| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
|
|
MiniMarps
Joined: 08 Mar 2022
Posts: 59
|
 Posted: Fri Oct 06, 2023 10:28 pm
|
 |
|
|
Crunchyroll's subs have always been very inconsistent in their quality. I can think of examples as far back as 2017 (Gabriel DropOut) and as recent as last season (Bang Dream) wherein the subs felt like they were put together by a sleep-deprived college student in under an hour.
Hidive isn't always perfect either, but in my experience, I think it's less common over there.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
Glordit
Joined: 11 Sep 2020
Posts: 483
|
|
Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2023 12:25 am
|
|
|
| MiniMarps wrote: | | Crunchyroll's subs have always been very inconsistent in their quality. I can think of examples as far back as 2017 (Gabriel DropOut) and as recent as last season (Bang Dream) wherein the subs felt like they were put together by a sleep-deprived college student in under an hour.
Hidive isn't always perfect either, but in my experience, I think it's less common over there. |
I see about the same number of complaints about Hidives subs. In recent memory people complained about The Dangers in My Heart and there was a more recent show too which had some changes.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
Zalis116
Moderator
Joined: 31 Mar 2005
Posts: 6871
Location: Kazune City
|
|
Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2023 12:27 am
|
|
|
| unready wrote: | |
If Sony/Funimation/Crunchyroll is going to use machine translation, especially expanding the use going forward, I think I foresee the return of fansubs. Black markets are created when open markets can't or won't serve their customers. |
I'd think that fan-corrected versions of bad/machine translations would be more likely to crop up. True from-scratch fanmade subtitles would still be too slow to compete, since using the official subs (even if they're poor quality) would still provide subtitle timings and a basic idea of what's going on.
As for "markets not serving customers," a plurality of visitors to current pirate streaming sites come from the US (i.e. a place without major regional availability barriers), and they largely watch the exact same shows and subtitles that're on legal sites. That's more of a "wanting free stuff" issue than a "service problem."
| ScruffyKiwi wrote: | | It would be interesting to know just how many shows use licensor provided subs. |
In addition to the aspects Paulchaested pointed out above, the main dialogue font is another good indication. CR's in-house subs use Trebuchet MS, while subs in Arial tend to come from elsewhere, as seen with this series and shows from Aniplex and Sunrise.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
AdamW
 Subscriber
Joined: 05 Jan 2018
Posts: 19
|
|
Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2023 11:35 am
|
|
|
|
"Ani-One Asia, an anime streaming company in Southeast Asia, also licensed this anime, and episode 1 is still available in its region with different English subtitles with less errors."
* fewer errors
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
onpufan
Joined: 22 Dec 2022
Posts: 125
|
|
Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2023 12:05 pm
|
|
|
| Meongantuk wrote: | | I only hear speculations, but it's strange that only Crunchy's English sub for this anime gpt affected, Paradox Live's sub which also from Avex is fine, other language subs for Yuzuki are fine, and there's Ani-One's english sub also doesn't have the same problem. |
I think that's pretty standard? 99 times out of 100 whenever there's complaints about subtitle quality or localization changes and censorship I check out the Spanish version (if there is one) and none of the issues people are talking about are present there.
| garfield15 wrote: | | This is actually a surprise to me as the subs have to be extremely poor in order to have people universally complain about them to this extent. Usually, if anything, pointing out sub mistakes just has other people say deal with it. |
I think subtitling errors only get dismissed if they're viewed as localization/political complaints, like the social distancing line in Kaguya-Sama that some industry people tried to stand behind before it was eventually fixed by Aniplex of America. Since this involves machine translation, industry folks are more likely to rally behind it initially since they disagree with the use of machine translation in the industry since it affects their own jobs.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
Egan Loo
Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Posts: 1320
|
|
Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2023 7:26 pm
|
|
|
| onpufan wrote: |
| garfield15 wrote: | | This is actually a surprise to me as the subs have to be extremely poor in order to have people universally complain about them to this extent. Usually, if anything, pointing out sub mistakes just has other people say deal with it. |
I think subtitling errors only get dismissed if they're viewed as localization/political complaints, like the social distancing line in Kaguya-Sama that some industry people tried to stand behind before it was eventually fixed by Aniplex of America. Since this involves machine translation, industry folks are more likely to rally behind it initially since they disagree with the use of machine translation in the industry since it affects their own jobs. |
Do you think one line (or a couple of lines) is comparable to an episode rife with errors throughout, including several sentences each with multiple errors?
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
juaifan
Joined: 20 Mar 2021
Posts: 117
|
|
Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2023 9:41 pm
|
|
|
| MiniMarps wrote: | | Crunchyroll's subs have always been very inconsistent in their quality. I can think of examples as far back as 2017 (Gabriel DropOut) and as recent as last season (Bang Dream) wherein the subs felt like they were put together by a sleep-deprived college student in under an hour. |
My wife used to work as a translator for them up until 2013 and your description is an accurate depiction of what her work schedule was like. But that was over 10 years ago at this point.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
Minion X
Joined: 29 Nov 2015
Posts: 3
|
|
Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2023 6:39 am
|
|
|
|
I posted this on Twitter, but I thought I might as well repost it here.
