Forum - View topicAre 12/13 episode series just ads for the manga?
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Kruszer
 Posts: 7985 Location: Minnesota, USA |
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Aquarian Age-Sign for Evolution (The story revolves around a romance spoiler[and a personality crisis that stems from it], both are resolved well.)
Baccano (I think this one covered all its bases nicely.) Beyond the Boundary (Arguably, it's open for a sequel but also fine as is.) Bunny Drop (There is more manga, but it's better off ending here....) Destiny of the Shrine Maidens (This is complete with that little scee at the end spoiler[where the two girls reunite in another life and remember]) Haibane Renmei (Already covered above.) Heaven's Memo Pad (This ended in a good spot and was always fairly arc based with no overall story other than the two main characters getting closer.) Kemonozume (spoiler[This ends nicely with the star crossed couple saying together and the vilain being defeated.]) Koi Kaze (spoiler[Ends with the two siblings giving in to their feeling for each other and doing the deed.]) Kurenai (spoiler[Shinkuro completes his job and Murasaki's family situation is resolved for the better.]) Myself, Yourself (spoiler[The romance and the characters psychological issues are resolved.]) REC (Hell, It's 10 mini episodes and does the Job!) Rideback (spoiler[The larger issue of the government being corrupt is still kinda there but this was more about Rin and her past trauma which was able to resolve through the Fuego and the show's events.]) Rumbling Hearts (The girl I wanted to see the MC end up with got him, so I have no complaints. And if you liked the other girl there's an OVA for that.) Tokyo Magnitude 8.0 (spoiler[Those who survived the disaster make it home to their families and grieve for what they've lost.]) Angel Beats (spoiler[Each character resolves their regrets and moves with the main character staying to guide others.]) Anohana (spoiler[The group of estranged friends is successfully reunited, with the possibility of some of those friendships evolving into romance and a ghost in laid to rest.]) Another (spoiler[The calamity for that year is stopped and the "extra"'s identity discovered, with plans on how to stop it left for the next cursed class. Although there were heavy casualties.]) Black Heaven (The MCs life issues are straightened away and the aliens are defeated with the power of metal music.) Dusk Maiden of Amnesia (spoiler[The romance gets resolved in a positive manner, which I can't help but be happy about, even though in this case it would have been better for everyone if Youko didn't return, and just passed on.]) Ef-A Tale of Memories/Ef-A Tale of Melodies (All character romances see resolutions.) Innocent Venus (Concludes decently if I remember right.) Inu X Boku: Secret Service (spoiler[Ririchiro is able to become a better person and develops a romance with Soshi]) Lunar Legend Tsukihime (Not the ending from the game I would have liked to see but it was a definite conclusion.) Midori Days (the manga is actually longer but this removes a lot of unnecessary elements and the ending is the same for both) Requiem From the Darkness (The author spoiler[writes his book of stories and even makes some ghoulish friends and helps foil an evil plot along the way. Good stuff.]) School Days (Quality is arguable, but it is decidedly complete) Serial Experiments Lain (Concludes successfully, if cryptically spoiler[with Lain resolving her self confidence and self-identity issues]) Sola (I honestly had low expectations for this, but wow did this prove to have a lot more depth than I thought. spoiler[Wasn't expecting to have two of the cast fight to the death over the MC who isn't even a person, but rather a paper shikigami.]) Starship Operators (This one also resolves itself fairly well in a way I wasn't expecting.) True Tears (spoiler[The guy makes a choice between the two women.]) We Without Wings (Arguable, but if we say the character'sspoiler[MPD was the main struggle then it's resolved.]) Yosuga no Sora (All the main ladies were covered, including an...unexpected one) Zakuro (spoiler[The villain is defeated and the guys all get the girls. I can't ask for much more here other than the villain to have died, but instead he got reformed and possible girlfriend too, which isn't really bad.]) Chaos Head (Pathetic loser, Takumi, goes from zero to hero by saving the city from a madman and gets Rimi.) Coyote Ragtime Show (Dispite all the wackyness, this is actually a great sci-fi adventure with the bonus of having spoiler[the added depth of Mister's father-like relationship with his deceased best friend's daughter and how she evolves from hating him to them becoming like a real family themselves.]) Please Teacher (This has a decent relationship and nice resolution.) Rin-Daughters of Mnemosyne (Despite rampant sex and graphic violence, manages to to tell decent story along the way.) Last edited by Kruszer on Mon Jan 26, 2015 9:54 pm; edited 7 times in total |
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nobahn
 Subscriber Posts: 5120 |
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Okay, my bad
I didn't realize that you would literally list series without any explanations. I'll let it slide Kruszer; but only this one time. |
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Kruszer
Posts: 7985 Location: Minnesota, USA |
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I can write stuff for the rest of them, no problem, it'll just take a bit of time.
