Forum - View topicMoe Tournament (nominations closed)
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abunai
Old Regular
 Posts: 5463 Location: 露命 |
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It should be pointed out that, while Akamatsu Ken is obviously an important connoiseur of moe, a number of Japanese fans and pundits have disagreed with his analysis and his definition. One of the more amusing dissenters is ABe Yoshitoshi, who has been lampooning the whole concept of moe in a series of hilariously parodic manga, wherein spurious etymologies for moe are continually expounded on. I'd link to it, but I can't really find a legitimate site to link to. I'm sure it's available out there in the murky depths of fansub-land, though. 
All right, I can see a few that are still missing: Aishiteruze Baby Kokoro Takunaga Last Exile Lavie Head Shakugan no Shana Kazumi Yoshida - abunai opyt a xif ot TIDE Last edited by abunai on Wed Nov 30, 2005 9:39 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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angel_lover
 Posts: 645 Location: UK |
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Did I break a rule somewhere? |
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Zalis116
Moderator
 Posts: 6873 Location: Kazune City |
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Some other nominations before things close down:
Mitsuki Kouyama from Full Moon wo Sagashite Misaki Suzuhara from Angelic Layer Kisa Sohma from Fruits Basket I belive these are from the last 5 years, apologies if I broke any rule. |
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abunai
Old Regular
Posts: 5463 Location: 露命 |
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I think they were just missed in the list. - abunai |
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Samurai CDZ
 Posts: 776 Location: Manhattan, KS |
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Shuko Suzuhara (her mother) was far more moe to me. So, I'll submit her. Also, I missed Sakaki. |
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dormcat
Encyclopedia Editor
 Posts: 9902 Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan, ROC |
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Oops. My bad. Please accept my apology. (Bows to angel_lover) m(_ _)m Now we have all nominees ready. Seeds apart, does anyone have a suggestion on methods of random grouping? I can only think of using random numbers. As for seeds, I'd like to go with what abunai has suggested. He is the very incarnation of impeccable objectivity, after all. 
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daxomni
 Posts: 2650 Location: Somewhere else. |
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That works better, for me at least. If "Moe" is strictly a feeling of wanting to care for and protect something fragile and cute, like wanting to adobt a lost kitten, then I can see this quality in myself. However, the original comments in this thread seemed to include other forms of longing that I do not see in myself and would be concerned about if I did. |
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abunai
Old Regular
Posts: 5463 Location: 露命 |
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Let me share with you an excerpt from a PM I recently wrote:
In other words, I view moe as a state of surrogate parenthood - but a parenthood that (because it isn't genetically biased by the individual being your actual offspring) is largely based on conscious choice, rather than parental instinct. So to speak, you love your own children, regardless of their nature, because they are yours - but moe is the emotion you feel when you look at a young female who isn't your offspring and think "I wish I had a daughter like that." Of course, with the infantilisation of adult females in Japan (the burikko phenomenon), it is hardly surprising that moe should extend to adult females as well. I suspect that this is the source of the sexualisation of moe among Japanese otaku, which makes us Westerners so uncomfortable - that the group of moe-able females in Japan extends into a later (and sexually active) age bracket. It isn't especially surprising, given the notable lack of sexual experience of the (stereo)typical otaku, that this should lead to confusion between between which females are legitimate targets of sexual attraction, and which are not. Possibly, this erasing of the boundaries between nubile and pre-nubile females may be the root cause of much of the lolicon phenomenon. In that model, lolicon is the result of an unfortunate combination of moe and burikko. And, as I said in that PM, there is an emotion corresponding to moe, that applies to presentable young males - the desire to be a role model, to take the young male and turn him into a younger version of yourself. I suspect it's a deeply-rooted primate/tribal thing. That this emotion does not have a catchy Japanese term to describe it, does not make it any less real. In conclusion... moe is a healthy, non-sexual thing. Combined with the tendency towards infantilisation of adult females in Japan, it can produce some unfortunate side effects - but these are artifacts of Japanese society and culture, and not directly a part of the concept of moe. We need not regard them as any more relevant to our experience than other innately Japanese concepts like, for instance, seppuku. -abunai |
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daxomni
Posts: 2650 Location: Somewhere else. |
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Okay, I'm cool with Moe now.
