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Hey, Answerman! - Personality Disorder


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ZeroGee



Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Posts: 43
PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 12:43 pm Reply with quote
While I agree that scanlations arent helping the creators and publishers, if scanlations disappeared overnight, the financal improvements may be marginal. Everybody is hurting in just about every business in every country. Plus it doesnt help that there's a glut of substandard titles to wade through. It's like the early 90's when Image hit it big, soon everyone and their grandmother jumped on the superhero comics bandwagon with multiple covers and cards and all the bells and whistles. A couple of years later only Marvel, DC and a diminished Image were left standing. I think history is repeating itself with the Manga and Anime industry. It happens with every glut in the industry.
The plus side is the deadwood is eliminated.
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CCSYueh



Joined: 03 Jul 2004
Posts: 2707
Location: San Diego, CA
PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 2:44 pm Reply with quote
gingi789 wrote:
And it aggrivates me to no end. I was on disc 3 of Shana when Geneon announced it was not going to distribute in the US anymore. I had to make a mad rush (because this was before Funimation took over the Geneon titles in the US) to find discs 4-6 because they wouldn't be available anymore.

I was buying Kyo Kara Maoh which had only a couple more dvds to go to complete, Story of Saiunkoku which was about 3 or 4 dvds into the run, El Hazard OVA's which were dropped like 2 dvds from completion, Shonen Onmyoji at the half-way point, Hellsing OVA, & Law of Ueki. There WAS no scramble. These just vanished. If I want to complete Law of Ueki, I have to buy the box set to cover the 2 or 3 dvds that were left. If I want all of El Hazard OVA's I have to buy the set to cover the last 3 or 5 eps. Both of these sets are on the expensive side. I was very grateful KKM, Shonen Onmyoji & Saiunkoku got picked up & I didn't have to buy box sets as they originally announced since it would have included re-buying the dvds I already had, but that's the price of admission.
gingi789 wrote:
(just out of curiosity, have you ever had anyone ask you "why do you bother to buy anime? You can get it online for free")

Yep. VAriations. People I knew who bought a lot like I do brag they stopped because they can get it for free. I've seen people brag they have no hard copy, just XX gigs on their computer. Stray idiots at Best Buy informing me I can download instead of pay for it.

I didn't have that problem everyone complained about with Toradora, but it wasn't a title I think I'll continue with. As a gal, the only interest I have in fan service guy titles is humor-the Tsundere or whatever the hell they are mean nothing to me. Persona has Koyasu. I'll support a premium title for his work. My main interest in Super Robot Wars was Koyasu is Shu-damn cool role.

Though, i have to ask a question: was there really someone that boneheaded at Comic-con to ask the creators "why bring it over when everyone's already seen it illegally?" [/quote]

I'd run into this little (though she actually lookd to be older than teen) InuYasha Fangirl-FANGIRL fangirl-dressed as Kagome once or twice who at those encounters went on about how much she loived InuYasha & couldn't understand why we couldn't see it when the get it in Japan. I explained lag times are normal-look at Hollywood movies getting different release dates throughout the world, but her feeling was she just couldn't wait because she loved it so much. Of course I told her she shouldn't. I saw her march up to the front row of the Viz panel which is a place I never go to thank you & I couldn't really see who asked the question, but the reaction/gasps were memorable. My daughter could see it was that fangirl (she hated her the minute we spoke with her over the downloading issue). The issue was she downloaded because she couldn't wait because she loved it so much, but that was not something one says to Viz reps. It had to be around the height of anime's popularity when actual pirate dvds out of Hong Kong were maybe the bigger issue.

It comes down to rights & selfishness. Society has certain rules & conventions it follows to maintain the veneer of civility. In the name of getting along, we respect one another's rights to varying degrees. Some of us are more respectful than others. Some see nothing to cutting in line without a word. Some commit crimes because their wants/needs/desires come first & to hell with everyone else.
In polite society we say "please" & "Thank you" & we ask permission before infringing on the rights of another. We respect people who work to produce something vs the perception of being on the government dole. If someone didn't clean those toilets, there'd be hell to pay so one really can't look down on most working stiffs.
So what we have in fansubs is the people who put them up without permission & the people who download them again without permission are putting their own selfish desires over the rights of the holders of the copyright. Whatever one's justification, the downloader is saying "I am taking this thing I know does not in any way compensate the author because [insert lame excuse]"-I'm a starving student/it's not available in my area/I hate TP/whatever. They are all excuses to put your wants & needs over the pretty legitimate wants & needs of the creators to be compensated for their hard work.
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mdo7



Joined: 23 May 2007
Posts: 5900
Location: Cypress, Texas, USA
PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 10:34 pm Reply with quote
on the topic of E-reader to read manga. I do support that because I want to reduce cutting down tree (I'm a science nerd) and also can probably help reduce illegal scanlation. Although I can understand people want a physical copy of the manga because some of us are traditional manga reader.

