Forum - View topicElfen Lied (TV).
|
Goto page Previous |
| Author | Message | |||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
|
dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
|
|||||||
Oh, she spoiler[was absolutely being molested and likely raped on multiple occasions as well.] But that was all before the show started.
If you want to call it trash then fine, that's your opinion. And even though I think you're wrong you still have the right to hold that opinion. But you cannot call it forgettable. If it truly was forgettable then you wouldn't even remember it, let alone harbour such negative feelings towards it. And look at all the people who have remembered the show; fourteen pages of discussion is most certainly not "forgettable". With its music, opening and closing credits, that jaw-dropping opening seven minutes, and shockingly violent scenes, to claim that the show was forgettable is absolutely ludicrous. The real forgettable shows are so bland and mediocre you struggle to remember even the most simplest details. Elfen Lied was a lot of things but - characters aside - bland was not one of them. |
||||||||
|
||||||||
|
Animegomaniac
Posts: 4085 |
|
|||||||
|
Can I call it "regrettable" as it was never finished?
I'm fine with its violence, its luridness, its air of hopelessness -all good points to be sure?- but its plot? That was trash. It's sad that even with all its positives, the show just sits there, unwilling to say anything objective regarding the subject named Lucy. "Is she a villain?" "Well..." "So she's a hero?" "Not really?" "Well, what's her good points?" "Nyu?" Not the alternate personality, that's just a wordless response. Still, I like her more than Hellsing OVA Alucard who's violent, psychotic and unbeatable with new powers that defy ... losing. So when the TV series gets to its ending, I have no idea how I'm suppose to feel about it; spoiler["Oh, good, she's back ... or is it more like the return of a serial killer, she's back? Come on, show, help me out here..."] |
||||||||
|
||||||||
|
dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
|
|||||||
Sure. Though I've heard that the manga goes into some weird territory and then after that gets plain bizarre, so who knows if the anime would have turned out okay had it adapted the entirety of the manga? |
||||||||
|
||||||||
nobahn
 Subscriber Posts: 5120 |
|
|||||||
To each her own, of course; but personally, I like open-ended endings -- it forces me to think about the piece even more. That was a part of my reasoning for initiating this thread. |
||||||||
|
||||||||
ChibiKangaroo
 Posts: 2941 |
|
|||||||
|
Jeez this thread is still going? I figured it was a troll thread so I never even looked at it. I only saw Elfen Lied one time. I don't intend to see it again. For me, it was not much more than violence porn. It was kind of like Higurashi but with less interesting characters and setting. The characters in both shows were sort of psychotic, but at least in Higurashi they cycled the psychosis around enough so it was fun guessing who was insane and who wasn't. Elfen Lied seemed more like a bunch of girls who were all insane constantly going on killing rampages.
|
||||||||
|
||||||||
|
dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
|
|||||||
|
^
But there were good reasons why the Diclonius were insane. |
||||||||
|
||||||||
|
Animegomaniac
Posts: 4085 |
|
|||||||
Horns that looked like cat ears? The pink hair and red eyes? That's what Nana had in common with her fellow Dicloni. But she's not just good, she's downright noble. Her usage in the plot always unnerved me. She's not there as a "control", to show what Lucy could have been because it's implied the kindness from one person in the face of being tortured caused Nana to turn out the way she did while Lucy became a killer because birds gotta fly, Dicloni gotta kill all humans. If Dicloni evolved in a way to hate humans from birth, with their parents as their first kills, then Nana naturally should have only been kind to Doctor Kurama at best. Oh god, is it an ingrained hatred for human's ability to love and their lack? Nana's love for one man led to her empathy for all mankind ... including the parts that were trying to torture her and kill her. I don't think that's right since it flies in the face of the "mother/child" bond that pushes evolution along in the first place, so maybe it's just easier for them to kill rather than eat all their peas.
