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Answerman - Is It Ethical To Import Anime From Other Countries?


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TarsTarkas



Joined: 20 Dec 2007
Posts: 5836
Location: Virginia, United States
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 8:34 pm Reply with quote
NeverConvex wrote:

This 'frankly it's none of our business' sentiment is something I have a hard time getting behind. These are businesses, not people; they need privacy only to the extent that it is a significant competitive advantage. Keeping consumers carefully informed about the structure of business is incredibly important to maintaining a healthy business ecology and business-consumer relationship; I don't buy at all that it's "none of our business."


It is not their job to keep consumers carefully informed. They are in it for the money, and may be a little of their inner fan.

If consumers know of a company's inner workings, so too will their rivals. They may lose contracts too, because of this knowledge.
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Megiddo



Joined: 24 Aug 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:03 pm Reply with quote
Talking about Aussie ratings, as someone who has imported a good number of titles from there I'm flabberghasted by some of the ratings. For instance, Nichijou has an M rating and Kaiba has a PG rating. Do they just throw darts to determine the rating? How does Kaiba which is laced with drugs, violence, and sex end up with a more acceptable rating than Nichijou?

Last edited by Megiddo on Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:03 pm; edited 1 time in total
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harminia



Joined: 24 Aug 2015
Posts: 2003
Location: australia
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:03 pm Reply with quote
TarsTarkas wrote:
It is not their job to keep consumers carefully informed. They are in it for the money, and may be a little of their inner fan.

If consumers know of a company's inner workings, so too will their rivals. They may lose contracts too, because of this knowledge.


Yeah, contract info, and a lot of other stuff, is confidential so that cannot be shared with outsiders. There's a big limit on how much a company could publically share, especially when not every fan actually is interested.
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NeverConvex
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Joined: 08 Jun 2013
Posts: 2311
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:14 pm Reply with quote
TarsTarkas wrote:
It is not their job to keep consumers carefully informed. They are in it for the money, and may be a little of their inner fan.


Though true, this is not relevant to what I said. I made no assertions about what companies' motivations typically are, nor what their 'jobs' are, only about what the social expectation of them should be. That's not part of their jobs; it is part of their role in the social contract that is involved in their being allowed to do business in a nation, to benefit from its infrastructure and judicial system, etc etc.

TarsTarkas wrote:
If consumers know of a company's inner workings, so too will their rivals. They may lose contracts too, because of this knowledge.


I agree that sometimes privacy is important to genuine competitive advantage (e.g. with major intellectual property), which is why I literally pointed exactly this out in the post to which you're replying. However, it is difficult to see what competitive advantage there is in keeping the terms of international DVD sales secret, unless secrecy is being misused to hoodwink business partners, which isn't much of a justification.

Businesses and governments should both be expected to provide clear justification for secrecy, not to default to it. They are not people, and treating them as if they are is a gross subversion of any natural ethics.
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harminia



Joined: 24 Aug 2015
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Location: australia
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:34 pm Reply with quote
Megiddo wrote:
Talking about Aussie ratings, as someone who has imported a good number of titles from there I'm flabberghasted by some of the ratings. For instance, Nichijou has an M rating and Kaiba has a PG rating. Do they just throw darts to determine the rating? How does Kaiba which is laced with drugs, violence, and sex end up with a more acceptable rating than Nichijou?


As someone that has a certificate to classify stuff in Australia I can tell you there'd be a reason behind it. Can't say for those certain titles, but there's a bunch of things to take into consideration.
However, from the classification website (which is viewable by anyone) I can see:
Nichijou Collection 1: moderate impact sex/sexual themes (haven't really seen the show but may have been the yaoi?)
Nichijou coll 2: Same as above.
Kaiba: Doesn't have an image to let me see the details but I guess the effects may have been mitigated in some way, or just implied. I haven't seen the show so I don't know what the levels are actually like.
There's also factors like: Who the members of the board were at the time, when it was sent (as things may have been looser in the past and stricter now), etc. Kaiba was done in 2011 whilst Nichijou was 2013. Who knows what might've happened in those 2 years.
And then there's also whether a title is self classified (by the company) or not. Sometimes that can effect the gravity of the rating.
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encrypted12345



Joined: 25 Jan 2012
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:40 pm Reply with quote
This doesn't apply to anime as much nowadays because it is no longer very niche, but one reason a company may withhold a license is because they are afraid of reverse importation. It's why English subtitles are often forced with a Japanese dub, to make reverse importation less attractive. IIRC, sometimes the English is also intentionally made to look worse than the Japanese release, though I don't think that is nearly as common nowadays.
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H. Guderian



Joined: 29 Jan 2014
Posts: 1255
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:42 pm Reply with quote
Is it Ethical to buy something?

