Forum - View topicInterview: Aniplex Inc. President Koichiro Natsume
|
Goto page Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 Next Note: this is the discussion thread for this article |
| Author | Message | |||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
|
PrecisionCrab
Posts: 215 |
|
|||||
"Fans" is a bit strong. I prefer "sheep", since they'll buy into anything no matter how much it screws over everyone else. 
They are fully aware they are potentially supporting a system that f**ks over everyone who doesn't have as much money to piss away as them. Then they go about defending it. Conservative Republicans Jr. It's all about the man in the custom suit and platinum cuff links.
Last edited by PrecisionCrab on Thu Dec 20, 2012 4:20 am; edited 1 time in total |
||||||
|
||||||
|
PrecisionCrab
Posts: 215 |
|
|||||
And therein lies my point. It's under lock-and-key. If somebody posts numbers, or tells you a launch was successful with a gross estimate, then they're lying to you. Simple as that. So no. AoA's latest endeavors weren't "successful." Because it came from the mouth of a company head. The only real way to know estimates and finances is through a court order. EDIT: In any case, you guys continue on with your debate. I've said what I needed to say - sometimes more than once. I'm sleepy. |
||||||
|
||||||
tuxedocat
 Posts: 2183 |
|
|||||
Then basically, you are supporting exactly what Zac DID say? Because Zac seemed to be irritated that some one was speculating on the stuff that was "under lock-and-key", as YOU said. ....? 
|
||||||
|
||||||
|
Zac
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
|
|||||
Thanks for this. Your punk rock attitude has blown my mind. HACK THE PLANET In all seriousness I never said to blindly trust whatever the interviewee said, I said - and I think I said this pretty clearly - that "dude on forums" likely isn't in a position of actual authority where he can state definitively whether or not this particular anime show was within the acceptable margin of profit or not. And that it's kind of irresponsible to say "THIS SHOW DID NOT MEET THIS COMPANY'S BOTTOM LINE" without actually knowing what the bottom line was at the time or knowing anything at all beyond some Oricon numbers. |
||||||
|
||||||
|
rarirurero
Posts: 54 |
|
|||||
In terms of Europe, at least parts of Europe, content translated into English has broader appeal than only to countries with English as a recognized national language. Aniplex is leaving money on the table if the sole reason they aren't trying their Aniplex-to-consumer model outside of R1/A is that other languages exist. The Internet has hastened the spread of sci-fi style "English is spoken all over the galaxy"-societies. Even before that cable television ensured that more or less all of my entertainment, from age 6, has been imported content from the English-speaking world. rarirurero drones on for a bit. No new ideas, click the spoiler tag if you have nothing else to do: spoiler[ Anecdotal evidence even suggests a tendency in my home city of Oslo, Norway, that a subset of youths have taken to speaking English amongst themselves, just because. Is this happening elsewhere in the world? Probably! I don't know how many units from R1/A, sold by merchants with international shipping, end up in other regions than US/Canada, (seeing as R1/A content isn't licensed for distrobution outside R1/A, I am not expecting to know any time soon) but I would wager that quite a few do. Speaking to Aniplex specifically, as none of the reputable merchants I know would ship to my native Norway, I was forced to go shopping for my Madoka Magika single-volumes on eBay, at the mercy of the least price-gaugey seller I could find. What I am trying to get at is I wish it was easier for content providers within gaming, video and others to make releases that haven't necessarily been tailored to each individual country/region available to the people that are willing to pay for them. I appreciate that regional licensing and localizing issues exist, I just wish they didn't.][/spoiler] |
||||||
|
||||||
Blood-
 Bargain Hunter Posts: 23888 |
|
|||||
|
@ rarirurero - hmm, you raise an interesting point. I wonder if any anime distrib has ever done any research into the viability of marketing English-language releases in non-UK Europe.