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nobahn
Subscriber Posts: 5120 |
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^
Thank you. |
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yuna49
 Posts: 3804 |
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I find that comment stunning from someone as active here as you, Touma. You really haven't watched anything made in the past few years? I certainly watch less now than I did a few years ago, too, but I can usually find a couple of series every season to follow. As I said earlier, I don't think the transition to 11-13 episode series has much to do with relying more on anime to sell manga. That development has largely been driven by economics. The recession brought on some serious belt-tightening by production committees, and one adaptation was to hedge their bets more by producing shorter series. Ones that do well will often get another cour, the rest are dropped by the wayside. |
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nobahn
Subscriber Posts: 5120 |
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Likewise, I, too, am very surprised. True, separating the wheat from the chaff can be somewhat tedious..... |
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Alan45
 Village Elder Posts: 9853 Location: Virginia |
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nbahn wrote:
To each his own, but I don't find it so. Read the blurbs and look at the associated art, read the reviews and based on that watch a few episodes, it all sorts out each season with a minimum of fuss. In fact it is part of the fun. I find the original question of this thread to be unnecessarily cynical. All televised anime is commercial. It is all selling something. Anime is expensive to make and has to be funded somehow. Long running children's shows in prime time are ad supported. The late night anime may be selling the source material, merchandise, or the soon the be released DVDs and Blu-rays or all of that. And yes, the people doing the funding will have some influence on the product. However, there is seldom a direct relationship between the method of funding and the quality of the show. Good writers and directors will produce good shows in spite of the restrictions. The fact that anime has to "sing for its supper" probably helps produce good shows. Working within commercial and genre limits can help creativity if you have a good team. Art for its own sake is frequently self indulgent and usually accessible only to the privileged few. |
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Spotlesseden
Posts: 3514 Location: earth |
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looks like the topic changed to name the anime that's not based on manga or LN.
the question was this. Of course there are anime that are not just ads for manga or LN, but most of them they are just ads in my opinion. "Do you guys think they're just ads for the mangas or light novels they're based out of or is that a given? " |
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Redbeard 101
Oscar the Grouch
Forums Superstar  Posts: 16939 |
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Yes. No. Wait....that's confusing isn't it? I guess I'll explain.
Let's for a moment assume we're just talking about 12/13 episode series based on a manga. Forget about series based on visual novels or those with no previous adaptation. I think that series can at times be a sort of ad, or draw, for the original manga it comes from. Certainly a company would like people to check out the manga and hopefully get more into the series. And thus keep supporting it and make it profitable. I however do not think 12/13 episodes series are simply an ad for the manga. I also do not think they are incapable of being a good series with depth. There are countless examples with many given already here, and many not given. Wanna toss a shout out to Kino's Journey. Word. I think a 12/13 episodes series needs to prioritize better than a 24-26 episode series. They don't have the luxury of filler or wasting time. They need to maximize their time. Then again a good 12/13 episode series won't have that filler a 24 episode series will more than likely have so sometimes the shorter length is a blessing. I do think though unfortunately 12/13 episode series do suffer from trying to rush too much too quickly. When based on manga they can try to cram too much into those episodes. And then you're lacking character development and plot development. I again don't think this is a guarantee. Plus sometimes a 12/13 episode series can work perfectly for some manga. A particular arc might only provide 4-6 episodes worth of material. Then you can cover 2 arcs and then move on to "season 2" to cover the next few arcs. From a financial stand point 12/13 episode series also provide a lower financial risk. Especially with a dub. In the past before the bubble broke 24 episode series outnumbered 12/13 episode series like 3-1. Now it's reversed. Why? They're less of a financial risk and a well selling one can now be more profitable. If season 1/part 1 sells well a company knows it's worth it to make a season 2/part 2. If it doesn't sell well you're out less money than what it would cost to due a 24-26 episode series. Anyways these are just some of the random musings going on through my head. |
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Spotlesseden
Posts: 3514 Location: earth |
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few example doesn't matter. Most anime when you look at the scripts, you will know there is no way in hell that the dvd/bluray sales are going t cover the production and the TV broadcast fee. There are like 20+ anime per season. They needs to sell cards, toys, manga, or LN to atleat try to make the money back. 500 blurays are not going to cut it.
You can't just name one or two example per season. You have to name atleast 10 anime per season for your examples to have any statistical value. exception is meaningless in this topic. I hate people use exception to make argument because stats tell them another story. "Bills Gates and Mark Zuckerberg dropped out of college, so you don't need to go to college" it doesn't matter if average college Cong makes more money that average higher schoolers. |
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Touma
 Posts: 2651 Location: Colorado, USA |
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Please note that I never said that I cannot find anything to watch, only that I have not watched anything made in the last few years. I feel no need to discuss my viewing habits, or the reasons for them, except to clearly state that I am not saying anything negative about the quality of current anime. I did a bit of research and it seems that the most recent thing that I have watched is the first season of Kamisama Kiss, which aired at the end of 2012. That is relevant here because when I wrote about it in the "What are you watching right now? Why?" thread I said that it seemed like an advertisement for the manga, and that was before this thread started. But even though it felt like an ad I still enjoyed watching the anime. I have actually watched it a second time since then and liked it even more. {EDIT: Please don't over-quote. Thanks. ~ Psycho 101} |
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Animegomaniac
Posts: 4089 |
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Are one cour series just ads? As opposed to what? Just artistic statements, just genuine desires to see a work adapted or just to tell a story?