My vote is for Al from Last Exile (currently watching). She's fairly shy and cute and apparently needs some serious protection from some very determined foes. If it's not time to vote yet then just save this post for later. Why not just host a poll on some webpage somewhere? Some of the free sites allow polls, unless I'm mistaken. |
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abunai
Old Regular
Posts: 5463 Location: 露命 |
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Oh blast! I forgot a candidate!
Oh well, rules apply to everybody, including the tournament arrangers, so Winry Rockbell from Full Metal Alchemist will have to sit in the corner and play the wallflower... しくしく - abunai |
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dormcat
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 9902 Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan, ROC |
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Most poll systems (cookie-based) allows user to vote multiple times anonymously by deleting the cookie file. We want 1) One vote per person* 2) User who had registered prior to PantsGoblin's thread opener at 08:30 am GMT, Nov 23, 2005. Of course, one can create multiple accounts, but that's much more inefficient and troublesome than deleting cookie files.
Since you've mentioned one, well, so did I. 
Ai Enma, from Jigoku Shoujo. Another example of Mamiko Noto = moe. It's still unfinished even in Japan, so it's safe to leave it till next year. |
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dormcat
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 9902 Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan, ROC |
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Time for seeds nomination and grouping, I think. I'd say we better post reasons for nomination now, for there are only five candidates. Following abunai's guideline:
Two additional personal opinions: 1) Take visibility into count. Some characters have very devoted yet very small group of fans, particularly for unlicensed titles. 2) Kawaii (cute) != moe, although most, if not all, moe girls are kawaii. Cats are kawaii; catgirls are moe. I'll go first: 1. Chii from Chobits. Without an operating system, Chii virtually knows nothing about her surroundings and needs a lot of guidance and protection. Her cute smile and voice (thanks to Rie Tanaka) could bring out "awwww" from every man and most women (unless Chii poses as her rival). Plus, any man becomes a dirty old man in front of her. Albeit her innocent look, she eminates more seductive message than any other character on the list. 2. Misuzu Kamio from Air. Eager to seek for friendship and maternal love while spoiler[having a millenium-long curse over her shoulder], she is the most kawaisou girl in recent anime. Who would refuse to help this poor little girl spoiler[breaking the curse]? 3. Chise from SaiKano. A timid high schooler in front of Shuuji vs. an angel of death at the frontline who has difficulty to deal with her emotions and spoiler[degenerating body]. Similar to Misuzu, Chise is another female lead who would make you cry for her. 4. Alvis E. Hamilton from Last Exile. In addition to be mysterious, naive, innocent, and fragile, she begins to show spoiler[some budding affection towards Claus (of course, Lavie wouldn't be happy about it)]. This adds lots of points for her, because devotion is an important factor of moe concept. Her hairstyle and goat toy added her childish cuteness. 5. Henrietta from Gunslinger Girl. The only survived member of a massacre, Giuseppe (if you listen closely and/or have read the manga and examined name tags closely, you'll know his name is not José (Spanish) but Giuseppe (Italian)) has become her only relative on Earth. For her, Giuseppe is a father, a brother, a mentor, and possibly, a lover. It's her devotion and her timid/angel-of-death personality (similar to Chise's) have made her such a moe character. Honorable mention: Shinobu Maehara from Love Hina. Ken Akamatsu created her intentionally to fill the "onii-chan calling girl" role. I believe everyone in this thread knows her. 