How is it an open ending when they intended to make more episodes? But even looking at what is there, it's supposed to be an actual "Lady or the tiger" ending where you, the viewer, has to decide the outcome. But my point is that the show never came down on framing the "lady or tiger" question properly. What do you get: Lucy, the mutated killer of humanity or Nyu, the potential mutated killer of humanity? Or the reformed Lucy or Nyu who gave into her instincts? And that still doesn't change who she was, you know, the spoiler[killer of Kohta's family]. The manga took the issue in the right direction with her price of redemption {spoiler[Her death? Oh, that's just the beginning...]} but here, most of the key issues were settled; Not only was there no cost of redemption, there was no need somehow. |
||||||||
|
||||||||
Kruszer
 Posts: 7985 Location: Minnesota, USA |
|
|||||||
|
^More like they were insane because they spoiler[were solitarily confined since birth or early childhood with no human contact other than nasty people hurting and torturing them in the name of "experimentation" 24-7 for all of their known lives. That would be one possibility. Either that or they go nuts from any other multitude of reasons, like being ostracized for being different, chemical imbalances in the brain, becoming power drunk and developing megalomania, or accidental misuse of their potentially deadly new power (killing the family perhaps) resulting in severe trauma.] Crazy may be the destination, but there are lots of roads to take to get there in their situation.
I wouldn't exactly call Nana a poster girl of sanity either spoiler[she has her moments of instability herself when she looks like she's on the edge. Although, she is less of a nutbar than the rest of them, that's for sure.] |
||||||||
|
||||||||
|
Slappydappy
Posts: 18 |
|
|||||||
|
You're right, I remember the pointless gore, nudity, and "vectors" and stuff. I don't remember any characters, plot, or story, outside of some girl with cat ears or something.
|
||||||||
|
||||||||
|
nobahn
Subscriber Posts: 5120 |
|
|||||||
At the risk of sounding snarky -- it is not my intention to sound that way at all -- may I trouble you to cite a source for your statement? In my -- very humble -- opinion, I do not think that the director ever intended to do a 2nd season. |
||||||||
|
||||||||
|
Animegomaniac
Posts: 4085 |
|
|||||||
It was a failure in Japan, cite source, and a success in the US, cite source, but it still had an OVA episode, cite source, and unless anyone comes out and screams "I don't want to do anymore!", anime creative teams usually are open to doing more episodes. Cite source. Never claimed to be humble. Cite source. Also, it's not up to the director, it's up to the producer. Cite source. I could point to other series where they're partial adaptations but still have a closed ending? Or other single seasons where they end begging the audience or powers that be they'll get a second season? Elfen Lied took the easy way out and ended in the middle, not appearing too eager like Nyankoi but just enough wiggle room ... just in case. Cite source. Ok, that last one was me. You mean they were planning on it failing? Or you really want me to find an interview where some poor guy has to say "Well, it was a commercial failure but I really want to continue it"? |
||||||||
|
||||||||
|
nobahn
Subscriber Posts: 5120 |
|
|||||||
|
Animegomaniac--
If I am correctly reading between the lines, then you feel that that I was attempting to be snarky. C'est la vie! I am sorry that you evidently feel that way. |
||||||||
|
||||||||
LunarMoon
 Posts: 9 Location: Somewhere in the Green |
|
|||||||
You're complaining about the presence of moral ambiguity in Elfen Lied, when this is easily among the show's greatest strengths. Most well written antagonists tend to be ambiguous in their morality. Would you rather the show tell the audience in explicit detail who the "Good Guy" and who the "Bad Guy" was, in the fashion of some simplistic Saturday Morning Cartoon?
Lucy and Kurama were among the two most complex and well characterized anime villains in the mediums.
Only long running shonens and Western sitcoms operate on this horrific logic, as the plot is literally written as the author proceeds (until it eventually runs dry and gets cancelled). Most anime shows are planned as either one or two cour installments (13 or 24-26 episodes), with a clear beginning and ending established before the show even airs. This is why so many as them can end with the main character's death.
I'm curious as to how. The protagonist has telekinesis as a power. Why wouldn't she decapitate and disarm her opponents? Elfen Lied is a pretty dark and cynical story on a fundamental level, about how inhumane human beings can actually be. Never mind all of the diclonius experimentation, which absolutely needs to make its way into the final product. Giving its premise to 4Kids and editing it into some sort of G-rated cartoon would seem to be an impossible, and purposeless, task. |
||||||||
|
||||||||
 |
All times are GMT - 5 Hours |
|
|
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group