Forum - View topicREVIEW: Yurikuma Arashi BD+DVD
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Razor/Edge
Posts: 607 |
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When I saw who was reviewing this series, I immediately knew it was going to get an A. I'd say there is a whole letter grade, if not more, of biased here. Considering the subject matter of the series being pro-LGBT and Hope being trans, it was obvious that this is a biased review. Really should have gotten somebody other than her to do this review, as I really can't any stock in it due to the biased. Though ANN is a pretty big Shonen Jump Weekly site, so the review would have been more or less the same either way. Last edited by Razor/Edge on Fri Aug 12, 2016 4:54 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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Shay Guy
Posts: 2130 |
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Tough questions here! I think the heart of it is that my problems with Ikuhara aren't a matter of absent positives (boredom, lack of emotional resonance, etc.) but present negatives. So his genius shines through even while I'm frustrated by the things he's asking me to just roll with. That said, if I had watched Penguindrum as a teenager, I might not have liked it -- I've been making a conscious effort lately to branch out in my media intake and develop my palate more. (Penguindrum was the first of the three I watched, and I think it's my least favorite. I hear it has a lot more resonance for people who came from bad households? But the story felt chaotic to me, and it has some of the most confusing metaphors/mechanics. I should rewatch that one too to see if I get it better... though from what I've heard of the official release, I might stick to fansubs.)
The chief oddity about this to me is that it ties the asteroid that shares the goddess's name to the church that worships the goddess rather than the goddess itself. Plus you have to ask how it fits into the climax... and come to think of it, the church is presented as a bear institution, not a human institution. There's also some interesting questions to be asked here about where homophobia comes from IRL, and how much religious institutions have contributed to stigmatizing lesbians vs. gay men, and how the linked stigmas differ, and what the historical timeline for all this is like (I only remember some of what I read in Marriage: A History).
I've seen commentary on the differences between catering to straight male viewers and catering to queer female viewers in the context of this show... but I'm not sure where, and I'm not remotely qualified to comment myself. Something about T&A vs. yonic imagery? That said, while you could certainly have a trashy fanservice series made by lesbians for lesbians, I think it'd be different in theme, plot, characterization, etc. from what we see in YKA. Compare the tone, timing, and context of Ginko's wild fantasies in episode 5 to the antics you might see in Generic Harem Or Reverse Harem Anime #372. My ability to tell whether a story has something to say or is just talking is still shaky, but YKA is definitely the former. Actually, come to think of it... even in stories where the audience isn't there for the plot, you still have to have one. So what are the easiest plot types to use in those cases? Battle tournaments and such? Not what you see in YKA, surely. (EDIT: Also, rom-com antics taken from the slurry of 8th-generation Urusei Yatsura descendants. Point is, there are plots you fall back on when you don't know what your point is, what your themes are. Generally, you take them from a better story.) Last edited by Shay Guy on Thu Aug 11, 2016 6:07 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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SejinPK
Posts: 129 |
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Yeah, these are pretty much my exact reservations about my analysis, and then some. You make good points, and the things you mention in the second paragraph I quoted are things I hadn't thought about. I also keep forgetting that it's not bears = lesbians and humans = straight people. >.< Honestly, my understanding of some of the ending stuff regarding the goddess Kumaria and the Judgmens' actions at the very end is really hazy. At this point, all I remember is having some vague thoughts about how it might be related to hypocrisy within religion, but at this point I need a re-watch to be able to clarify my thoughts and understanding.
I know you weren't responding to me with this, but I wanted to say that I think the distinction between T&A and yonic imagery makes a lot of sense. There's a lot of that kind of imagery throughout the show, not just in the fanservice scenes. I remember looking up a bunch of stuff online regarding the imagery, because it's not something I knew anything about. The main things I recall finding were that fish and diamonds (which is the shape of the pattern on the Door of Friends) are symbols for the vagina (can I say that here?). In addition, I remember reading about how Kureha and Sumika's discussion in the first episode about different kinds of fish-related food is essentially a big innuendo (it might've actually been here on ANN where I read that). |
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Arale Kurashiki
Posts: 753 |
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Firstly, the creator will very rarely give straight (hehe) answers to anything, ever. I've heard the YKA DVDs do contain commentary, but I don't know what's on them - if it's anything like Utena's commentary, it will show that he understands what's going on but won't put it into words for you. In one shockingly lucid statement from him though, I believe he has described how bears are portrayed in society as either dangerous predators or cute mascots, a description you can also apply to lesbians in anime. So that was perhaps the most blatant I've seen him talk about this. (There's a lot of YKA interviews in the books that I've never seen translated.) It's also worth mentioning that there isn't really that much sexual imagery in the show. The flower scene and the OP are really popular, but said flower scene is only in the first three episodes and disappears afterwards. Some people have likened this to a sort of "trap" for the anime viewerbase, and indeed, I have heard that men who watched it for those scenes stopped watching far before the end. Humorously, Utena was actually waaaay more sexual, though in a more general sense and using more obtuse symbolism. (Also restating my frustration with how the comments about Ikuhara dubs in the article are complete lies because that still is bothering me) |
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AnimeLordLuis
Posts: 1626 Location: The Borderlands of Pandora |
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Yuri Kuma Arashi is one of my favorite shows from 2015 and although the plot is a little difficult to follow than most series it still makes for a fantastic and compelling story that will entertain fans of different backgrounds for years to come. Also I thought that the English dub was great especially considering that it was one of Funimation's first simulcast dubs and the fact that Funimation cared enough to use some of there best talent.