Anime originals are ads for the studio. VG adaptations are ads for the game and so on and on. Kanon (2006) is an ad for that restaurant chain that financed it and not the game or the studio. Anime is that scene from Spaceballs; It's why a number of them are called "Title: The Animation" so they can separate it from "Title: The Body Pillow" for stores. It's not bad, it's just something you have to accept. Some examples where the line is blurred at what's being sold for various reasons: FMA: Brotherhood. I honestly think someone just wanted to see the whole thing animated. Kanon (2006). Seeing how it was financed in part by the restaurant chain after people wanted to see it done thanks to Air the TV, it's a bit complex. Kill La Kill. Yes, this is what Studio Trigger can do. Next time, maybe they'll animate something. Sailor Moon Crystal. Any ideas? It's Sailor Moon, you don't need a new show for merchandising potential and if it was done for the show itself, it should look better. "Sailor Moon: The Search for more Money"? Dragon Ball Z Kai: Now with 20% less stuff you love and 20 less stuff you hate! Those Marvel animes that just disappeared. Wow, those... happened. |
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Yause
Posts: 97 |
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Are they just advertisements? That's an oversimplification.
It's true that the main impetus for many adaptations is to promote source material. A high-rung investor on the project is often a manga publisher. However, that's mainly context for a chunk of the funds, and it ignores other motivation from the anime production/video publishing side (the studios and DVD/BD publishers, who take a risk on the show but don't directly gain from manga sales). Manga promotion establishes an overarching purpose, but there are those who rely on the success of the show in and of itself. The best examples would be multiple seasons. After the first run, there's much less incentive for anyone to continue the show as promotion for manga because the title has either flopped or established a high level of popularity that's unlikely to go much higher (hence the manga publisher's money would be better spent trying to light a fire under the next potential hit). Sequels are really only possible if the anime can produce profit on its own. |
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ikillchicken
 Posts: 7272 Location: Vancouver |
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There's nothing inherently wrong with the 12/13 episode format. There are tons of great, amazing shows of that length. In my experience though it does actually seem like the bulk of good 12/13 episode shows are not adaptations. So yeah, you're certainly not wrong in general in what you're saying. I think, probably, it has more to do with the type of story structure you find in most serialized manga though than the 12/13 episode format itself. Rarely if ever do you see ongoing serialized manga short enough to fit comfortably into that runtime. It's not just sheer length either. It's an issue of story structure. Most ongoing serialized manga tends to be written with the assumption that they have essentially as much time as they need (which, barring cancellation, they essentially do). Thus the story structure tends to be very loose, jumping around, laying out a lot of characters even before doing a lot with them, etc. (Compare this to movies which are much more structured precisely because they have to ft their story neatly into a 2 hour runtime). That's fine if you indeed do have all the time you need. But as soon as you start trying to chop off a small chunk of that story and have it stand alone it leads to trouble. And given anime adaptations' extreme hesitation towards making drastic changes from the source that tends to lead to a whole lot of anime that do not in any way feel like complete or stand-alone works. Even if you try to cut the filler and squeeze in as much as possible, your story still ends up feeling like a mere introductory arc because, well, it is. Short of a radical shakeup, the first 2/3rds of your show will usually be just the very preliminary setup arc with the first major (usually inconclusive) confrontation as the last 3rd. 26 episodes definitely does make it a lot more plausible to move into the real meat of the story. I find too, if a show does end without really offering a conclusive ending, that's at least a whole lot more tolerable after 26 episodes. It's a whole lot easier to make the show feel like, while this clearly isn't the end, you've at least reached a decent breaking point.
No, they aren't. Not in a remotely similar way anyhow. I suppose original productions may "advertize" in the extremely general sense that if a studio does good work people will have a high opinion of them and be more likely to watch their shows/hire them for projects in the future. But that's a completely secondary goal. Studios obviously don't create original productions primarily to "advertise" themselves. They create them to turn a profit in the short term. They do this in the case of original productions on sales of the show itself. Hence, the show really needs to stand on its own because the show is all there is. With a lot of adaptations though, it's a distinctly different business model. The goal is never really to primarily make money off the anime they create. The anime exists primarily to increase visibility of the source material. Whether the anime really stands alone as a complete work is irrelevant. It might. But all it needs to do from a business perspective is create interest among people who see it and think they'd like to see more and thus start reading the manga. That's where the real profit is. This is the distinction between shows that are just shows and shows that exist mainly as ads for something else. |
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Tempest_Wing
Posts: 305 |
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I don't think your spoiler for Lain was quiiiite right. Doesnt she spoiler[become god at the end?] |
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