Although, paying for translated subtitles I don't think would cost a bomb. Provide subtitles in French, German, Spanish and Italian (for those specific national markets) and it seems to me you've got Europe pretty much covered off. I have a hard time believing that a English dubbed title would sell better in France than one that was subbed in French, but I guess you never know. Perhaps your assumption is more valid in those countries that don't speak one of the four languages above. |
||||||
|
||||||
Mr. sickVisionz
 Posts: 2173 |
|
|||||
|
I like how this has turned into a serious debate on whether or not random dude on the internet who self-admittedly has absolutely no clue as to what the financials of a company are, but swears that he knows the break even point and every the specifics on revenue streams.
I've always felt that the difference between someon ewho is ignorant and someone who is stupid is that the ignorant person simply doesn't know, and they admit that they don't know while the stupid person knows that they don't know, but acts as if not knowing makes them an expert and they proceed to drop completely erroneous information and "facts" left and right.
They aren't aiming for Joe Blow, the casual anime fan and the only market they care about expanding is the premium anime collector market, which likely includes importers and people who would import if they could at least get English subs. They are specifically serving the hardcore collector. They are like Mercedes or BMW. They aren't aiming to drop a Benz down to a sub-Jetta pricing to get more sales. Their goal is to make expensive luxury vehicles for people who value that and are willing to pay the premium for it. To keep with the car analogy, Aniplex does make something akin to the lower priced Benz but much like the car, it's still noticeably more expensive than your average car. They probably look at the Bakemonogatari release that's $150 and see that as the low entry version, considering that the import version was over $300.
No clue what a producer does, whether it be anime or music. |
||||||
|
||||||
|
Blood-
Bargain Hunter Posts: 23888 |
|
|||||
|
Ah, the wonderful luxury car model again. How I love it so. Let's be clear what AoA does. They don't sell Mercedes, BMWs or Ferraris at Mercedes, BMW or Ferrari prices. They sell Mercedes, BMWs and Ferraris at - in the case of Bakemonogatari, for example - about 200% more than the normal market price of a Mercedes, BMW or Ferrari. Luxury car analogists never seem to hoist that part on board. If NISA had gotten Bake, I'd be paying a normal BMW price for that BMW. However, because AoA is the dealership, I get to pay 200% more than a BMW normally costs in North America. I would never ask a company to sell a luxury item at no-name brand prices, but I don't think I'm out of line in asking them to sell that luxury item at the normal luxury item cost, not 200% higher than the normal luxury item cost. Sorry for being so repetitive, but I'm kinda hoping to put this luxury car nonsense to rest (and yes, I realize that is impossible).
You are correct in your assertion, however, that they are only targeting the hardcore collector market and no one else. As for what a producer does: he or she makes something happen. Naturally, the creative team (of which a good producer can be an important part) is responsible for how something turns out, but without a producer they would never get a chance to create anything in the first place. My point is that SpacemanHardy vastly under-estimates the role that Aniplex plays in the creation of the shows that it produces. I'm not a fan of AoA's pricing strategy, but I'm generally a big fan of the shows that Aniplex brings out. That's a big reason why I don't like AoA's prices: if Aniplex didn't make so many shows I want to own, I wouldn't have to care what AoA charged. |
||||||
|
||||||
|
dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
|
|||||
Uh-huh. I never used the word "facts", so it is very naughty of you to be putting that word in quotation marks. What I did do was express surprise that lessons were supposedly learnt from Anime no Chikara with respect to Guilty Crown, and I wondered which lessons they were. Then in my next few posts I spoke of how Guilty Crown was the odd one out when compared to PMMM and Ano Hana*. My assumption on the Oricon figures being mostly accurate in terms of overall sales was wrong, and I didn't include international licenses, and I've admitted to those mistakes. But using Justin's figure for the break-even point of the average-budget show was perfectly reasonable, and so is the assumption that the show's budget was higher than average. I challenge anyone to watch Guilty Crown - even just an episode or two - and tell me that - with the slick visuals and the insert songs - the budget wasn't at least above average. Finally, I will say that if you thought you were being clever with your thinly-veiled insult, well, you weren't. * It's like if the president of New Line Cinema was talking about their past successes and mentioned The Golden Compass in the same breath as Lord of the Rings and A Nightmare on Elm Street. |
