Forum - View topicNEWS: Tokyopop Updates Ratings System
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britannicamoore
 Posts: 2618 Location: Out. |
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None of the bookstores I go to shrink-wrap their novels unless they need to. (Borders, barnes and noble, waldenbooks) But there are always like ten kids reading the manga for free. its like their parents dropped them off their or something. They sit in the isle, get angry if you try to reach past them and if they have the book you want like Deltakiral said they get angry if you say you wan tot actually buy it because they aren't "done yet" Also by the time many of these kids are finished they've destroyed the binding or damged the book like others have said. It's quite annoying. I buy books in Michigan your friendly water surrounded neighbor to the north. |
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mistress_reebi
Posts: 735 Location: Canada |
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I haven't seen damaged books at Chapters, but the local comic book store shrink wraps off of its manga. When I look for a new manga series I normally check the anime, or check out the previews for it on their website, or read a review.
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DKong
 Posts: 152 |
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Also, what's up with you people being all anal about the condition of the books? It doesn't change content at all (unless a page is ripped out, then you could actually go report that to the cashiers), and if you want to resell it later, people on ebay usually don't care- I just sold volumes 1-5 of Bleach, the covers were all damaged and bent up (and I specifically said that AND posted pics) and they still sold for the average amount all Bleach manga goes for on ebay (which is like $5 a volume, usually). |
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britannicamoore
Posts: 2618 Location: Out. |
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But you sold them for $5. At the store i'd have to pay $7 or $8. If i'm paying full price for something I expect it to be in mint condition. |
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MorwenLaicoriel
 Posts: 1617 Location: Colorado |
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I'm actually guilty of grabbing a stack of manga and reading it at the store, but since I'm a big re-reader probably something like 80% of what I read I buy, if not that day, then eventually. (Plus, ever since volunteering at a library, I've been reeeeally careful about not damaging a book when I read it.)
Although that was when I was younger. For the most part, these days I'll flip through a book for a few minutes and then grab what I want, pay for it, and rush out the door because I've been at school all day/I'm busy/I've got somewhere I need to be. Ah, the joys of being an "adult"... Anyway, about the actual ratings system, I'm happy about it. I've been wanting them to have more precise indicators for a while (Not "might have' but "actually has this"). Since there's some content I'm more comfortable with than others, it really helps to know what sort of things are in a book. (I even almost skipped over Emma because of the high rating CMX gave it [but that's a different company from Tokyopop]. What's with the rating, anyway? There's been a bit of suggestive dialogue in the manga, but nothing so far that would justify a "16+" rating from what I can tell.) |
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minakichan
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Well, that's sort of the same thing, isn't it? And in reality, shrink-wrapping doesn't prevent a 13-year-old from buying OT manga, just as an R rating doesn't prevent a 13-year-old from watching an adult movie. Manga, shrink-wrapped or not, is more accessible to kids, and the fact that, I dunno, Legal Drug is sitting next to Lagoon Engine, or Dragon Head next to Digimon, makes it much harder to monitor (whereas prose is often categorized in Children, Teen, Adult sections in a bookstore). Shrink-wrap does allow a barrier--at least a flimsy one, seeing as kids can break the shrink wrap, but at least they won't be ACCIDENTALLY stumbling upon inappropriate material. R-rated films at least require an adult's permission for a minor to see; there is no such thing for manga, and without shrink-wrapping, kids can easily and accidentally get access without paying or supervision. (The movie equivalent would be a kid walking into the wrong theater room and watching an R-rated film-- possible, but doesn't happen often at all.) As for the 16 vs 17 debate, well, manga tends to get away with depicting more explicit violence and nudity or suggestive themes, even despite ratings-- which is why many soccer moms, even having taken their kids to see PG-13 movies, are still horrified to see what their kids read in T manga; the uproar over Peach Girl in such a community a while ago is a prime example. An OT, I would say, is thus equivalent to an R film. At any rate, as I've said earlier, shrink-wrapping is still more accessible than R-films because it doesn't require permission for access. In other countries, all manga is shrinkwrapped (though not for that reason, more to prevent damage or free reading). In all honesty, shrink-wrapping OT isn't in my personal best interest-- I'm a bookstore reader-- but well, I don't want to be around for that soccer-mom torrent, let me tell you that. |
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Stullz
Posts: 96 |
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About the damage to books, I personally only by a book manga or novel if it is high quality and in near perfect condition, and I also try to keep them that way. Thatway my copy lasts longer and looks better. (for example I have a 1000 pg novel that I've read 4 times, but because it is so thick, the binding is almost destroyed, and I need to buy a new copy after my next read through because it wont survive) (manga is much easier to keep in good condition)
And on Shrink-wrap, I dont mind it as long as I have a way to see the art and know it is worth my buy before hand, However, there is one issue with it that I know could occur but hasn't yet. Print Quality, it may be rare but I do know some books will have blurry pages or the printer ran low on ink on some pages (only had this in novels so far not manga) If you get a bad copy of a shrinkwrapped book,you may not be able to return it opened, (some stores don't accept returns on books at all) If shrinkwrapping an OT book keeps a Parental Advisory label from being printed directly on the cover, then I'm all for it. Those PA labels really look bad on the cover of some mangas, (and some don't make any sense) Why can't they put it on as a sticker that can later be removed? rather than defacing the cover? Also, when stupid people rip the shirnk wrap off and don't buy that copy after reading it in the store, IT CANNOT BE SOLD, and must be disposed of. Sad huh. So please don't take it off. And lastly, all the book stores in my area (Cincinnati, Ohio) receive only the mangas that are supposed to be wrapped, wrapped. And my Local Border's sells just about every mang from every publisher, but the local Books A Million sell few wrapped manga mature or not, the worst they have are the likes of Air Gear and Ai Yori Aoshi, and our Barnes And Noble's seem to stay away from some of the more quetionable titles, except for DN Angel, I don't know why but they never carry that an its only T 13+. enough rambling from me. |
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Jedi General
 Posts: 2485 Location: Tucson, AZ |
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My thoughts exactly. Sure the content is the same, but I'm not paying full price for a book that has obviously been read already or at least flipped through several times. |
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HitokiriShadow
 Posts: 6251 |
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No, often they have both the labels and shrinkwrap particularly Viz titles. Dark Horse may not use age ratings but they DO use the content stickers even though they shrinkwrap it. Del Rey shrinkwraps some older teen titles and doesn't have a content warning but their mature titles (only Basilisk and Suzuka at this point) do have labels on them.