Also I like to agree as a fan that in order to keep the anime industry going is to support the creator and the company that promoted their creation. BUY THE DVD/EPISODES AND BUY THE MANGA!!!! Don't pirate them. Don't watch illegal fansubs and scanlation, it won't contribute to the industry. Also watching illegal fansubs is just like pirating video game. ANIME FANS NEEDS TO START CONTRIBUTING TO THE INDUSTRYS!!! I agree companies can do more like for me I would love to see more Co-productions and anime based on western IPs since those usually sell better look at Batman: Gotham Knight, and Halo Legends they did so well and their DVD sales sold over 100,000 units. I can't remember the last time a obscure or mainstream anime that sold more then 100,000 units. Also I like to see more companies doing more simulcast like what Funimation and Crunchyroll and Viz are doing.

About the actors/actresses that dub anime. It's not only because of their anime work. Some (maybe most) anime dub VAs do a lot of video game and non-anime animation. Steve Blum, Yuri Lowenthal, Crispin Freeman, Roger Craig Smith, Kari Whalgren, and probably other anime VAs are famous because of their video game and non-anime animation work. I remember I talk to a lot of people on Kotaku and asking them how they got to know Steve Blum and here was a surprise answer most of the fans know Blum because of his video game work and his role as Wolverine. They weren't aware of his anime work until later. However, only quite a small portions of his fan on Kotaku has acknowleged his anime work. So yeah the VA that do anime dub, video game voiceover, and non-anime animation will probably have more devotion because of their non-anime work. I bet you if Wendee Lee replace Jennifer Hale as the voice of female Commander Sheperd, Wendee Lee could get more fanbase beyond anime fandom. If Luci Christian somehow ended up voicing a main character in a future Disney film, that would give her more fanbase beyond anime and she could end up doing non-anime animation voice-work.

One more thing, I know a lot of US anime fan also like Japanese VAs. But is it possible for a Japanese-speaking fan in Japan to maybe be a fan of English VAs because I remember reading a interesting topic on Mania about how the Japanese like our dubs in anime and how some VA are well-liked in Japan. Do English VAs that dub anime have fanbase in Japan? I remember reading that Vic Mignogna visiting a resturant in Japan and one waitress recognized him because she watched FMA in English dub and called her other Japanese-speaking friends over and later Vic is taking picture with Japanese waitress and signing autograph for them. This is probably the only one time Japanese-speaker do seem to appreciate English dub in anime. Also please recall Japanese fan sometime import Region 1 DVD of the anime.
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YotaruVegeta



Joined: 02 Jul 2002
Posts: 1050
Location: New York
PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 11:15 pm Reply with quote
There certainly are words in this thread.
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Norbie



Joined: 15 Jul 2008
Posts: 126
PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 9:26 am Reply with quote
I have a small suggestion what Anime Companies could do to help Anime.

How about release the follwing:
Release Space Battleship Yamato, or Sailor Moon, or how about Rose of Versailles.

That's just a few ideas.

Or how about "Do You Remember Love"

I know it's a copout, and the reality is that the Japanse Companies lack of respect to it's own fans in USA/Western Market is the root of it all.
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CCSYueh



Joined: 03 Jul 2004
Posts: 2707
Location: San Diego, CA
PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 1:02 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
What's the big attraction to voice actors?


As I finished D.Gray-Man Vol 9, I found this in the author's comments on watching them film the 2nd episode--
Hoshino is the manga-ka. Adam his assistant.
Quote:
ADAM: Voice actors sure are amazing
HOSINO: Well, this is how they make their living! They're beings from another world.
ADAM: I think I'd be scared to be close to them.
HOSHINO: Yeah. I'd probably wet my pants!!

Specific comments on VA's-
Quote:
The actor that shone the brightest that day was Mr. Konishi who played Komui, it was like he was possessed by Komui

If you aren't the type that notices actors all that much, you may wonder why people care, why is everyone gaga over Kamina/Gurren Lagann but this is it. There are new kid VAs. There are average VAs. And there are the ones who make it sound incredible.

I think Blum had an edge being Spike/Bebop & Tom/Toonami. He's been kicking around a long time & really is pretty familiar. People who don't pay attention to actor voices still probably remember him from other shows & stuff. The issue is overall American fans don't pay attention to voice actors. For a long time VAs weren't really respected in the US because REAL actors made their money in front of the camera. I remember Hal Linden on the Mike Douglas show when I was a child talking about dubbing foreign stuff just to pay the bills. Even now, talk to the average movie-goer & most will just have a blank stare if you go past the famous actors portions of the latest animated movie in the theaters. The "supplimental" voices after Mike Myers or Eddie Murphy & other people recognizible from in front of the camera mean nothing to most American fans.
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agila61



Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 3213
Location: NE Ohio
PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 2:11 pm Reply with quote
Norbie wrote:
I have a small suggestion what Anime Companies could do to help Anime.

How about release the follwing:
Release Space Battleship Yamato, or Sailor Moon, or how about Rose of Versailles.

That's just a few ideas.

Or how about "Do You Remember Love"


While Rose of Versailles would be appreciated by its fans, the question for a release is how that appreciation translates into income.