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Shay Guy
Posts: 2130 |
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One thing I didn't think to mention about my enjoyment of Ikuhara's anime -- if all else fails, they can be appreciated on an extremely superficial level thanks to the sheer wackiness. If things get too dark or confusing, wait an episode and there'll be surfing stalker elephants or a kid coming back from being kicked into a volcano or any of the Princess of the Crystal's antics. He doesn't ask you to turn your brain off, but he does let you give it a rest.
Ah, so the bears in YKA are written as one and drawn as the other! |
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DuelGundam2099
Posts: 533 |
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Girls und Panzer and KanColle seemed to do it, no reason this couldn't. I also don't find it farfetched they forgot to include guys.
You're talking to a guy that gives Syfy and Asylum mockbuster movies unironic 10/10s on a regular basis, to me any kind of thing can just "happen". I notice that early Syfy movies tend to have a random person killed off gruesomely by something unrelated to the titular threat. The meaning? Probably none.
Because good writers usually bother to explain and give coherent understanding to their setting. Not doing that gives the impression nobody cared or intent including insulting the audience, either way it deserves to be called out.
Why? Because I can point out holes in a story that make no sense? A story can be symbolic and ambitious all it wants, but at the end of the day that isn't anywhere near as relevant as "does it do what it is supposed to do properly" I also don't understand the model-train-building portion.
And the fact they never went anywhere with this further proves bad writing from an in-universe perspective unless they come out and admit asexual reproduction is a thing. In fact SeijinPK even mentioned
Although for all we know it may have been an icy comet that came into contact with a bunch of phosphorous or something similar that reacts violently to water, I imagine a post apocalyptic setting after a global war wouldn't keep a lot of reliable astronomical records lying around.
Is this your theory or did someone on staff explicitly say this? |
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Arale Kurashiki
Posts: 753 |
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The fact that you ask this question shows that you are not able to perceive this whatsoever. What I said is an observation on the world as the world of anime. It is not a "theory" or a "fact", but instead an "analysis". Have you watched Madoka? It's popular, so even though I like it, it shows an easy to refer to example of the exact phenomenon that YKA is critiquing here. Even though Madoka revolves around relationships between females in all of its aspects, there is also the presence of Kyosuke Kamijo, the only significant male character in the show, and his role is of a love interest to Sayaka, even though the show's promotional materials would have you believe that Sayaka and Kyoko happens. Reia's partner is the same thing as Kyosuke. He is a male character who exists to create a straight relationship in a show about non-straight interactions. (If any of you are about to quote me to try and defend PMMM, I probably would agree with you; again, this is just an easy to refer to example of the phenomenon, I do not think it's a "problematic" show.) Reia's partner therefore never shows up on screen because he would have no role to play. He exists ONLY as a piece in a relationship. In some anime, female characters are the focus, but for the sake of male viewers relationship pieces have to be inserted into the world in order to not lose that male audience. This is much to the dismay of Yuriika who comes from the more sexual side of the yuri genre, one in which concepts like "purity" and "moe" need not apply. No matter how much Yuriika thought that Reia and her had a relationship, the rules of the human world were ones of what we in our world would call 'queerbaiting'. That's what Yuriika experienced; finding what she thought was a story she could relate to (look! the girls are flirting!) only to find that, in the end, the status quo could not be broken. |
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DuelGundam2099
Posts: 533 |
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I tend to classify opinions under theory so pardon the misunderstanding. I am assuming your analysis is opinion based since you denied it as a fact.
It was one of the worst anime I've ever seen, most of my problems with YKA apply to it with the addition of a titular MC that does nothing, a creepy opening segment, and an inconsistent tone but I consider it better because I tolerated the ending theme and last quarter.
I'm pretty sure yuri didn't occur in Madoka Magica, but if you're referring to the movies I have not seen those.