||||||
|
||||||
Draneor
 Posts: 355 |
|
|||||
Justin's three part series also made clear there are many other sources of revenue for an anime production than just disc sales--sources we don't get data on. Perhaps GC sold more rentals or character merch than AnoHana--we can only speculate. In that Aniplex has access to the big picture (and all the data), and we have access to a very small part of it--if they say it was a success I see no reason to doubt it. |
||||||
|
||||||
|
Mr. sickVisionz
Posts: 2173 |
|
|||||
You know nothing of the costs but swear that means you know about the costs and all related revenue streams to accurately say whether or not it was a success. We actually know what movies costs and what they make at the box office so that analogy is bunk. But assuming we didn't, it'd be more like Marvel saying X-Men, Spider-man, and Avengers were successful and you saying X-men couldn't have been successful because it didn't gross as much as some of the top grossing films of all time. A series doesn't have to put up Madoka numbers in order to be a success. |
||||||
|
||||||
|
dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
|
|||||
I never said or implied that it had to. You have missed the point of what I was saying, which is that even if we take Natsume's word that Guilty Crown was successful, it isn't in the same league as either of the other two shows he mentioned. That's why I used example of New Line Cinema, as The Golden Compass was successful but nowhere near the standout performers that the other two movie franchises I listed were. The fact that we know the budgets of movies but not Anime is beside the point as far as my example is concerned. I'm going to bed, so it will be a while before I can respond to any posts aimed my way. Ciao. |
||||||
|
||||||
|
samuelp
Industry Insider
Posts: 2238 Location: San Antonio, USA |
|
|||||
|
I know numbers from actual production committees now, and one thing that forum dwellers should realize that justin maybe didn't make so clear in his detailed article, but "who makes money" in a production committee is a far more complex calculation than simply %investment = %return.
Let's give a simplified example to illustrate what I mean: Lets say a production committee is formed from three companies Domestic Production Company A: 50% of budget Music Company B: 25% of budget TV Station and Int. Rights Sales Company C: 25% of budget When the committee is formed, they decide that A gets to make and sell the DVD/Blurays and merchandise in Japan, B gets to sell the op and ed CDs and soundtracks workwide, and C gets to air the show on TV and sell the licensing rights to the world. Now the simplistic way people think is that all the revenue from these different methods go back to the committee, and in the end the companies split up the revenue 2/1/1, but this is NOT how the agreements work. A more realistic deal is that Company A takes 25% of package goods sales, original creators get 15%, committee gets 60% after company A's expenses. Company B takes 80% of sales, committee gets 20% after expenses... Company C gets a flat fee for the TV airing, gets to keep 90% of ad revenue, keeps 30% of overseas licensing sales and the committee gets the rest minus 10% for original creators... I.e. the partner companies take money off the front end, and the committee only gets money above and beyond the cost level for the partners. So it's far more complex to figure out who is profiting and who is losing money than just to do a calculation of disc sales... It's possible most members of the committee are profiting while just 1 is losing a ton of money... And just because figure sales might be sky high, only a small portion of that money might actually go back to actually offset the animation budget. |
||||||
|
||||||
|
Blood-
Bargain Hunter Posts: 23888 |
|
|||||
|
@samuelp - very interesting insight on how production companies split revenues, thanks!
|
||||||
|
||||||
|
Crisha
Moderator
 Posts: 4290 |
|
|||||
|
I get the impression that PrecisionCrab gets a hard-on from every AoA hate post he makes and practices "self-infatuated masturbation"... vigorously. I can't take any of your points seriously even if there's a rational debate to be had.
It's one thing to be skeptical. It's another thing to claim "THEY'RE ALWAYS LYING TO YOU! YOU CAN'T TRUST ONE BLEEPING WORD THEY SAY! CONSPIRACY!!" And thanks for the post, samuelp. Very interesting to know. |
||||||
|
||||||
 |
All times are GMT - 5 Hours |
|
|
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group