Hmm, I've notice a common trait among them: each of them has a different sad story, forcing (?) the male lead to assist and protent her. For grouping: any suggestion other than using a randomizer? If not, I'm going to generate numbers and assign them to each nominee (except seeds). |
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abunai
Old Regular
Posts: 5463 Location: 露命 |
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All right.. I've gone through the last few posts before the deadline, and brought the list up to date. I've also marked the current organizer-selected seeds (5 of mine and 5 of dormcat's, so far) in blue, and the predetermined seeds (i.e. the Top32 from SaiMoe, and excluding the Gokujou Seitokai characters), shown in green
Since Dormcat gave reasons for his own five selections for seeds, I'd better do the same: 1. Orihime Inoue from Bleach - Despite her high intelligence, she's an airhead - a quirk of her childlike character. She maintains an unreasonably positive outlook, and her courage is impressive, albeit in a childishly innocent way. For all her strength, you get the impression that she is fragile and easily hurt. 2. Tohru Honda from Fruits Basket - Another character with an almost pathologically positive attitude to life. Any adversity is met with indomitable optimism. Even so, one gets the feeling that all her happiness could crumble at any moment. If that doesn't bring out the protective urge, I don't know what will. 3. Eri Sawachika from School Rumble - On the surface, Eri-chan appears to be strong and resilient. Her beauty, her wealth and her non-Japanese ancestry serve to set her apart from her classmates. Yet, underneath it all, she's clearly a lonely person. In a readers' poll of character popularity for the manga, Eri-chan (and Yakumo, who is already seeded due to her success in SaiMoe) easily nudged out the series' lead character, Tenma-chan. 4. Karen Onodera from Please Twins! - On the surface the weaker of the two female leads in Please Twins!, Karen has all the traits calculated to induce moe: she's timid, weak, indecisive, and sweet. Personally, I would prefer Miina, but I think that, of the two, Karen is more likely to be a winner. 5. Shinobu Maehara from Love Hina - I agree with dormcat. She's practically the epitome of the onii-chan girl. Akamatsu Ken knows his audience very well, and plays them like an instrument. She has to be considered a top seed. These aren't necessarily my favourite characters - but characters that I consider to have a good chance of winning, for the various reasons given. Therefore, they are my selections for seeds. LIST OF NOMINEES AND SEEDS Organizer-nominated seeds in blue; SaiMoe Top32 "automatic" seeds in green; Lead characters in bold Ah! My Goddess Skuld Sora Hasegawa Ai Yori Aoshi and sequel Ai Yori Aoshi ~ Enishi Aoi Sakuraba Chika Minazuki Taeko Minazuki Air Kannabi-no-mikoto Kano Kirishima Minagi Tohno Misuzu Kamio Aishiteruze Baby Yuzuyu Kokoro Takunaga Alien 9 Yuri Angelic Layer Misaki Suzuhara Shuko Suzuhara Aria Ai Akari Mizunashi Alice Alicia Florence Athena Azumanga Daioh Chiyo Mihama Ayumu "Osaka" Kasuga Sakaki Bleach Momo Hinamori Orihime Inoue Rukia Kuchiki Nanao Ise Soi Fong Yuzu Kurosaki Bokusatsu Tenshi Dokuro-chan Dokuro-chan Bottle Fairy Chiriri Hororo Kururu Sarara Tama-chan Cardcaptor Sakura Sakura Kinomoto Tomoyo Daidouji Chobits Chii Sumomo Chrono Crusade Azmaria Hendric Comic Party series Aya Hasebe Da Capo series Aisia Miharu Amakase Sakura Yoshino Di Gi Charat series Piyoko Puchiko Elfen Lied Mariko Mayu Nana Nyuu Fantastic Children Helga Figure 17 Hikaru Shiina Tsubasa Shiina FLCL Mamimi Samejima Fruits Basket Tohru Honda Kisa Sohma Full Metal Panic! Teletha "Tessa" Testarossa Full Moon wo Sagashite Mitsuki Kouyama Fushigiboshi no Futagohime Rain Futakoi + Futakoi Alternative Ai Chigusa Koi Chigusa Lala Hinagiku Lulu Hinagiku Kaoruko Ichijou Sumireko Ichijou Kira Sakurazaki Yura Sakurazaki Sara Shirogane Souju Shirogane Futatsu no Spica Asumi Kamogawa Marika Ukita Galaxy Angel Milfeulle Sakuraba Mint Blancmanche Vanilla H Gokujou Seitokai Ayumu Oume Cyndi Manabe Kanade Jinguuji Kaori Izumi Kuon Ginga Mayura Ichikawa Nanaho Kinjou Rein Tsunomoto Rino Randou Sayuri Hida Seina Katsura Green Green Futaba Kutsuki Sanae Minami Midori Chitose Gunslinger Girl Angelica Henrietta Rico Hanaukyo Maid-Tai series Cynthia / Grace Konoe Tsurugi Mariel He is my Master Anna Kurauchi Izumi Sawatari Mitsuki Sawatari Honey and Clover Ayumi "Ayu" Yamada Hagumi "Hagu-chan" Hanamoto Ichigeki Sacchu!! HoiHoi-san HoiHoi-san Ichigo Mashimaro Ana Chika Matsuri Miu Iriya no Sora, UFO no Natsu Kana Iriya Kamichu! Yurie Hitotsubashi Kannaduki no Miko Chikane Himemiya Kanon Ayu Tsukimiya Makoto Sawatari Nayuki Minase Key the Metal Idol Tokiko "Key" Mima Kiddy Grade Lumiere Viola Kimi ga Nozomu Eien Akane Suzumiya Ayu Daikuuji Haruka Suzumiya Mayu Tamano Koi Kaze Nanoka Kohinata Kokoro Library Kokoro Kurau: Phantom Memory Christmas Last Exile Alvis E. Hamilton Lavie Head Love Hina Moe Shinobu Maehara Mahoraba Asami Kurosaki (  OMG! We forgot to include Kozue-chan! Kill me now!)