Yes.

Most of these markets are fighting to get low prices for their own markets. If they manage to achieve such low prices, wouldn't all consumers benefit from said price? The alternative to going broke is to pirate. All avenues this comes up as "Yes, do it."
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ScruffyKiwi



Joined: 25 Oct 2010
Posts: 675
Location: New Zealand
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:56 pm Reply with quote
Megiddo wrote:
Talking about Aussie ratings, as someone who has imported a good number of titles from there I'm flabberghasted by some of the ratings. For instance, Nichijou has an M rating and Kaiba has a PG rating. Do they just throw darts to determine the rating? How does Kaiba which is laced with drugs, violence, and sex end up with a more acceptable rating than Nichijou?


I always wondered how Kaiba managed to get a PG rating. After all there's a scene where spoiler[a character has sex with her own body using Kaiba's body (selfcest?) and accidentally (i think) killed her own body! (did that sound confusing???)]. The advantage that Kaiba had was that the animation style was very cartoonish and fluid so nothing looked particularly realistic.
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CatSword



Joined: 01 Jul 2014
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 10:12 pm Reply with quote
Megiddo wrote:
Talking about Aussie ratings, as someone who has imported a good number of titles from there I'm flabberghasted by some of the ratings. For instance, Nichijou has an M rating and Kaiba has a PG rating. Do they just throw darts to determine the rating? How does Kaiba which is laced with drugs, violence, and sex end up with a more acceptable rating than Nichijou?


It absolutely seems like a dartboard sometimes. FLCL is a G, Kaiba is a PG, Nichijou is an M, Azumanga Daioh is an MA15+, and Kill la Kill is an R18+. Laughing
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NeverConvex
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Joined: 08 Jun 2013
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 10:14 pm Reply with quote
encrypted12345 wrote:
This doesn't apply to anime as much nowadays because it is no longer very niche, but one reason a company may withhold a license is because they are afraid of reverse importation. It's why English subtitles are often forced with a Japanese dub, to make reverse importation less attractive. IIRC, sometimes the English is also intentionally made to look worse than the Japanese release, though I don't think that is nearly as common nowadays.


What is "reverse importation"?
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Megiddo



Joined: 24 Aug 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 10:19 pm Reply with quote
Reverse importation in this case would be Japanese consumers deciding to import the cheaper foreign release instead of the more expensive Japanese domestic release.
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Top Gun



Joined: 28 Sep 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 10:22 pm Reply with quote
Megiddo wrote:
Talking about Aussie ratings, as someone who has imported a good number of titles from there I'm flabberghasted by some of the ratings. For instance, Nichijou has an M rating and Kaiba has a PG rating. Do they just throw darts to determine the rating? How does Kaiba which is laced with drugs, violence, and sex end up with a more acceptable rating than Nichijou?

I also found it amusing that two out of the three or four Aussie titles I've imported had updated ratings stickers slapped over the ratings box on the cover, since apparently the process is byzantine enough that the ratings board couldn't properly make up their minds.
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NeverConvex
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Joined: 08 Jun 2013
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 10:37 pm Reply with quote
Megiddo wrote:
Reverse importation in this case would be Japanese consumers deciding to import the cheaper foreign release instead of the more expensive Japanese domestic release.


Ah, I see - thanks.
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fuuma_monou



Joined: 26 Dec 2005
Posts: 1817
Location: Quezon City, Philippines
PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:32 am Reply with quote
The domestic anime translation industry is more or less geared to doing Tagalog dubs for TV, so if I want Blu-rays or even DVDs, I have to import them, usually from the U.S. The "licensed for distribution and sale in the U.S. and Canada only" notices amuse me.
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Zin5ki



Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 6680
Location: London, UK
PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:33 am Reply with quote
Top Gun wrote:
Don't sell your region short; the UK has several prominent series/movies I've imported that are nowhere to be seen over here. You guys made out far better with Satoshi Kon's works than we did (a BD of Perfect Blue, a dubbed Millennium Actress, Paranoia Agent still in-print), you got a proper BD release of Metropolis, and you have that nice BD copy of the 1997 Berserk series. That's not even mentioning the Anime Limited releases that go for far less than their Aniplex of America counterparts. Hell, depending on the shows you like, in some respect you guys are doing better than we are.

A matter of the grass being greener, perhaps. While the UK is indeed amply catered for regarding theatrical works, a significant number of the TV and OVA solicitations announced by Nozomi, Funimation, Discotek and the like have only a slim chance of being viable releases on these shores. Indeed, even the ones that make the cut can incur substantial delays due to various technical and legal matters. Luckily, Crunchyroll offsets this imbalance up to a point, but many of classics still evade us.
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