As a long finished work, an official release will not generate a big initial sales spike. Yet it is a widely recognized "shojo foundation work", and would be an attractive addition to any shojo catalog, whether manga or anime.

So I think the manga might make an excellent title in something like the volunteer translator OpenManga model ... and indeed would be an excellent one for Crunchyroll to pursue the right to accept member-submitted subtitles.

Quote:
I know it's a copout, and the reality is that the Japanse Companies lack of respect to it's own fans in USA/Western Market is the root of it all.


I can't say I understand this perfectly, because I am not clear on what "it" is in "the root of it all" ... but from sources on the ground like TokyoGodfather, it's more like the decision makers in the Japanese companies don't understand their fans, and particularly their supporting fans, in Western markets. It is by and large a mystery to them why we like this stuff.
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CCSYueh



Joined: 03 Jul 2004
Posts: 2707
Location: San Diego, CA
PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 7:32 pm Reply with quote
Norbie wrote:
Sailor Moon

Sailor Moon is held up for reasons no one outside of the license holders knows. Word on the ANN board was the reasons put forth on most boards (which mostly deal with Toei wanting too much or refusing to release it) don't wash.

As for older stuff like Rose of Versailles, older titles tend not to do well.
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Sunday Silence



Joined: 22 Jun 2010
Posts: 2047
PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 8:46 pm Reply with quote
agila61 wrote:
It is by and large a mystery to them why we like this stuff.


Your answer.
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Mohawk52



Joined: 16 Oct 2003
Posts: 8180
Location: England, UK
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 5:51 am Reply with quote
agila61 wrote:
I can't say I understand this perfectly, because I am not clear on what "it" is in "the root of it all" ... but from sources on the ground like TokyoGodfather, it's more like the decision makers in the Japanese companies don't understand their fans, and particularly their supporting fans, in Western markets. It is by and large a mystery to them why we like this stuff.
That was the case up until 2007. They know it all too well now as like in Horton Hears a Who the villagers had finally heard us saying "WE ARE HERE!" then. Sadly they also found out that the pirates and funsubbers had beat them to it as well.
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CCSYueh



Joined: 03 Jul 2004
Posts: 2707
Location: San Diego, CA
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 10:40 am Reply with quote
But they still don't get it, Mowhawk. As I said, I found the comment made by the Bandai USA head about Amazon & reverse importation to be very much this is still where their heads are in Japan. The argument lies in did fansubbers ever have the right to do what they did? (No).
Had fansubs never existed, I believe, thanks to Pokemon & YuGiOh whetting the tastes of an entire generation, we would still have had the anime boom &, lacking fansubs' existance, anime fans would either have learned like fans of other things how to purchase anime without watching the entire damned series for free or only stuff aired on tv would be big. The companies in Japan still seem stuck in the old school of thought that the hardcore otaku in Japan is their #1 fan that they can abuse with obscenely high prices, yet over on the Akamatsu thread about anime trends, we see the male audience has lost buying power while the female audience has grown, yet the anime companies continued to churn out hardcore otaku anime & them are aghast at their revenue loss.

Evolve or become extinct. They really don't seem to get it. Tradition may kill them.
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agila61



Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 3213
Location: NE Ohio
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 7:26 pm Reply with quote
CCSYueh wrote:
Evolve or become extinct. They really don't seem to get it. Tradition may kill them.


And because so many people have had to leave the industry to make a living and raise a family, precious few in the industry who can bridge the gap between the older men in the decision making positions and the very young cohort of people doing much of the work making the anime ~ which adds to an additional dimension to the loss of Satoshi Kon.
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Mohawk52



Joined: 16 Oct 2003
Posts: 8180
Location: England, UK
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 2:08 pm Reply with quote
CCSYueh wrote:
But they still don't get it, Mowhawk. As I said, I found the comment made by the Bandai USA head about Amazon & reverse importation to be very much this is still where their heads are in Japan.
I agree, but to me it's not that don't get it by now, it's more they don't know how to go about doing anything about it and move forward. Again the Japanese way of always being in denial until it's glaringly obvious has hindered their ability to do anything inventive about it, but having said that it's still early days since the lid was lifted exposing them to the situation. Wait and see.

Quote:
The argument lies in did fansubbers ever have the right to do what they did? (No).
Had fansubs never existed, I believe, thanks to Pokemon & YuGiOh whetting the tastes of an entire generation, we would still have had the anime boom &, lacking fansubs' existance, anime fans would either have learned like fans of other things how to purchase anime without watching the entire damned series for free or only stuff aired on tv would be big. The companies in Japan still seem stuck in the old school of thought that the hardcore otaku in Japan is their #1 fan that they can abuse with obscenely high prices, yet over on the Akamatsu thread about anime trends, we see the male audience has lost buying power while the female audience has grown, yet the anime companies continued to churn out hardcore otaku anime & them are aghast at their revenue loss.

Evolve or become extinct. They really don't seem to get it. Tradition may kill them.
This is the inertia, and inventiveness I was talking about. They are trying. Wink
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