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ANNCast - Down with the Vic-ness

Gina Szanboti wrote:

That's not what he said. In context (@~57:10) he simply said that other people were very vocal about their own beliefs and interests, such as political and sexual beliefs (later expanding that slightly as moral, political and ethical positions), and he didn't understand why he was the only one getting flack for being vocal about his own particular interests. He never said whether he agreed or disagreed with the various agendas others were promoting.

What do you think he meant by being vocal about sexual beliefs? In that I've yet to attend a panel at a con where anyone tried to convert others to do anything of a sexual nature. What I have encountered are people sharing who they are. Well, Homestuck fans have an agenda but that's beside the point.

Gina Szanboti wrote:

That's not what he said. In context (@~57:10) he simply said that other people were very vocal about their own beliefs and interests, such as political and sexual beliefs (later expanding that slightly as moral, political and ethical positions), and he didn't understand why he was the only one getting flack for being vocal about his own particular interests. He never said whether he agreed or disagreed with the various agendas others were promoting.

What do you think he meant by being vocal about sexual beliefs?

Draneor wrote:

Gina Szanboti wrote: That's not what he said. In context (@~57:10) he simply said that other people were very vocal about their own beliefs and interests, such as political and sexual beliefs (later expanding that slightly as moral, political and ethical positions), and he didn't understand why he was the only one getting flack for being vocal about his own particular interests. He never said whether he agreed or disagreed with the various agendas others were promoting. What do you think he meant by being vocal about sexual beliefs?

I don't know, since I'm not a mind reader and he didn't elaborate. But even if he did mean advocating for same sex marriage or whatever people think he meant, the point remains that he didn't say he agreed or disagreed with whatever he was alluding to, just that he gets flack when they don't, and he didn't get why. His question was why Christian advocacy seems to be, in his view, the only topic that's off-limits.

Hmm, well when I listened to the podcast the first thing I though of was one of the various hentai panels at some cons or a "sex and anime/manga" panel. I don't think Vic meant vocal in the sense of proselytizing others with their beliefs, but rather they were equally eager to talk about things they are passionate about.

And he was saying that others do soapbox as much as he does. That was his point.

... while other voice actors and guests may HAVE personal beliefs that they candidly express, none that I know of put the kind of time and effort that Mignogna does into setting up a soapbox from which to push an ideological agenda (again, however politely). There's a difference.

sonic720 wrote:

Hmm, well when I listened to the podcast the first thing I though of was one of the various hentai panels at some cons or a "sex and anime/manga" panel. I don't think Vic meant vocal in the sense of proselytizing others with their beliefs, but rather they were equally eager to talk about things they are passionate about.

It's an anime con. Panels about anime--even adult anime--are kind of expected. OTOH, Vic runs a church service--which, OK, is fine but it's not the same. The same would be if he ran a panel on "religious thought in anime" or something.

In the ANNCast, Vic stated his "ideological agenda" has nothing to do with shoving religion down anyone's throat, but rather being a role model to his fans, nothing more and nothing less. He made it fairly clear why he goes to great lengths to share the love of God with others, and that's because he really believes it to be true. He goes out of his way to do this because he truly cares about others and wants to help them. If Vic wanting to be there for fans and giving them hugs and attention is the worst he's done, I'd say he's doing something right.

We can debate if Vic is sincere in his words until we are blue in the face, but it does not change the fact there's no documented proof he is a bigot or a spiteful individual. In the absence of such evidence, why would anyone be skeptical he's not being truthful with us? Regardless of the reason one may be skeptical, the fact remains it's unfair criticism unless it's based on objective fact.

I can't speak for others, but I at least am not questioning his truthfulness or sincerity. I have no reason to doubt that he believes what he says or that he's recounting events truthfully. What I'm questioning is whether his behavior - e.g. assuming the role of a spiritual guide/amateur therapist for his fans - is appropriate, particularly in the context of hobby conventions packed with insecure and impressionable minors. Or, at the very least, why his behavior might bother people in a way that, say, someone expressing their political opinions during a discussion panel probably would not.

As for it bothering people, do they not have feet or some sort of way of moving about? Can they not leave if they feel in the least bit offended? Does Vic hold them at gunpoint and demand they stay for his panel? At what point should we censor anyone at their own panel/service/autograph signing because someone MAY get offended?

gatotsu911 wrote:

I can't speak for others, but I at least am not questioning his truthfulness or sincerity. I have no reason to doubt that he believes what he says or that he's recounting events truthfully. What I'm questioning is whether his behavior - e.g. assuming the role of a spiritual guide/amateur therapist for his fans - is appropriate, particularly in the context of hobby conventions packed with insecure and impressionable minors. Or, at the very least, why his behavior might bother people in a way that, say, someone expressing their political opinions during a discussion panel probably would not.

Fair enough, but remember this, Vic also stated he would be a big hypocrite if he kept his faith to himself and did not share it with others if he truly believes the gospel. So, when he is asked about it he does not shy away from expounding on what he believes. Notice Zac brought up his faith in the interview, not Vic.

Vic would be insincere not to share what he really believes with everyone. And his panels, again, are optional to attend. He does not roam the halls of the cons screaming out sermons or whatnot to evangelize. People come to see him of their own free will. If they are impressionable minors, is it not their parent's responsibility to know what they are exposed to and judge if it be offensive for their children to hear?

And if their parents are not very involved in their life and Vic wants to be a comfort to them at a con, do you see that as wrong because of his faith?

As for it bothering people, do they not have feet or some sort of way of moving about? Can they not leave if they feel in the least bit offended? Does Vic hold them at gunpoint and demand they stay for his panel? At what point should we censor anyone at their own panel/service/autograph signing because someone MAY get offended?

I get that Mignogna's actions are consistent with his belief system. I addressed this in several previous posts. This doesn't change the question of whether the way in which he chooses to act on his beliefs is appropriate, or why it makes many people uncomfortable.

And if their parents are not very involved in their life and Vic wants to be a comfort to them at a con, do you see that as wrong because of his faith?

I see it as dubious, because Vic Mignogna is not a therapist, he's not a youth counsellor, he's not a family member, he does not know these kids personally. He's also not an equal: they - quite often, children - are coming to him, an adult and a "celebrity", in the position of admirers and fans, meaning he holds the power in that relationship. Given all this, I am skeptical that it is his place, however good his intentions might be, to provide personal guidance and direction to his fans, especially when such direction involves trying to induct them into his faith. And AGAIN, I'm not suggesting that this is not, from Mignogna's perspective, simply the moral thing to do - I am questioning whether, from any other perspective, it is truly appropriate.

Not going to comment on the rest, but I noticed people discussing whether Vic drinks or not. I was at a VAs after dark panel at Kunicon in 2005, and the liquor was flowing freely (beer, cocktails, scotch, you name it) and Vic was ABSOLUTELY taking part in it. It's possible he's gone sober since then, but he did drink.