Mahoromatic series Mahoro Minawa Mahou Shoujo Lyrical Nanoha Nanoha Takamachi Mai-HiME Akane Higurashi Mai Tokiha Midori Sugiura Natsuki Kuga Shizuru Fujino Mao-chan Mao Onigawara Misora Tsukishima Silvia Maruyama Maria-sama ga Miteru Shimako Toudou Yumi Fukuzawa Midori no Hibi Midori Kasugano Negima Nodoka "Honya-chan" Miyazaki Evangeline A. K. McDowell Setsuna Sakurazaki Konoka Konoe Ayaka Yukihiro Neoranga Laburey Now and Then, Here and There Lala-Ru Nurse Witch Komugi Komugi Nakahara Pani Poni Dash! Himeko Katagiri Rebecca Miyamoto PetoPeto-san Hatoko "Petoko" Fujimura Kuguru Sahara Chochomaru Sahara Nuri-chan Konuri-chan Piano Miu Nomura Pita Ten Misha Shia Koboshi Uematsu Please Twins! Ichigo Morino Karen Onodera Miina Miyafuji Mizuho Kazami Popotan Mi Princess Mononoke Kaya Rizelmine Rizel Iwaki Rozen Maiden Hina Ichigo Shinku Souseiseki Suigintou Suiseiseki Tomoe Kashiwaba SaiKano Chise Sakura Wars series Iris Chateaubriand School Rumble Eri Sawachika Tenma Tsukamoto Yakumo Tsukamoto Shakugan no Shana Shana Kazumi Yoshida Sister Princess series Aria Chikage Haruka Hinako Kaho Karen Mamoru Marie RinRin Sakuya Shirayuki Yotsuba Solty Rei Solty Revant Stratos 4 Karin Kikuhara Strawberry Eggs Fuko Kuzuha Sugar: A Little Snow Fairy Pepper Sugar Suzuka Honoka Sakurai Tactics Youko Tenchi Muyo! series Sasami The Place Promised in Our Early Days Sayuri Sawatari This Ugly and Beautiful World Akari Hikari Mari Nishino ToHeart series Akari Kamigishi Aoi Matsubara Kotone Himekawa Multi Serika Kurusugawa Tokyo Mew Mew Ichigo Momomiya / Mew Ichigo Tsukihime Akiha Tohno Arcueid Brunestud Hisui Kohaku Satsuki Yumizuka Tsukuyomi ~ Moon Phase Art Hazuki Uta~Kata Ichika Keiko Victorian Romance Emma Emma Whisper of the Heart Yuuko Harada Yakitate!! Japan Tsukino Azusagawa Yami to Boushi to Hon no Tabibito Hatsumi Azuma Yokohama Kaidashi Kiko Kokone Takatsu Zettai Shonen Kisa Tanigawa Zoids Genesis Rei Mii _____________ - abunai |
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Mohawk52
 Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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Excellent list, but I would have added Mamiji to Fruits Basket. spoiler[Yes I know she's a boy] but still she acts in a moe sort of way ne?
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angel_lover
Posts: 645 Location: UK |
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I guess that would rule out Momiji even if nominations hadn't closed now. |
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