Translator here with experience in subtitling, though not anime. Translators are normally freelancers and very frequently contracted through agencies. Unless Crunchyroll does things differently from Netflix and other streamers, they're not directly involved in the process. The translation, proofreading and QA is done as a package deal, so this is on the head of the translator or agency they contracted. Subtitling agencies often use their own online platforms, and some of the ones I work with even have integrated "translation support" features that give the translator the opportunity to insert a machine translation in case it saves time. Time is premium in streaming, and the reason why something this egrerious slipped throuh quality assurance is likely very tight deadlines. As to why a supposed professional would submit something like this, the translation industry has issues with people making up credentials or simply stealing them from real translators and using machine translations to try and defraud agencies. When an agency is handling simultaneously handling multiple shows and movies that need to be translated into dozens of languages, they sometimes succeed.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
SDnekojin
Joined: 07 Dec 2006
Posts: 10
|
|
Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2023 11:02 pm
|
|
|
|
I'm guessing "is working with the licensor of the series" is probably the only confirmation we'll get that this is the Japanese company's fault.
As in: "We can't just fix them because they were handed to us by the studio."
I would love to hear all the embarrassing details on how this made it to the public and the exact wording Crunchy used to tell them "you screwed up," but it'll probably just get quietly fixed and we'll be expected to pretend it never happened.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
Sakurafire_
Joined: 01 Jun 2015
Posts: 64
|
|
Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2023 12:23 pm
|
|
|
|
Just goes to show that AI can't do shit. It was horrible and immediately obvious that it was a machine learned translation.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
paulchaested
Joined: 04 Oct 2016
Posts: 259
|
|
Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2023 12:33 pm
|
|
|
| SDnekojin wrote: | | I'm guessing "is working with the licensor of the series" is probably the only confirmation we'll get that this is the Japanese company's fault.
As in: "We can't just fix them because they were handed to us by the studio."
I would love to hear all the embarrassing details on how this made it to the public and the exact wording Crunchy used to tell them "you screwed up," but it'll probably just get quietly fixed and we'll be expected to pretend it never happened. |
At this point, I don't think really matters anymore if the publisher being at fault is a proven fact. ANN got their little potshot against CR and a handful of people and anitubers who read the initial article by ANN are probably dead set on running with the general idea that CR is the culprit of this mess and won't bother to check for any updates. That's why for any type of news, I usually wait for a week or two to see if there are any additional info or context before saying something about it. Admittedly, this whole fiasco could've been prevented if CR just delayed the release and/or if they made a statement about it but I imagined they would've pissed off Avex Pictures if they blamed them.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
ANN_Lynzee
ANN Executive Editor
Joined: 02 May 2011
Posts: 2948
Location: Email for assistance only
|
|
Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2023 2:35 pm
|
|
|
| paulchaested wrote: | |
At this point, I don't think really matters anymore if the publisher being at fault is a proven fact. ANN got their little potshot against CR and a handful of people and anitubers who read the initial article by ANN are probably dead set on running with the general idea that CR is the culprit of this mess and won't bother to check for any updates. That's why for any type of news, I usually wait for a week or two to see if there are any additional info or context before saying something about it. Admittedly, this whole fiasco could've been prevented if CR just delayed the release and/or if they made a statement about it but I imagined they would've pissed off Avex Pictures if they blamed them. |
...are you ok? Is there something about this article you feel is inaccurate or that the reporting is unwarranted?
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
Sakurafire_
Joined: 01 Jun 2015
Posts: 64
|
|
Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2023 2:43 pm
|
|
|
| paulchaested wrote: | | Admittedly, this whole fiasco could've been prevented if CR just delayed the release and/or if they made a statement about it but I imagined they would've pissed off Avex Pictures if they blamed them. |
If it's a simulcast, how would this feasibly work? The blame is solely on the production company and using machine learning for a translation. What I would love to see is an official statement from CR being more stringent with companies pulling this crap.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
Glordit
Joined: 11 Sep 2020
Posts: 483
|
|
Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2023 3:58 pm
|
|
|
| Sakurafire_ wrote: |
| paulchaested wrote: | | Admittedly, this whole fiasco could've been prevented if CR just delayed the release and/or if they made a statement about it but I imagined they would've pissed off Avex Pictures if they blamed them. |
If it's a simulcast, how would this feasibly work? The blame is solely on the production company and using machine learning for a translation. What I would love to see is an official statement from CR being more stringent with companies pulling this crap. |
CR's website is constantly having problems and causing delays. People would just think it's another day at CR.
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
harminia
Joined: 24 Aug 2015
Posts: 2004
Location: australia
|
|
Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2023 7:31 pm
|
|
|
|
Is there a consensus on the new subs? Are they good? Similar to Ani-One's subs?
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