You lost me. First off, how is that a good thing? Is it good because it might have commented on something? That isn't a factor when you look into the execution. Second, that's lesbian porn in general, meaning if what you say is true this should have been a hentai if that is what the goal was. Third, that doesn't excuse other glaring problems. Fourth, if someone unfamiliar with these trends or whatever went into this how are they supposed to find out on their own? Most won't and in Japan it flopped because of it. Fifth, I don't see any of that when I watched it, partially due to the previous point, but also because I usually don't care and even if I did I don't know how to start, I never took a normal literature class (kind of glad). |
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Shay Guy
Posts: 2130 |
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OK, let me step back a bit and ask a broader question. What are stories for?
If you take a few ranks in Critic, so to speak, you can see the author's hand at work a lot of the time. It's like... well, imagine you're watching a movie and there's a guy in a room, agitated, focused. He's running around, pulling drawers out of a dresser, yanking things out of them, looking very intently into them, hurriedly moving from one to the next, doing the same with the insides of cabinets and so on. Now, you don't need the guy to actually say he's looking for something he thinks is hidden in the room, because his actions say it quite clearly. It's the same with someone creating a work of fiction. If they know what they're doing, you can learn to tell what that is, just from observing the work. If you read a long enough excerpt from Gadsby, for instance, you can tell its author wasn't just avoiding the letter E by happenstance. It's not always that easy; I wouldn't have picked up on the cute/dangerous thing on my own. But it is plain as day to me that men are intentionally absent from YKA, outside special exceptions. As I've said, my critical vocabulary is underdeveloped, and I don't know how well I can articulate the logic. But it bears (ha ha) all the signs of a deliberate choice. Taking it back to the original quote, we don't have to be told male characters are being blocked from appearing because we can see Ikuhara blocking them from appearing.
It's a little weirder than this, though, because IIRC all Yuriika's jealousy is focused on Kureha. It's not presented as "I loved her, she loved him" -- they don't even think about "him". In retrospect, it's almost more of a new-baby-sibling narrative? "There's someone else in her heart now"? He's entirely written out of the picture, enough to make room for parthenogenesis jokes. |
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jr240483
Posts: 4380 Location: New York City,New York,USA |
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at least this yuri romance had the time to develop and its well done with its ending making sure everyone didn't feel they missed something, though its no surprise since its the same director that did utena.
and at least the series didn't just rushed the whole thing to get a couple out of knowhere just to prove a point unlike cough* cough* legend of korra. |
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Naera
Posts: 9 |
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I suspect the irony of being an ANN male reviewer complaining how Ikuhara being male might be inappropriate for the yuri story is somewhat lost on Jacob Chapman.
This is not about anime, but since it basically opens the review it triggered me enough. Where and how Blue is the Warmest Color "pedestalizes, fetishizes or otherwise alienates the love story between female characters"? |
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One-Eye
Posts: 2261 |
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I did not see in the review where JC was "complaining" about Ikuhara being male was inappropriate. I did see JC explain that some people might have a problem because stories with LGBTQ characters have not always been handled well. JC further explained:
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whiskeyii
Posts: 2247 |
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Nah, that's a pretty common complaint I've seen trotted out, and not just about this show. By default, any lesbian-directed yuri show would be far more true to life about lesbian experiences than a yuri show directed by a guy, who, by definition, can only experience it second-hand. I might eventually give this show a try; I'm still on the fence about whether I like Ikuhara, or just Utena as a show, since that's about all my experience with the man. Regardless, if I do try out this show, I'm probably gonna' need a heaping help of other recap blogs to help me sort through all the symbolism. One reviewer is not enough, apparently, when it comes to Ikuhara. Also, correct me if I'm wrong, DuelGundam2099, but are you the same person who said they don't believe in metaphors on the Paranoia Agent page? If so, I don't think you're going to find satisfactory answers here. That's like asking what Rosencrantz and Guildenstern was about and expecting "two guys waiting for somebody" and getting the longer, more involved answer about meta-theatrics, existentialism, and all that jazz instead. Yurikuma is mired in metaphors from head-to-toe, and understanding it on any level other than surface-level is going to require accepting the metaphors as such (though I'm sure posters far more intelligent than I would be happy to explain the metaphors to you in more detail if need be). |
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DuelGundam2099
Posts: 533 |
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Entertainment and education.
Yes and that doesn't mean that is a good thing automatically.
Even ignoring how bad that book was, that isn't exactly something most people would notice or even care. You can say the same thing about a paragraph not having the letter X, does that mean anything? Probably not and even if it did that doesn't make the paragraph good (especially if it's about animal cruelty).
Just because something appears to be obvious does not make it so nor is an absence of evidence equate to evidence for absence. This problem can easily be avoided had whoever was writing just proclaim asexual reproduction.
The one and only.
Metaphors or not, simply having them (if they are even there) does not equate to good, it has to make sense unless the primary genre is dementia, which it is not. In fact sacrificing order for mere themes undercuts it. |
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