Huh? Since when? The books don't require shrinkwrap to be sold. You can usually return books that were shrinkwrapped and then opened. Or at least you can at Borders/Waldenbooks and Barnes & Noble. |
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Faceman
 Posts: 300 Location: Boston |
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I'm liking the new rating system. I hope maybe that with it, Tokyopop will feel that their collective asses are sufficiently covered to not have to edit manga to fit standards. If something is clearly labeled M and shrink wrapped, then parents who's kids come home with them have only themselves to blame.
It's up to the parents to watch what their kids are buying, watching, reading or listening to. When I was growing up, my mother didn't allow the kids to buy R rated movies or albums w/ Explicit Lyrics warnings, but she didn't wage a crusade about them and cry to the media. And for those wondering why people don't like to buy manga that's been read before: Would you want to pay full price for a DVD that someone watched for free already? Or pay full price for a video game that was used as a demo version? If I'm paying full price for an item, I expect the item to be in pristine condition as it should be. If a store is selling books as new, I don't want to buy a used one, even if it was within the store. |
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Strephon
Posts: 177 |
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You can't just stand there in the store and watch the sexual/violent scenes in a movie, though. And pictures have a lot more visceral impact than just words--a picture of a naked woman commands a lot more attention than just the sentence "So-and-so stood there naked," and can be processed a lot more quickly. A teenager is a lot more likely to go out of their way for the former than the latter. |
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Richard J.
 Posts: 3367 Location: Sic Semper Tyrannis. |
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I'd say that virtually all edits that have been made to a manga series were done not because of parental complaints but because the bookstores themselves made it clear that they didn't want to handle the merchandise unless it was edited. The goal may be to avoid the idiots who are too stupid to actually examine the manga before buying it but the impression I have is that it's big chains like Borders that are the real problem. I'm not saying stupid parents who can't be bothered to read the rating on the manga before buying it for Tiny Tim aren't a problem, but they don't seem to be the driving force behind the censorship. I'm just not aware of any organized anti-manga/anime groups and thus I think we should all be more focused on the bookstores themselves. If there is a Parents Against Manga or whatever group, ANN should report on them. So we can all aim our malice at a real target rather than the ubiquitous "soccer mom." On the subject of buying a pre-read manga: If it's still in excellent shape, I'll buy it. If the spine is creased and the pages damaged, I don't buy. Shrink wrap can at least slightly deter the "sit and read but never buy" crowd but it means you can't check out a series before buying it either. Maybe they should have a preview booklet that has a page from each manga series in it. |
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mistress_reebi
Posts: 735 Location: Canada |
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True, but if it's just nudity then it isn't that much of a deal then a picture of someones head being blown off, which is too violent for OT. If it has a label on the cover then it shouldn't be a problem. The consumer has been warned and it's up to their responsibility to purcuse the product when warned. The manifacture did their responsibility to make sure obcene material is labelled. 18+ manga, I can see that being shrink wrapped for protection, but OT isn't as graphic and is mature enough for teenagers. |
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pat_payne
Posts: 179 |
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The problem is, we're careening too quickly to a "sanitized for your protection" world, where anyone who is offended or harmed in any way can stamp the ground and legions of lawyers will spring up at their feet. I wouldn;t be surprised that sooner or later, all books will have to be shrink-wrapped before purchase to prevent some impressionable mind or litigious idiot (sometimes one and the same) from seeing something he doesn't like and trying to sue the pants off a bookstore due to "emotional distress." |
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mistress_reebi
Posts: 735 Location: Canada |
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I agree with you 100%. In Canada, we are more liberal when it comes to nudity/violence, which is annoying when there are censor blocks in manga because the soccer moms south of the border want to protect their children. Also, obscene material must have a label, so soccer moms here can't sue manga companies because they have been warned. I find it ironic how we have laws on censorship for tv/movies but we view more nudity/violence when our neighbours to the south can view anything they want but they censor way more. Watch some cable stations around midnight on Friday nights in Canada and see the difference in censorship. Legally they can show pornos because it's after a certain time and they have a viewer discretion sign. |
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