fighting the navy ever since he recruited his first member (Zoro), there would be some symmetry if the series ends with Luffy either battling with or joining Coby to take down the corrupt World Government -Blackbeard is an evil "villain", but Ace was KILLED by the Navy (Akainu), so "logically" Luffy's beef is more with the Navy than with Blackbeard (altho he clearly doesn't like BB) But I think the biggest question to resolve to figure WG vs BB as "final boss" is what it "means" to be "King of the Pirates". Depending on that answer, the rivalry with Blackbeard might be the biggest deal, OR it might be completely irrelevant. Regarding manga bits: spoiler[I forgot about reverie, that might accelerate some of the World Government plot post-BigMom. But I can't see the BigMom arc ending without actual resolution. It's too much of a "cop-out" to put Luffy out of commission to train again (like after Whitebeard) and there's too many obvious problem points to leave them "ambiguous". (just to name a few: Sanji's wedding, Pudding's life(?), Lola's life(?), Fishman Island, plus their already existing antagonism) it doesn't fit to have Luffy "flee"/on the run from her (has he EVER done that?) and I don't see "temporary truce" as an option. It seems more like it's due for "Crocodile style defeat". In fact, the Yonkou right now just seem like the "new" Shichibukai. (in terms of importance to "plot")] Another interesting point, we STILL have not seen hide nor hair of Vegapunk. Wherever HE is will likely factor into the endgame. Its POSSIBLE (altho highly unlikely IMO) that he's with Blackbeard. It's also possible he's with the World government or the revolutionaries. Or he might just be on Raftel to meet at the end. But at this point, he's been mentioned so often I HAVE to believe he's going to be relevant eventually. Which is another reason the World Government seems like "endgame", we have way too many items that just seem like overkill for Blackbeard (like the "super weapons", Pluton, Poseidon & Uranus). While it is again POSSIBLE they never "matter", it seems like a waste to keep bringing them in to never do something with it. |
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leafy sea dragon
Posts: 7163 Location: Another Kingdom |
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I'd have to agree with Sam as well. Blackbeard and his crew are shaping up to be evil counterparts of the Straw Hat Pirates, right down to Blackbeard having a morally bankrupt version of Luffy's ideals (total freedom, pursuing the One Piece, relying on his crewmates, except that Luffy is doing it by gaining the trust of other people whereas Blackbeard does it by exploiting whatever he can). I think it'd be anti-climactic to have such a group NOT be the final adversaries. Also, Blackbeard IS amassing a large amount of pirates. He is an Emperor, after all, and considering his crewmates are now division commanders, they're likely controlling other pirate crews who have chosen to take refuge under Blackbeard for one reason or another. The reason I don't see the World Government as an organization being the final opponents is that it's too splintered. There are evil people in the World Government, but at the same time, there are good people in the World Government. I don't see this same ambiguity among the Blackbeard Pirates. They're flat-out villainous, all of them.
For Star Wars, there's a vast expanded universe told through novels, comic books, video games, and merchandise, which are all ongoing, and the hardcore fans are into at least one of these other things. For Harry Potter, it seems to have sustained itself through a fast-moving and robust fanfiction network. In both cases, they've established a detailed and vast fantasy universe with a lot of room for fans to speculate or add things into. That is, you are a fan of long-runners and you want to always consume new material (and there is nothing wrong with that--I am such a fan myself), but not every fan is like that. For some, being with other fans of the same material is good enough for them, as with fans of things which have long ended, like Lord of the Rings or Kim Possible; fans of things with little to no canon stories at all, like Monster High or Minecraft; or fans of nonfiction like World War II or of Honda cars. And then there are some hardcore fans who are so hardcore that they will never bore of some particular thing. I am a pinball fan, and I can tell you with absolute certainty that there are a few people with a Twilight Zone machine in their homes they got when it was new in 1992 and are still playing to this day, diligently maintaining or repairing them when needed. |
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bhl88
Posts: 255 |
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The best way I can see for that force to be countered is with the newly form Straw Hat Grand Fleet, while the 7-15 VIPs/crewmates go fight against a Commander.
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leafy sea dragon
Posts: 7163 Location: Another Kingdom |
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That's pretty interesting--I had been hoping for a Mink to join the Straw Hats, and the one tht'd fit in with the Straw Hat dynamic best is Carrot, as she's silly, energetic, and clearly strong enough to keep up with them. That is, I think it's interesting the filler writers agree with me here.
Just you watch though: Oda is a trollish writer, and he's going to make Carrot into a villain or something. I mean, spoiler[you had Pedro, as they were approaching Whole Cake Island, suspecting Carrot may be up to no good.] Doesn't seem like it that the moment though. |
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Admiral Pizzaman
 Posts: 504 |
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Am I the only one who find out weird that ep 774 which has epic animation moment gets 3.6 rate while ep 775 which is mostly filler content gets 4.1 rate?
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ultimatehaki
Posts: 1090 |
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Enis lobby was the last saga in which I actually liked the animation. It was an improvement to the old animation, which I still like and go back to a lot, but wasn't the loose shiny mess it started to became in the Thriller bark saga.
When they redid enis lobby and nami's rescue arc in the movie special, it was the final nail in the coffin since it let me fully realize how much I really hated the new animation. It did nothing for me. |
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